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Zealot vs Hammerdin; if and when to switch

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Enzio, Apr 16, 2015.

  1. Enzio

    Enzio IncGamers Member

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    So I've got this Zealot, just beat Act I nightmare, furthest I've ever been in the game. I created him with the goal of making a hammerdin, but heard zealot was better early on. Is there a good/better time to switch? I have an Insight/Holy Freeze mercy, for what that's worth.

    Also, since I'm completely untwinked/starting from 0, is either of those builds less item dependent than the other? I assumed the hammerdin was less item dependent because magic, but I'm new.
     
  2. maxicek

    maxicek Moderator Single Player

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    Hammerdin is less item dependant, but both are doable untwinked. With the Zealot you will need a decent weapon.

    As you are RWM, for the hammerdin all you need is Spirit in a 4os sword and a Paladin shield and off you go. The rest of the gear can be almost whatever you want.
     
  3. Cyrax

    Cyrax IncGamers Member

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    Depends on what kinda playstyle you like / can take.

    Personally i'd switch only a few lvls after getting the hammers. They are so powerful that you'll kill much faster. And since you're untwinked the difference will be even bigger. Downside is that even with insight you'll be needing lots of blues since your manapool is so small. You can counter this a bit by pumping synergies too instead of straight going for the hammers. But all in all you need lots of mana.

    So if you like to progress fast and can take swallowing lots of mana pots -> switch. If you don't like taking lots of potions, then hold on a bit until your manapool is a bit bigger and you may have some items that give mana or MPK.

    And to address the item depencency: Hammerdin is indeed less item dependent. Having said that, for the hammerdin to really shine you need enigma for positioning. Still, without it it's a powerful build.
     
  4. Username is not in use

    Username is not in use IncGamers Member

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    double spirit already gives huge manabonus, with insight you can cast probably forever
     
  5. GooberGrape

    GooberGrape IncGamers Member

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    I would wait to switch until after beating the maggot lair in Hell. That place suuuuuucks with Hammerdin.
     
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  6. maxicek

    maxicek Moderator Single Player

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    You don't need Enigma. You left click on the ground and run up to things until you stop, then press shift. Then release shift and repeat.
     
  7. Pb_pal

    Pb_pal IncGamers Member

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    Do not underestimate this post. This gets my vote as well, although you DO get 3 respecs so if it's your cup of tea, you can always spec back to a zealot for the Maggot Lair in Hell, and then spec back to hammers afterwards.
     
  8. maxicek

    maxicek Moderator Single Player

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    You could always just drop a few points in Zeal and have a high damage weapon on switch. You need a solution for Baal W2 anyway.
     
  9. Cyrax

    Cyrax IncGamers Member

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    Pretty sure i didn't say it's needed. It does however change gameplay in a big way. And for me it made the hammerdin much more enjoyable to have that teleport.
     
  10. srrw

    srrw IncGamers Member

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    Just buy teleport staff (shoppable from Normal Act III, Ormus) when in Maggot's Lair always teleport right from the entrance and you should be able to find lvl2 and lvl3 fairly fast. No need for respec's and such.

    Although I would also advice against playing a Hammedin without Enigma since it's a whole different (read: a lot worse) character.

    The other thing is Hammerdin is nowhere near as enjoyable to play through the game as a Zealot. Especially if you take your time at Hell Countess and find the runes for Oath or even Crescent Moon.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2015
  11. GooberGrape

    GooberGrape IncGamers Member

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    I actually use Holy Bolts vs Wave 2, they do decent damage vs undead. Worst case you can just namelock your merc and spam Holy Bolts at him while he tanks. I like Holy Bolts, I think they are cool.
     
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  12. pharphis

    pharphis IncGamers Site Pal

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    I would also add that 1 pt in redemption is preferable for most or all paladins, since it allows for corpse removal and a hefty boost to life/mana for each pack of monsters killed.
     
  13. maxicek

    maxicek Moderator Single Player

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    :p
     
  14. Cyrax

    Cyrax IncGamers Member

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    ...nevermind, accidentally hit the post button... Next post is what i wanted to say.
     
  15. Cyrax

    Cyrax IncGamers Member

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    If you're gonna quote me, then do it right. But apparently that's too difficult for some people.:p
     
  16. Enzio

    Enzio IncGamers Member

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    Thanks for all the replies so far, guys.

    Situation update: Noobs are terrible hammerdins. I respec'd to hammerdin and ran Nightmare Countess/Andariel, and...oy, I'm bad at this. The positioning required + hammers stopping when they hit walls = I spent so much time just running around trying to get Andariel in the right place to actually get hit by a hammer, that if I'm bothering that much with melee positioning I think I'm better off just being a zealot. I'm sure hammerdins are just as brilliant as everybody says they are (and maybe the Enigma really does make all the difference in the world), but I am awful at it, and more importantly, I didn't enjoy it. So back to the Zealot. (Edit: to be fair, though, those hammers do hit REALLY hard, especially considering how bad my gear is.)

    That being said, I know the Zealot needs (at least) a really good weapon. Given that I'm using RWM and I actually enjoy things like farming Countess for runes, what are some good Runewords for me to be throwing in weapons/armor/shields/helms as a Zealot, especially in the 40s and going forward (knowing which end game stuff to look forward to is great help as well, but most guides include that stuff, and at this point knowing how amazing that clvl 85 weapon is doesn't help much)?
     
  17. srrw

    srrw IncGamers Member

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    The first really good runeword would be Crescent Moon in a Phase Blade. Honor a in a high damage base be should do fine until you find Um. Use the cube recipe to roll 5 sockets. Ultimate goal is Grief Phase Blade or Death eth Berserker Axe.

    For armor look for Lionheart/Smoke/Duress runes. Rhyme shield until you find something better.

    You can also run NM Andariel for Butcher's Pupil, it will get you a long way. After that stop at NM Mephisto for HoZ/Shaftstop/Guillaume's etc.
     
  18. GooberGrape

    GooberGrape IncGamers Member

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    I like Oath Zerkers a lot. Baranar's Star is a solid choice for dealing with immunes, as is Gimmershred (yes you can melee with it). I seem to recall running a Heaven's Light back in the day too, CB owns. The nice thing about Fanazealots is you will hit max speed on just about anything, so experiment and have fun :)
     
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  19. SunsetVista

    SunsetVista IncGamers Member

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    I like Zealots better, too. I still haven't finished my Hammerdin.

    There aren't that many good runewords around lvl 40, most of them come into play much later. The only one I can think of at that level is Black (Thul + Io + Nef) for its crushing blow (which works better on lower player settings, great for bosses). My Holy Shock Zealot used a Headstriker for a long time since that was the best weapon I had found. For armor, the best is probably Lionheart (Hel + Lum + Fal). Oh, and Rhyme (Shael + Eth) in a shield for the Cannot Be Frozen mod.
     
  20. bodry

    bodry IncGamers Member

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    Eth Oath Small Crescent/Ettin Axe is the best for budget. Zerker is too rare to bother with, and doesnt get automatically 4 sockets. Nor does Ettin, but Ettin Axe doesnt look like a playtoy. :)

    The weapon ranking imo: Grief PB, eDeath Zerker, eBOTD Zerker, Oath Small Crescent/Ettin (Zerker meh), Stormlash, Azurewrath-Heaven's light.

    These are for one handed options. Note: Death Colossus Sword beats every one hander in terms of dps.

    Armor: Duress is a good option. Fortitude is the endgame equipment.

    Shield: Rhyme is good, but Sanctuary is better imo. Ultimate goal is PDiamond Herald of Zakarum.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2015

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