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Why Teeth is so underestimated?

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Lompo, Oct 27, 2006.

  1. Lompo

    Lompo IncGamers Member

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    Why Teeth is so underestimated?

    I think that teeth is a very underestimated skill. No guide for Bone built ever suggest to make it a base damaging skill, but just a synergy in favour of B.spear/B.spirit.
    But if I did the calculation rightly and I understand how it works Teeth is way more damaging than the 2 previous most famous skills.
    Lets do some calc.:
    For all the skills I made those assumption: 20 points invested in the skill, 2 synergy maxed, 12 skill points from items and starting from the tablest of Arreat Summit I estimate the scaled dmg to lev. 32.

    Bone spear: lev. 32 base avg. dmg ca. 380
    synergy from 20 to B.wall/B.prison + 1 Teeth = +287%
    Skill ponts invested 63
    total avg. damage ca. 1400 x cast

    Bone spirit: lev. 32 base avg. dmg ca. 640
    synergy from 20 to B.wall/B.prison + 1Teeth/B.spear = +252%
    Skill ponts invested 64
    total avg. damage ca. 2250 x cast

    Teeth: lev. 32 base avg. dmg ca. 50 * 33 teeth = ca. 1650 !!!
    synergy from 20 to B.wall/B.prison + 1 B.spear = +615%
    Skill ponts invested 63
    total avg. damage ca. 360 * 33 teeth = ca. 17800 x cast !!!!

    If I havent maken any mistakes the difference in damage is huge and it make me think why nobody use it as main attack.
     
  2. xduckster

    xduckster IncGamers Member

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    The number of teeth is capped at 24. Not every one of the 24 teeth are hitting your target.
    Let's say theoretically, every tooth hit the target all you would have is:
    24 * 393 = 9432 damage
    at 75 FCR (10 FPA)this comes out to 23,580 damage per second. Not bad if every one of them would hit... but they don't.

    OK summarized:
    20 skill in bone armor/wall and the skill used +12 skill = 32 skill will 2 full synergies
    Bone Spear: 1671.5
    Bne Spirit: 2078.5
    Teeth: 9432

    I never really used the spell so I can't tell you anything about how it works though. But I assume that most of the teeth don;t hit and it's probably hard to aim.



     
  3. FuryLasse

    FuryLasse IncGamers Member

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    How many times do you actually hit 33 enemys at a time? as far as i remember, teeth shoots abit like multiple arrows, so the 33 enemys would have to be very spreadout to actually get hit. And 50 dmg per hit can easily be regenerated by monsters in NM and Hell, so you would still be screwed even if you managed to hit the max amount of monsters
     
  4. Sint Nikolaas

    Sint Nikolaas IncGamers Member

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    I'm getting different numbers.

    Let's compare.

    Bone Spear:
    Level 32, 2 synergies (teeth and bone spirit)= 1596-1687, ave 1641

    Bone Spirit:
    Level 32, 2 synergies (teeth and bonespear)= 1938-2077, ave 2007

    Teeth:
    Level 32, 2 synergies (bone spear and bone spirit)= 336 - 434, ave 385, 24 projectiles.

    Now remember, Bone Spear travels trough your opponent auto-piercing, also hitting all the opponents that are in the same line. But for argument sake we'll consider all the damage vs 1 opponent.

    Teeth is indeed a multishot skill and if used correctly you can hit a single target with multiple teeth. However since it's a multishot spell the teeth spread out over a large ground. If you stand right on top of your opponent (something you'll want to avoid with a bonemancer) you will have to hit your opponent with 4,25 teeth to get the same damage as a bone spear. You'll have to hit him with 5,21 teeth to get the same damage as a bone spirit.

    Now when used against a large mob and you're sure that all the teeth will hit one monster or another then you're pretty safe to say that you do 24 x 385 = 9240 damage. However remember that if you're up against a mob you can also use bone spear which only has to pierce 5,6 monsters to achieve the same damage.

    Also taking into consideration that by the time you reach the level to get these 61 points invested you are facing monsters that can regenerate life. They'll regenerate a lot better if you hit them with small amounts of damage then if you hit them with large amounts of damage (they have more time to regenerate).

    Also taking into consideration that Bone Spear is the fastest traveling skill of the three you can target some monster and be about 100% sure you'll hit him even if he's in a mob. Targetting him with Bone Spirit pretty guarantees you'll hit him too. Targetting him with Teeth doesn't, especially if a mob is moving around (trying to get your mercenary for instance) you'll hit the ones standing closest to you, which can vary, giving the ones you hit but are now moving away more time to regenerate.

    Also taking into consideration that after those 61 points invested you'll get an average of 8 damage increase in Teeth damage after another point invested in a synergy (bonewall), an average of 30 damage increase in Bone Spear damage and an average of 35 damage increase in Bone Spirit damage.

    I'll take Bone Spear over Teeth any time of the day. Not to mention that Bone Spear looks a lot cooler then Teeth. :grin:



     
  5. nebux

    nebux IncGamers Member

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    teeth work just like multishot. Since each monster can only be hit once from each wave, obviously the more monsters there are on the screen the more potential damage you can do.
     
  6. FlimFlan

    FlimFlan IncGamers Member

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    Make a dentist and let us know how it goes. Use teeth for packs and bone spirit for bosses.

    Would Razortail give the teeth the capability of piercing?
     
  7. bill_n_opus

    bill_n_opus IncGamers Member

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    Check the necro forum and their strategy stickies. I'm sure that there's a Dentist strat in there somewhere. Anyways, :thumbsup: to you for thinking outside the box ... but I think the reason why the Dentist is considered an esoteric build much like a mojomancer is because it's not that effective.

    I'm not saying it can't be fun ... i'm just saying it's not popular because it's been found to be underpowered ... and most people like uber chars and not chars that require good skills or serious twinking to make hell viable.



     
  8. crazy_bear

    crazy_bear IncGamers Member

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    I know nebux already said this, but just to be clear, each monster can only be hit by one tooth. So yes, it can do a lot of damage against big packs, but since that damage is spread out so much it takes a long time to kill anything, especially once regen is factored in. Also, you'd probably be lucky to get 10 hits in.

    To comment on anther item here, the spread of the teeth can be controlled by where the mouse pointer is when it is aimed (button clicked). The farther the pointer is toward the edge of the screen, the tighter the grouping.

    CB
     
  9. rykuss

    rykuss Banned

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    I've always used it on my left click, I find it quite useful against groups. It tends to stun them while I spam it and knocks off nice chunks of life. It buys my merc time to close with them and finish them off while I either continue to spam teeth or pick off the tougher monsters with bone spear. In pit runs it keeps those archer girls busy while wiping out the annoying fallen packs. In a tight corridor though, I'll just use bonespear. It's not like you have to build a different character to use it. I just actually use it and it works quite well in my opinion.
     
  10. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

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    My understand on this skill, is it is more a support skill nice to have, but you can perfectly live without it just fine. Not dealing enough damage is the major disadvantage.
     
  11. Bladewind

    Bladewind IncGamers Member

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    Teeth can be a nice killer in cows. Its large radius makes it effective against mobs.
     

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