Whats the best build to kill Liberators XD

[EsX]

Whats the best build to kill Liberators XD

I wanted to know whats a good build in order to own Liberators because of their desychning and charge attacks

 

[Rabbitz]

In no particular order, Ww/Trapper - BvC - Another libby.. cough Hammer

 

[Josiphos]

In no particular order, Ww/Trapper - BvC - Another libby.. cough Hammer

I disagree with the BvC. I have never lost to a bvc with my libby. The lack of shield means charge never misses. If they actually start whirling me, hammers take them down faster than they can get me. Again, I've never lost to a bvc.

BvB are a little tougher due to max block.


WW/trappers do not own libbys either. It is more of a duel than bvc, but it all depends if you can find a way through their traps, does the first charge hit and can you get a few hammers through the claw block. I'd say its 50/50, more in the libbys favor if he uses tgods.

Libby or hammer vs another libby is BORING. No one can afford to get close, so its all about charging around and spamming invisible hammers. Basically luck. Its boring. Hammerdins sometimes will try and tele on top of you and hammer, but if you're ready for it, you can get them first. Not much skill involved.

I will say the hardest matchup is stormshield using necros. Impossible to beat. Even crummy ones beat me. Spirit users can be beaten if you can get a charge chain going, but its nearly impossible to get a good angle on them with bonespirits tracking you. You usually charge into a line of them and die. If they use bonewalls as well as prison, unhostile. Its impossible. You're forced to use nigma and try and tele on them. Doing that, you're just a sub par hammerdin with slow fcr.

 

[Uncle_Mike]

Wouldn't windy be a decent choice? They obliterate pure hammers and still pose a threat to hybrids I would assume.

 

[Ce Olba]

I disagree with the BvC. I have never lost to a bvc with my libby. The lack of shield means charge never misses. If they actually start whirling me, hammers take them down faster than they can get me. Again, I've never lost to a bvc.

Sorry, but for Charge to always hit, you will need 95% CtH, which requires that your AR is 19 times your opponent's defense, meaning you will need 190 000 AR to have 95% CtH. So stop with assuming things.

And Charge is pretty useless versus Whirlwind since it's damn suicidal. Widowmaker on the other hand makes your hammercamping useless so that you are forced to Charge.

Also, who says a BvC won't have some neat block? 50-60% is easily achievable with a Stormshield. Heck, my BvC would have 53% blocking with a CoA and Grief. With a EBotdZ, Arreat's and Hsarus, he would reach 70% Blocking. If I went with Angelic's and Goreriders, I would have 57% blocking. And that's a welfare BvC for you.

 

[HappyAssassin]

Is this in pubs or not? In a private duel, WW/Traps or BvC (or pure ghost actually, a totally underestimated build vs. hammers) is a great option, but in a pub you are likely to never get a kill. The WW/Trapsin wins by attrition, the BvC likewise needs to be defensive and is vulnerable to anything else while he pumps out those slow arrows. In both cases the hammerdin will just town if he's in danger of dying. In pubs, a good windy is probobly the best bet, though you need to be careful of the hammer + up-smite trick. Of course, being a better hammerdin would work too.

And Charge is pretty useless versus Whirlwind since it's damn suicidal. Widowmaker on the other hand makes your hammercamping useless so that you are forced to Charge.

Also, who says a BvC won't have some neat block? 50-60% is easily achievable with a Stormshield. Heck, my BvC would have 53% blocking with a CoA and Grief. With a EBotdZ, Arreat's and Hsarus, he would reach 70% Blocking. If I went with Angelic's and Goreriders, I would have 57% blocking. And that's a welfare BvC for you.

The barb is not in whirlwind when he widows, which is the time most libbies land a desync charge hit. Barb vs. Hammers are rarely wearing good DR either, in the first or second duel the charge is a factor before the barb compensates for it. As for block, its still not there on the widow side, and if you ww right against charge the block won't help much anyway.

 

[Ce Olba]

The barb is not in whirlwind when he widows, which is the time most libbies land a desync charge hit.

Funny, I never said that it was necessary to use Widowmaker. It's there just if the hammerdin wants to play defensive. The barbarian could just as well wait until the hammerdin runs out of mana potions.

Barb vs. Hammers are rarely wearing good DR either, in the first or second duel the charge is a factor before the barb compensates for it.

So you are saying that BvC < Liberator based on the fact that the barbarian does not know of the powerful Charge in the two or so first duels? Yeah right, keep the nice stuff coming and you might make a good comedian.

As for block, its still not there on the widow side, and if you ww right against charge the block won't help much anyway.

Again, Widowmaker is not a necessary.

Block does not help? Charge still has to go through CtH. With that said, a Libby has around the same AR as a BvC has defense, so they will have a neat 15% CtH if you count the 70% blocking. Not that much of a threat, specially considering either 35, 43 or max PDR% and over 6000 life.

 

[EsX]

How about smiters are there any tactics for those? I heard of a blind spot on a hammerdin

 

[Camden]

Best build to kill libbies is, as already a mentioned, a bone nec. Period.

How about smiters are there any tactics for those? I heard of a blind spot on a hammerdin

A smiter will never kill a non-retarded hammerdin

 

[Josiphos]

Sorry, but for Charge to always hit, you will need 95% CtH, which requires that your AR is 19 times your opponent's defense, meaning you will need 190 000 AR to have 95% CtH. So stop with assuming things.

And Charge is pretty useless versus Whirlwind since it's damn suicidal. Widowmaker on the other hand makes your hammercamping useless so that you are forced to Charge.

Also, who says a BvC won't have some neat block? 50-60% is easily achievable with a Stormshield. Heck, my BvC would have 53% blocking with a CoA and Grief. With a EBotdZ, Arreat's and Hsarus, he would reach 70% Blocking. If I went with Angelic's and Goreriders, I would have 57% blocking. And that's a welfare BvC for you.

I love for them to pull out a widow. That equals charge chain death.

So if they pull out a stormshield with 50% block, they also lose a ton of damage potential. They actually have to get close to me, and for that, they are going to be eating hammers. Even the godliest CeOlba barb is not going to tank 11k hammers for long.

What moron charges into a whirl? Did I say I recommended that? Thats not even part of the argument.

I love facing bvc. Tastes like chicken

 

[MysticDragon]

I love for them to pull out a widow. That equals charge chain death.

So if they pull out a stormshield with 50% block, they also lose a ton of damage potential. They actually have to get close to me, and for that, they are going to be eating hammers. Even the godliest CeOlba barb is not going to tank 11k hammers for long.

What moron charges into a whirl? Did I say I recommended that? Thats not even part of the argument.

I love facing bvc. Tastes like chicken

Hmm... I'd like to give it a try. Are you on Ladder or non? Nvm. Whisper me *DB_MysticDragon

op L.L right now. I'll wait for you.

 

[HappyAssassin]

Block does not help? Charge still has to go through CtH. With that said, a Libby has around the same AR as a BvC has defense, so they will have a neat 15% CtH if you count the 70% blocking. Not that much of a threat, specially considering either 35, 43 or max PDR% and over 6000 life

Yes, block helps you if you manage to get hit with a charge. A character with a range 3 whirlwind should not be getting hit with charge.

Again, Widowmaker is not a necessary.

The vast majority of barbs use widowmaker against hammerdins in 1v1. All of mcm's vids show widow being used. Yes, a barb can kill a hammerdin without widow, but its not a duel in the barb's favor.

 

[Josiphos]

Hmm... I'd like to give it a try. Are you on Ladder or non? Nvm. Whisper me *DB_MysticDragon

op L.L right now. I'll wait for you.

Sorry...stuck at work for the rest of the day.


Can't get on Monday either...work...Tuesday would work if you haven't found someone by then. (Damn Grad School!)

Ladder btw west

 

[mythos]

Wouldn't windy be a decent choice? They obliterate pure hammers and still pose a threat to hybrids I would assume.

Yes. Good windy's do very well v's a libby's. I must stress that the windy needs to know what they are doing though. Non block windies who don't recast enough die pretty easily to a libby.

BvC's can beat libbies. Charging a BvC is a gamble, because he can at any time just ww away. If he times it right, then you'll eat that ww and he won't take any damage. So once you remove charge, a libby is just a slower casting hammerdin. But, charge is never really taken away, catch the barb with widow out and he's going to die very quickly to a few charges. The libby just needs to be very careful in how they use charge.
The fact is most Barbs (BvC and BvB) are very easy to beat, simply because most barbs suck. Now before Olga gets his knickers in a knot, I'll say it again. Good barbs can beat libby's, mainly because good barbs can beat hdin's.

WW/trap can also win. But it depends on how the Libby plays. If the Libby chooses to negate the trap damage, then it becomes a lot harder to the sin. And honestly, why wouldn't a libby negate that damage? Especially, if the sin plays defensively and every sin I've ever seen played defensively v's my libby.

When i used to play my libby a lot, I always found bone necro's the hardest. They are not unbeatable (a well built libby can take any build, imo) but with minion stack, good casting rates, max block, non resistable damage and nice ranged attacks they make for very effective libby killers.

Lastly, you could use a hammerdin, but hammer v's hammer = zzzzzz:yawn:

 

[Cheesehed]

wait did we ever come to a conclusion of perfectly played and geared hammer vs perfectly played and geared bvc, or did it come down to what was considered bm?

 

[yelopen]

wait did we ever come to a conclusion of perfectly played and geared hammer vs perfectly played and geared bvc, or did it come down to what was considered bm?

All I remember hearing about is Smash 10-0'ing Kaython. BvC vs. Hammer.

 

[HappyAssassin]

wait did we ever come to a conclusion of perfectly played and geared hammer vs perfectly played and geared bvc, or did it come down to what was considered bm?

Oh please god no. Please refer to the posts on this in other threads. Please stay on topic, best build to kill liberators.

 

[akumaxxyz]

best build. max block bone negro.

 

[mainaman]

I disagree with the BvC. I have never lost to a bvc with my libby. The lack of shield means charge never misses. If they actually start whirling me, hammers take them down faster than they can get me. Again, I've never lost to a bvc.

fcr.

i dissagree. you cant start hammer and hit imediately after you cherged at the BvC and got hit with ww. By the time you hammer they are out of range. I am not trying to say you cant kill them either , just I don't think its as easy as you describe.
i assume you play west , duel mcm if you on nl, or mysticdragon if you play ladder.

 

[akumaxxyz]

i will dool him also if hes back i got access to bvc