Where have i failed???


Diabloii.Net Member
Where have i failed???

Ok, now... I built my first kick sin and i am not satisfied with the results. I can make very nice claw/claw sins, strong enough to play pvm alone in hell and face strong unique bosses like über D, but...

Well, where have i failed?

First, let me say that i like the char (even tho i am not happy) and the skills, but still i am having a hard time playing with this char in hell mode. A very hard time!

The char is now like this:

- Gear

Cham'ed Guillaume's face
Ber'd upped Bartuc's
Jade Talon
Nature's peace
rare ring (life steal, lightning res., atack rating)
Chains of Honor
rare gloves (+2 Martial Arts, life steal, ias)
upped gore riders
string of ears

- Skills

DStrike 20
DTalon 20
DTail 20
Phoenix Strike 20
Burst of Speed 1
Claw Mastery 1
Weapon Block 1
Shadow Master 1
Blade Fury 1
Dragon Flight 1
(all requisites skills) 1

- Stats (without gear)

125 str (spent some points here because my coh is a 'boneweave')
162 dex
218 vit
25 ene

Ok... The main problems are:

- I am not sure, but i think my def is too low (around 1800) because i die too fast! My life is low too (under 1000). I used to relly on damage red. and life steal on my claw sins (i like to use natalya set), and that seemed to work for them (def and life are low too, but the chars use to get the work done). I have no problems fighting 1-on-1 bosses (haven't faced any Ubber yet), but being hit by any monster in act 1 hell is very annoying!!

- Resist is some pain too... Elemental atacks cause quite high damage to my kick sin, although she uses coh and jade talon... (resist are not maxed)

- Hitting!!! Oh, i dont like miss the target... The Dragon Claw sin i built has a good atack rating (the nunber showed on that stats reach 20k), but this kick sin can hardly reach the 13k atack rating... I noticed the ar '%' are not too different (something like 3%), but still my kick sin is missing a lot! (Should i maxed claw mastery? Would that made any difference? It does for dragon claw...)

About my thoughts:

When i built this kick sin, i thought about maxing both Dtalon and Dtail for bosses (talon) and crowd (tail) combat. Phoenix is used for crowd too (use that on claw build). The fury is just something i started to put my later points into (i do not intend to spent anymore points, since the main damage of this is weapon-based).




Diabloii.Net Member
DTalon and DTail are hard to mix. For DTalon, try reading Janus Jones' guide or the partly incomplete version of my guide. A good DTail build will go more along the lines of Widjinn's guide. Those will answer a lot of your questions.

In short, your skill setup is lacking, your equipment might not be the "most optimum" and you may not be using your supporting skills correctly (i.e. strategy). Your defense is fine, your CB is sufficient, your life is about right though it could be higher, you've certainly spent a lot on this character, but somehow it just isn't working for you when others have considered a Talon build to be one of the best out there. To say it again, you can't put pieces together, the character requires a total concept with every piece of gear working together to meet the requirements.

Talon does not need Tail as a backup. You have probably noticed it works very well for taking down single characters, but is generally slower at groups. The answer to this lies in Death Sentry.

Tail requries Tiger Strike to get its damage. However, both Physical and Fire immunes will be difficult to damage when you have sunk so many points into the skill.

With your total setup, your DR is very lacking. I'm glad you noticed that. Usually, I take care of that via Stormshield. If you are set on a C/C route, that won't be possible. Instead, you will have to dedicate gear slots to that (possibly making it harder to reach other requirements). With CoH, you'd basically have to use Fade and String of Ears / Verdungo's Cord to pull it off without too much of an investment.


Diabloii.Net Member
It seems that damage reduction was something i really lacked... I replaced my jade talon 4 a SS and it seems to work just fine! My char improved a lot!

Just dont know what to do about atack rating.... Should i spent the next stats points in dex???


Diabloii.Net Member
It looks like you also improved your blocking (one base point in WB is usually way too low).

For hitting, 13k AR is plenty. You will miss, but it shouldn't be "missing a lot!" like you said. If you are really missing that badly, then you are fighting monsters too high of a level for your kicker to fight. The level difference can override any edge you could get from AR.

What is the Nature's Peace for? You can't pop bodies when they refuse to appear.

I'd consider forgetting what this kicker has, and heading back to the basics for what your character needs. My guide (linked above) has everything you need to know for priorities considering the entire setup. Janus Jones has a more comprehensive equipment list to get you started down the right path for thinking about things.


Diabloii.Net Member
Well, you're right about the nature's peace... That actually is for Uber fighting ('prevent monster heal' - i am thinking for the future), but in other ocasions i can use any other more-usefull rings...

About lvl, my char is now lvl 87


Diabloii.Net Member
Adding question: What merc should i hire? I already have a lidless wall, spirit sword and upped vipermagi for an act 3 merc (fort would work better), but i am not sure that act 3 mercs are the best choice for that char...

Eilo Rytyj

Diabloii.Net Member
Prevent Monster Heal, found on Nature's Peace and also the 'of Vileness' mod on weapons does not work on the ubers.

There are 2 other ways to stop monster life regen: Poison damage and Open Wounds. Dracul's Grasp has 25% OW, as does upped Gore Riders (10%, 35% total). It lasts for 8 seconds, plenty of time since you'll be spamming away with your DTalon.

Fort is not the best on an Act3 merc, since they never swing their weapon. Either the old faithful Act2 Might merc, or Holy Freeze to give you some serious crowd control.

ethereal Spirit > Lidless for act 3 mercs too. It's a pity it wont do much, their damage is sup-par anyway.


Diabloii.Net Member
Oh, i didn't know that prevent monster heal didn't work on ubbers.... Thats a serious matter. Well, i'll focus on better rings then... Should i look for some dual leech rings or bk??? Or should i start crafting 'blood' rings???

Oh! What if i replace my claw for a 'malice' one in a fight with ubber??? Or a 'chaos' (don't know if magic damage will apply to kick damage)??? Will my kick damage drop (or increase) significantly, since i'd lost 20% 'cb' and +3 to martial arts??? If i had to choose 1 of those 3 claws ('chaos', 'malice' or my 'ber'd upped tuc's), wich would it be for normal game playing and for strong sole foes?