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Which Golem for PvM?

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by Holy Dude, Nov 4, 2013.

  1. Holy Dude

    Holy Dude IncGamers Member

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    Which one should I mostly use, and should I invest points into it?
     
  2. Archone

    Archone IncGamers Member

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    Clay golem is awesome vs bosses. Due to its ability to slow them down a bit.

    But the higher lvl I get, and along with better gear. I always switch to iron golem at some point.
    But if I do, I always make the iron golem from an Insight runeword.

    Then I can put something meaner on my merc instead.
     
  3. Namtar

    Namtar IncGamers Member

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    Golems have managed to get themselves into an awkward place in Diablo II. I really like them, and they manage to make themselves useful enough that just about every necromancer has one, but they're not nearly as good as they could be...

    Clay: Cheap, durable, and slows enemies down. Pretty good with even one point invested into it (you'll also want a point into Golem Mastery). Most necromancers use Clay Golem for its capacity to tank monsters and for the slow, which (I think) stacks with Decrepify.

    Blood: Originally, Blood Golem's interaction with damage return, such as the necromancer's Iron Maiden, allowed for a fun experience in which monsters would surround the Blood Golem and their attacks would make them damage themselves while healing the Blood Golem and the necromancer. Ever since the patch that removed this (1.10 I think), Blood Golem has had a reputation as being useless. Patch 1.13 did away with Blood Golem damaging the necromancer when it takes damage, but Blood Golem is still generally the worst golem.

    Iron: Its properties are dependent on the item used, but the fact that it results in the permanent loss of the item should be enough to deter most people. The biggest exception to this is the runeword Insight. A golem made from an Insight weapon gives a Meditation aura, which is very nice. Golems can have other auras too, but those items require higher runes and can't be so easily replaced. Don't assume, "I'll just make sure my golem never dies" either, because sometimes they just vanish on their own. Other than the item expenditure issue, Iron Golems can be pretty useful. Insight Golems are great for bone necros. This is the only golem that can achieve appreciable damage against monsters, which isn't particularly relevant, since other damage sources surpass it by so much (the Obedience runeword seems to be the best performer as an attacking golem). The most powerful golem for PvM, if you have been hoarding runes for several years and need a way to get rid of that collection, is an Iron Golem made from the Pride runeword.

    Fire: Hefty mana cost and its damage output is still too low to be useful. Try taking a high-level Fire Golem into low-level areas of the game some time, to see what could have been if golems weren't so underpowered. Fire Golem does get somewhat better if paired with Lower Resist or Conviction, but necromancers have access to better sources of damage. As a tank, the appeal of Fire Golem is that its aura will irritate monsters, so they attack it. Fire Golem can be a fun alternative, but usually Clay is a better option.
     
  4. pharphis

    pharphis IncGamers Site Pal

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    A little bit? They slow down enemies SO much, and it's activated if they're hit by the enemies, or if they hit the enemy.

    Yes, it does stack with decrep.

    I'm all for CG but also like IG if you keep the golem safe enough
     
  5. kestegs

    kestegs D3 Monk Moderator

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    I'm a huge fan of the fire golem. The agro that he draws is really nice for pretty much every necro build. Of course CG is unbeatable for bosses.
     
  6. Rodrigo

    Rodrigo IncGamers Member

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    About IG, I've always wondered, when it is summoned at the start of a new game, is it summoned at your current skill level, or at the skill lvl it was created?
     
  7. Mad Mantis

    Mad Mantis D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator

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    Current skill level. That is to say the level of the skill with all the bonuses of the gear your character was wearing when you exited the game.
     
  8. Psychonautical

    Psychonautical IncGamers Member

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    Another option for IG if your necromancer is in need of a near-indestructible tank rather than a source of Meditation is to make it out of a Treachery runeword. Cheap runes, and you can put it in the highest defense armor that might be less useful regarding requirements.

    If I remember correctly, minions don't suffer resistance penalties. When the Golem's Fade triggers, he'll get a nice 60% resist all and 15% Damage Reduction. As long as your Summon Resist is above level 4 (44% resist) then he should be immune to everything except poison and physical damage, the ladder of which he is resistant to as well.

    Since Golems run faster and monsters seem to like to target them, a Golem running into a pack of Burning Souls or Venom Lords while being immune to their main ranged attacks is a fantastic way to keep that damage off of you and your minions.

    If I remember correctly of course. I believe Fade from Treachery will cast on an IG and give more than 100 resist with no penalties. Anyone want to confirm?

    Not only that, but this actually give him a small bit of damage. It isn't great or near using an Obedience, but he will attack pretty quickly, and with a Conviction/Fanaticism aura to give him a better chance to him, he'll cast Venom as well and deal some Poison damage pretty regularly. Again, nothing to write home about, but on the off chance you are broke with no merc, it is enough to get that first kill instead of taking forever with Attract and a Clay Golem + Backup attacks.
     
  9. Namtar

    Namtar IncGamers Member

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    That's another fairly reasonable runeword. While it wouldn't match Obedience, it also might be more practical for a necromancer that isn't going all crazy in dedicating skills and equipment to improving the golem. I'll have to remember Treachery for if I do another round of Iron Golemancer testing.
     
  10. Ghoulz

    Ghoulz IncGamers Member

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    I invested in a blood golem with my melee necro. Synergized bone armor is almost always up so elemental damage is the only thing I worry about. I don't have to prioritize life tap over other curses to stay afloat.

    Too bad that's about the only build it's good for.......
     
  11. Holy Dude

    Holy Dude IncGamers Member

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    Did you just say Melee Necro? Do you mean Poison Dagger or something else... Because that would be really impressive
     
  12. Namtar

    Namtar IncGamers Member

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    "Meleemancers" that use non-dagger weapons used to be somewhat popular as challenging, versatile characters. Usually the focus is on crowd control effects to enable picking off monsters one at a time.
     
  13. wolfofbenjamin

    wolfofbenjamin IncGamers Member

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    Did you know I managed to defeat Diablo with a clay golem and iron maiden combo? Now tell me
    how fun is that?
     
  14. d2fan

    d2fan IncGamers Member

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    i find asthetic wise fire golem is the only one

    but for real fun play irongolem with insight is by far the best(even if you dont have infinity for merc, obdience is also very good)
     
  15. Necrocomicon

    Necrocomicon IncGamers Member

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    In my opinion, Clay Golem is very useful and reliable. Fire Golem may be fine until you get to Hell difficulty, except for Fire Immunes when they come along. Iron Golem can be really awesome but you have to sacrifice a good item to make him awesome and then once he's gone that's it.

    Clay Golem is like that friend you can always rely on. :')
     
  16. nurman

    nurman IncGamers Member

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    I usually solo on high players settings (5-7), so blood is really great if you run into a need for healing (you can also just throw away with the healing pots then). Otherwise clay, IMO fire is trash and I'm too much of a cheapskate to use iron.
     
  17. Namtar

    Namtar IncGamers Member

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    Haven't toyed with BG too much since it became a viable option for the first time in forever (with patch 1.13 I think it was), but I wasn't particularly impressed with it. Granted, it might actually shine with certain meleemancer builds and such (it can be fun in some areas with Amplify Damage and a Thorns aura, but it's not really a practical long-term tool for clearing out Hell). Golems (other than Iron for certain highly specific uses) don't really do that much anyway. Clay does a slightly better job of tanking hits before needing to be recast, which is about all golems do anyway, so it's regarded as the best option. If you find yourself actually getting value out of the slow from CG or the heal from BG, then use that one. Ultimately it doesn't matter much. I should say, however, since this topic is apparently current again, that I revise my stance from 2013. While I've found BG to be lackluster, Fire Golem is easily the worst golem. It just might be one of the most disappointing level 30 skill in the game.
     

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