WW barb vs WW sin

Sass

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

It'll save them from the big nasty 95 (avg) damage LS. When we're not using WoF anyway. Sooooooo important.
 

Hartside

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

My 2 cents I play wolves mainly now but played barbs for a long time . Barbs can lose to any class but vs assa the odds are in favour of the barb , but if a poor barb player is vs a good ghost player the barb will end up on his knees . Most barbs hostile my wolf thinking it's a free kill , then cry like babies when they die ofc you can bm any class . But if you have to bm to win doesn't that say more about that persons lack of skill . And ofc my wolf loses to the barb players with good skill level but in public duels that isn't often ^^
 
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

Again. The difference of 1 damage and 0 damage is huge when it comes to the swirlies. No gm barb will close to never get damage from lvl 1 traps reduced to 0. Calculate it yourself, if you doubt it.

With 0 damage, or healing, on the other hand, there's no stunning. Test it yourself, if you don't believe me. [Note it does not require damage to activate knockback, which can have been what have confused Sass].

Now to sum it up. It's really really simple. We're comparing WW barb to WW sin, not the average WW barb to the average WW sin on b.net, or the best WW barb to the best WW sin on b.net.
No we're comparing the expected WW barb vs. the expected WW sin, both of equal skills.
That simply means no in game experience is useable, because there's no way to guarantee equal skills, and in principle, unless you cheat or get your opponent to show his items, skill investment and stats, to know if you really did duel a ww sin/barb under otherwise equal circumstances.

So what do we end up with? A very simple analysis that shows exact chances to win of two equal skilled players. Yes okay it's actually not very simple, and it'll change when the total skill level of the players combined changes. Though what really surprised me and which there should be absolutely no doubt of:

A ww barbarian have a clear advantage against any ww sin when two players of equal skills, and otherwise can be characterised as BvC and Ghost are fighting eachother.

[PS: Ignore Sass, he turns a sentence like:
"The advantage to the barb increases even more when he goes BM"
Into
"Ghosts invest heavily in traps" In other words strawman logic].
 

Sass

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

Stun doesn't activate any KB. Any damage stuns, even the sorbing ones. You still don't sit and stun a barb though...





And I agree with your scenario's conclusion. Take away the sin's ability to duel and he will lose. I also agree and have already stated that the barb has the advantage. Since when has advantage turned into an automatic win? If advantage wins, how do smiters kill barbs or hdins? How do casters kill a sin? How does a kicker kill a smiter?


It's called knowing how to kill the opponent. When you take it away and look at numbers, you have already lost your point. Theorycraft will get you nowhere.




Also, I've yet to use a strawman. ;) I've been directly talking about the sorb vs a WWsin. Never have I said they invest heavily into traps (that's your strawman). I've only said that it's a moot thing for the barb to do since he already takes very little damage, and the stun will not save him.
 

OoQQoO

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

How much IAS would i need to hit 9frame traps with a suwayyah?

ATM i have a 30 IAS fools suwayyah..
 

Sass

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

It takes 125% IAS.

With your 30%, you still need 95% somewhere else.
 

zyyz

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: WW barb vs WW sin

not using widowmaker
and without fool claw
i dunt think a ww sin can win barb/pally/some max block chars.
i just finish my ghost sin with all gears i have 5.8k ar.
not even hurt them at all.
when i have a fool claw from my friend, then i hit 12k ar.
the story changed
 
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