dpbaseball
Diabloii.Net Member
WW/trap? or WW pure
For my new pvp sin which would be the better pick?:undecided:
For my new pvp sin which would be the better pick?:undecided:
WW/trap? or WW pure
- Thread starter dpbaseball
- Start date
MysticDragon
Diabloii.Net Member
WW/Trapper.
Dennis_KoreanGuy
Diabloii.Net Member
WW. Just in spite of rodney.
joking, go with the hybrid.
joking, go with the hybrid.
Liquid_Evil
Diabloii.Net Member
Echoing the above.
Hybrid > Pure in this case.
Hybrid > Pure in this case.
wouldnt say so. a wwsin or 'ghost' relies at least as much on her traps as a hybrid, with the difference that a hybrid can use them in a more defensive way (and still inflict damage), which a ghost cant.
Of course WWsins use traps. But unlike ww/trappers, they use them only for the traplocking, where as ww/trappers use them for damaging the opponent as well.
mephiztophelez
Diabloii.Net Member
please don't think your dumb for asking questions. the dumb ones are the ones who think they know it all and go it alone.
traps have two uses, the obvious one is to inflict damage. perhaps the less obvious one is to combine a low damage trap with mindblast to keep an opponent in a Hit Recovery animation. the extreme example is to dump three lit-sentries and two Wake of Fire's under any zon with points in the dodge skills then wash a mindblast over their heads. they do a funky little "whoo, wa-ha" dance of d/a/e/hit-recovery animations.
as to which is better, bearing in mind i have 'talon on all my 'sin builds: ww/trap is a lot easier to win with than ww/kick.
the only things i really miss about my ww/kicker are the easy %dr (from points in fade) and the sight of people stacking lit-sorb against my mighty 1-252 damage traps (y iz druid cast FoH at me while i ww?). meh, the character is there, the gear has been shifted onto a ww/trap build which is, imho, a much simpler build to take into a pubby duel room and win with. at which point you loath yon FoH-when-whirled hammerdin.
whichever way you go: be prepared to lose, a lot, in your early days. ww characters are kind of tricky to control compared to, for example, a smiter. don't get discouraged by early defeats and sell off your gear, good hybrid/ww gear is hard to come by and gets built up over time. all good sin players have been through the same initiation and pretty much all of them have done a couple of complete rebuilds over time. once you figure out how to make one tick-along, it's really either well skilled OR heavily sorbing barbs & hammerdins that'll give you serious hassles.
traps have two uses, the obvious one is to inflict damage. perhaps the less obvious one is to combine a low damage trap with mindblast to keep an opponent in a Hit Recovery animation. the extreme example is to dump three lit-sentries and two Wake of Fire's under any zon with points in the dodge skills then wash a mindblast over their heads. they do a funky little "whoo, wa-ha" dance of d/a/e/hit-recovery animations.
as to which is better, bearing in mind i have 'talon on all my 'sin builds: ww/trap is a lot easier to win with than ww/kick.
the only things i really miss about my ww/kicker are the easy %dr (from points in fade) and the sight of people stacking lit-sorb against my mighty 1-252 damage traps (y iz druid cast FoH at me while i ww?). meh, the character is there, the gear has been shifted onto a ww/trap build which is, imho, a much simpler build to take into a pubby duel room and win with. at which point you loath yon FoH-when-whirled hammerdin.
whichever way you go: be prepared to lose, a lot, in your early days. ww characters are kind of tricky to control compared to, for example, a smiter. don't get discouraged by early defeats and sell off your gear, good hybrid/ww gear is hard to come by and gets built up over time. all good sin players have been through the same initiation and pretty much all of them have done a couple of complete rebuilds over time. once you figure out how to make one tick-along, it's really either well skilled OR heavily sorbing barbs & hammerdins that'll give you serious hassles.
Summerfun
Diabloii.Net Member
Well, im remaking my sin to and i really dont know what to do.
I have pretty much all the gear
2/20/30ias/30res
enigma/perfect Bramble
really nice fcr rings with 18 str res AR and 8x mana.
Skillers 3x and 4x life
The thing that keeps me from making an hybrid and makes me go pure ww with traps only to stunn is my lack of great hybrid claws.
Im on europe and i have been looking for claws with +3ls and other usefull mods for ages, it seems impossible to find.
So without really good claws, arent my traps gonna be to weak?
I have pretty much all the gear
2/20/30ias/30res
enigma/perfect Bramble
really nice fcr rings with 18 str res AR and 8x mana.
Skillers 3x and 4x life
The thing that keeps me from making an hybrid and makes me go pure ww with traps only to stunn is my lack of great hybrid claws.
Im on europe and i have been looking for claws with +3ls and other usefull mods for ages, it seems impossible to find.
So without really good claws, arent my traps gonna be to weak?
mephiztophelez
Diabloii.Net Member
good claws are notoriously difficult to come by, mostly because 99% of battlenet are nubz with no idea of what makes a great claw. i shudder to think how many +3ls/+3venom/xx 3os greater talons have been sniffed at or not even picked up and looked at because the player who coaxed b.net into coughing up a godly combo just thought: "not a suwayyah = junk" and left it on the deck.
i only know of about four or five particularly spiffy hybrid fools claws on west ladder (i'm sure there are more).
you can still build for ww/trap and live with lower damage traps while you hunt down better shells for chaos/fury and a nice fools (and a gg fcr/sin ammy, but thats a mission to acquire in it's own right).
play with a skills calculator and see if you can bust 6k traps with what you have (even if it's an um'd bartucs offhand). i'd only really shy away from it if you can't scrape up ~5k traps. maybe use some traps charms in the short term to beef it up a little, balance out trap/shadow charms with a handy weapon-block breakpoint. if thats too much of a strain on other requirements (res, dr, life, etc) or leaves your venom much below level ~33'ish, then look at a ww/kick build ('talon needs only slvl12 to be effective, i see no reason not to spend a point or two). and theres what happened to me, i built a ww/kicker and about a week later found a godly greater talon shell for a ww/trapper (+3LS/+3d-flight) = rebuild (again)
now 5k traps is gonna give you a lot of work to do on the ww-side of things, but if you can win consistently with 5k traps and low'ish ww-ar (no fools), then your going to STOMP when you get 7k+ traps and a fools claw. the important part here is what i said earlier about being tricky to control: an experienced player with 5k traps/low ar/3k life'sin is going to do better than a noob with an e-bayed to the hilt >9k traps/godly fools/4.5k life'sin.
all that said: if you can win with a ww/kicker, a ww/trapper is just a doddle.
I belive also DF and venom are probably equally as important imo as having atleast say 3ls + df on ur primary weap which is say a chaos means you have saved some points in the martial arts tree.
But yeah WW/Trapper is the way to go
Im currently on building my third rebuild the first 2 used CoA now this one is based on a circlet build the only thing i need left is good fools mod claws, i.e something with maybe 1-2 assa skills + 2-3 LS or something mods some where in between these.
And a good claw can be found i use a feral chaos claw with 1 df, 3 ls and 1 blade fury. Even my fury is fairly decent 3 venom 2 ls however its Suwayyah so it not fast enough for trap laying speed bp without BOS.
mephiztophelez
Diabloii.Net Member
i've built sins around coa's. nice a helm as it is, that fcr is just crucial for a lot of builds.
as for a fools, if you get +2LS or better on a fast base claw, have a go with it. you might have to live with a slower trap laying speed while you hunt down the mythical 40ias/2os/5ls/fools/kb jobbie.
fire trap/ ww hybrids are fairly easy to make even without godly claws. it only takes 60 points to max wof and synergies giving around 700-900 damage depending on your claws and gear. this trap damage is similar to a 4.5k-6k trap damage with light sentry and uses fewer skills points allowing you to beef up your sin in other areas such as blade shield, clawblock, claw mastery, fade, mind blast, dtalon, ect.
if you attempt this build i highly suggest finding a decent fools claw with either high ias or 2soc for 50% ow to help make your ww more effective. +skills are not as crucial to this build as a ls/ww hybrid.
if you attempt this build i highly suggest finding a decent fools claw with either high ias or 2soc for 50% ow to help make your ww more effective. +skills are not as crucial to this build as a ls/ww hybrid.
Summerfun
Diabloii.Net Member
I was thinking about a fire trapper/ww hybrid. But then again those traps are gonna be to easy to absorb.... with only waterwalks on and no absorb they hardly do any damage as it is.
For now i just think ill go with pure ww with lvl 1 traps just to stunn.
Then i can keep looking for those +3LS + other skills runic talons.
For now i just think ill go with pure ww with lvl 1 traps just to stunn.
Then i can keep looking for those +3LS + other skills runic talons.
in all comparison... ls and wof traps can both be almost completely negated with one piece of sorb especially considering that tgods is the primary piece for light elementals which has both sorb and stack.
this will still leave you with a high stunlock capacity and all the other benefits you will recieve from the extra skills points.
this will still leave you with a high stunlock capacity and all the other benefits you will recieve from the extra skills points.