WW Sin: Swapping Shadow Discipline charms away for AR charms viable?

RetroStar

Diabloii.Net Member
WW Sin: Swapping Shadow Discipline charms away for AR charms viable?

I've heard many people complaining their WW sin are suffering from AR problems. Would prebuffing Venom/SM/Fade then swapping the Shadow Discipline charms with Grand AR charms with 100+AR work? The only con to this is the lower skill level for MB during battle. 100AR+ GC is used so there is not much fussing about as you can exchange GC for GC instead of SC for GC which can take forever.

Would this do well? This can give a large boost to the low ar WW sin.
 

eLight

Diabloii.Net Member
I dont really know but keep in mind that Shadowskillers also helps your AR. They boost your clawmastery.
 

Speederländer

Diabloii.Net Member
RetroStar said:
I've heard many people complaining their WW sin are suffering from AR problems. Would prebuffing Venom/SM/Fade then swapping the Shadow Discipline charms with Grand AR charms with 100+AR work? The only con to this is the lower skill level for MB during battle. 100AR+ GC is used so there is not much fussing about as you can exchange GC for GC instead of SC for GC which can take forever.

Would this do well? This can give a large boost to the low ar WW sin.
Bad idea. Your venom is your primary source of damage.

Shadow skill GCs provide the following critical benefits:
1. Venom damage boost.
2. Mindblast boost for swirlie duration and damage
3. Claw Mastery boost for primary AR % boost and some damage
4. Fade boost for res and DR
5. Shadow master boost

All of these either have to be used at a lower level or increased by another method, and venom needs to be a big as a possible anyway.

The only way you can theoretically sacrifice venom damage is to pump str to get bigger physical damage, but that is not recommended.
 

RetroStar

Diabloii.Net Member
Speederländer said:
Bad idea. Your venom is your primary source of damage.

Shadow skill GCs provide the following critical benefits:
1. Venom damage boost.
2. Mindblast boost for swirlie duration and damage
3. Claw Mastery boost for primary AR % boost and some damage
4. Fade boost for res and DR
5. Shadow master boost

All of these either have to be used at a lower level or increased by another method, and venom needs to be a big as a possible anyway.

The only way you can theoretically sacrifice venom damage is to pump str to get bigger physical damage, but that is not recommended.
For 1, 4 and 5. That's why I mentioned you prebuff them first. You'll still maintain the same lvl of venom/SM/Fade with your prebuff.

I only reasoning I see is the Claw Mastery and MB duration.

Though I don't know the calculation, would using 10 100AR+ GC yield more AR in the end than the AR given by Claw Mastery? You'll still have a decent lvl of Claw Mastery (25 or so?)without the GCS. Since WW sin do most of their dmg from OW and Venom. Is it safe to say the +dmg is negliable?

Is the difference between a lvl 25MB and a 35 (with 10gcs) that noticable? I'm not too sure on this.

This seems like a cheap way to avoid AR problem without sacrificing the ammy/rings for Angelic while you can use Highlord/FCR Ammy and Ravens.

I'm gonna do a test for this and see the difference. Though my WW sin is only lvl 20 right now haha. I'll lvl him up and I should be able to see if its viable by tm.
 

Speederländer

Diabloii.Net Member
RetroStar said:
For 1, 4 and 5. That's why I mentioned you prebuff them first. You'll still maintain the same lvl of venom/SM/Fade with your prebuff.

I only reasoning I see is the Claw Mastery and MB duration.

Though I don't know the calculation, would using 10 100AR+ GC yield more AR in the end than the AR given by Claw Mastery? You'll still have a decent lvl of Claw Mastery (25 or so?)without the GCS. Since WW sin do most of their dmg from OW and Venom. Is it safe to say the +dmg is negliable?

Is the difference between a lvl 25MB and a 35 (with 10gcs) that noticable? I'm not too sure on this.

This seems like a cheap way to avoid AR problem without sacrificing the ammy/rings for Angelic while you can use Highlord/FCR Ammy and Ravens.

I'm gonna do a test for this and see the difference. Though my WW sin is only lvl 20 right now haha. I'll lvl him up and I should be able to see if its viable by tm.
Your physical damage is low. Pumping AR doesn't improve this fact. Highlords acting on mediocre damage is not a good reason to forego 10 shadow GCs.

You are talking about trading out 10 shadow GCs. So not only do you lose the stuff I listed, you also have claw block nuked as well. Prebuffing venom and fade every time before you duel gets real old real fast. I've tried it.
 

ilkori

Diabloii.Net Member
I can't speak to most things, but I can do this. Basic math:

Level 5 Whirlwind: 20% AR bonus (5%/lvl past that)
Level 20 Claw Mastery: 220% AR bonus (10%/lvl past that)
One Angelic ring at level 90 = 12*90 = 1080 AR (two is 2600)
10 GC's with 130 AR = 1300 AR
+shadow from non-altered equipment = +6
AR from Raven Frost = 250 AR (dual is 500)
AR from Dex ~500 (value from 104 dex)
AR% from Demon Limb = 200%
*I guessed on a couple things, but this should be close enough

Setups:
5.3k Maras, dual Raven, shadow GCs: AR+ = 500+500; AR% = 30+220+180 = 430%
9.1k One angelic, one Raven, shadow GCs: AR+=500+1080+250 = 1830; AR%=20+220+160 = 400%
16.4 Dual angelic, shadow GCs: AR+=500+2600 = 3100; ar%=30+220+180 = 430%

9.9k Maras, dual Raven, AR GCs: AR+ = 500+500+1300 = 2300; AR% = 30+220+80 = 330%
12.5 One angelic, one Raven, AR GCs: AR+=500+1080+250+1300 = 3130; AR%=20+220+60 = 300%
18.9 Dual angelic, AR GCs: AR+=500+2600+1300 = 4400; ar%=30+220+180 = 330%

Setups with Enchant from Demon Limb (same order as above, just 200% AR added)
7.3k
12.8k
22.6k

14.5k
18.8k
27.7k
 

'22'Souljah

Diabloii.Net Member
you guys forgot the imporant part of taking out shadow gcs for ars concerning skill points
ce prepared to subtract 10 away from your weapon blokc skill level or pump extra points into it
 

Speederländer

Diabloii.Net Member
[QUOTE='22'Souljah]you guys forgot the imporant part of taking out shadow gcs for ars concerning skill points
ce prepared to subtract 10 away from your weapon blokc skill level or pump extra points into it[/QUOTE]

I mentioned it. :cool:

You are talking about trading out 10 shadow GCs. So not only do you lose the stuff I listed, you also have claw block nuked as well.
 

RetroStar

Diabloii.Net Member
Well is the difference between lvl 25Claw Block and 35Claw Block a big difference? I dunno the stats on those.
 

'22'Souljah

Diabloii.Net Member
RetroStar said:
Well is the difference between lvl 25Claw Block and 35Claw Block a big difference? I dunno the stats on those.
lvl 25 = 59% chance
lvl 35 = 61% chance
most c/c sins don't even bother to go above lvl 26 though
 

Speederländer

Diabloii.Net Member
RetroStar said:
Well is the difference between lvl 25Claw Block and 35Claw Block a big difference? I dunno the stats on those.
No, it's the difference between 16 and 26. Very few assassins go above the 60% block mark unless they have skill points to burn, which they rarely do. You invest points to get lvl 26. No skill charms means you have to invest 10 skill points to get to the standard 60% block.
 

RetroStar

Diabloii.Net Member
Speederländer said:
No, it's the difference between 16 and 26. Very few assassins go above the 60% block mark unless they have skill points to burn, which they rarely do. You invest points to get lvl 26. No skill charms means you have to invest 10 skill points to get to the standard 60% block.
Hrm interesting. So the points used on Claw Block could be better spent else where? but what skills? Shadow Master?
 

Speederländer

Diabloii.Net Member
RetroStar said:
Hrm interesting. So the points used on Claw Block could be better spent else where? but what skills? Shadow Master?
CM - 20
Venom - 20
MB -20
Fade - enough to get 50% DR with equipment
CB - enough for 60% block
SM - 1
MB - 20
WoF - 1
LS - 1
DF - 1 immediately and reamining points when the others are filled
 
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