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What I've done wrong?

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by DeathMaster, May 9, 2005.

  1. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

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    What I've done wrong?

    I'm serious, pally is teh suxxxor, unless I'm doing something wrong. I'm feeling so "angery" right now. My pally just sux. I even leveled a bit more (lvl78, still no where need andy yet), he is still pwned by anything in A1 Hell.

    Skill wise, I'd building a holy shock zealot, with holy freeze as backup. I know he is not meant to be powerful, but I didn't think he is this much weak.

    1. I cannot run, neither cannot walk. If I run, my block is next to useless (75% became 25%), if I walk, my stupid merc won't follow up, and ranged attackers have much better time to hit. this build cannot survive without block.

    2. my pally just had the first defeat in bettal (LEFE archer pack), breaks my long time tradition that no death ever (at least during questing). He also had to park a boss pack, because it was impossible for him to even come close without getting killed. What come worse is that I know all my other melee could defeat that pack in melee (LE, conviction, LI). Barb has more life and tougher, druid can cast minion, and has more life, assassin has crowd controll. Pally has Nothing! :mad: I mean if 90% res druid can charg into bettal, why a pally cannot (even with 75% block)? I expect to have a melee build, not a cc. :rant:

    3. should I switch string to Tgod? will it make this build any better?
     
  2. poopie_pants

    poopie_pants IncGamers Member

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    What are your skill placements, and equipment? I have made a teslafroster in the past...unfortunately, this build will never be as powerful as a Tesladin or Frost Zealot alone. But they can still be effective. Perhaps if I saw your gear and skills, I might be able to lend what little advice I have :).

    -PP
     
  3. skunkbelly

    skunkbelly IncGamers Member

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    Strange... my HC holy shock pally rocked on players 3 well into hell (he's currently stalled at the Durance, but I'll pick him up again one of these days).

    Couple suggestions:

    1. Get a ranged weapon on switch, preferably a Demon Machine, for those archers/etc.

    2. T-gods can be a big help, but I'm not using it (I have a String on). What is your lightning resist? If you've maxed resist lightning for the synergy, then you ought to have at least 85% lightning resist, even without T-gods.

    3. RUN up to ranged attackers, and then walk when you get to them.

    4. Gamble a ring with Dim Vision charges... can be a big help, if you're still having trouble with archer packs.

    good luck!

    EDIT: and I use Holy Fire as a back-up, which is even worse than holy freeze :)
     
  4. Hrus

    Hrus IncGamers Member

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    I have exactly the same problem with my Paly char from No-Repair tourney. But I have probably much worse items than you. (HC, Untwinked, items cannot be repaired, only 3 runs per area)
    The best you can do is give your merc damage reduction / resists gear and share the hits with him. And with decent gear you should slaughter the monsters quickly. Do you play at P1? Darksight helm or some cheap helm runeword has Cloak of Shadows charges, it should help against the archer bosspack minions. Also the use of Terror/Dim Vision/Grim Ward charges can help a lot.
     
  5. Slothman

    Slothman IncGamers Member

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    Ive a tesladin which i was battling with in hell as well..
    i changed my belt to t-gods for lightning immunity, equipped storm shield and rockstopper for PDR and waited until i could make a cresent moon phase blade.. just small tweaks and i was away!
    after that i could kill relatively quickly (players 1) but it was still dangerous due to not much leach (i had soul drainers equipped but they didnt do much) so i was very very fragile
    i ended up just doing the barney through the game (completing most quests still) and pat'ing at lvl 81 - tried various places (even cows) to try and level up etc yet have basically given up :(

    EDIT: for LI's i would change to conviction aura to remove the immunity and just zeal away with current gear - if more was needed i had gimmershred and tiamats on switch
     
  6. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

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    skillz: 20 zeal (the only way I could hit anything boss/champ, for AR boost), 20 holy shock, 20 res lit, 1 holy shield, 18 holy freeze (will max, then work on res cold).

    resist: 90/90/90/95 at the moment
    Gear: CM PB, Moser's (2x PD), GA (um), shako (15% all joo), string, gore rider, venom grip, B_K ring, ravenfrost, mara's, 1x combat skiller, rest resist, AR (eg. fine small charm of xxxx)

    Merc: reaper's, gaze, duriel's

    Edit2: I must visit all area, try not to park anything ... I guess it is too hard for this build. :(
     
  7. Nightfish

    Nightfish IncGamers Member

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    The part about not being able to run is just wrong. I've been running with basically all my chars and none of them ever came close to dying because of that. Who cares if you can't block while running? If you run and still get hit you are running the wrong way or you don't have enough FRW.

    Aside from that it's just you. Sorry, but it is. Of course the build is not ridiculously powerful but with the right items you can definetly make this work. Here, I'll share my list of items that make chars viable with you:

    - Demon Limb for AR issues
    - Angelic Jewelry to provide flat AR to be multiplied by DL
    - Darksight Helm for Crowd Control if the character has no crowd control of his own
    - Gore Rider for OW, DS & CB

    Just these 5 items (2 rings) make pretty much every melee build viable in hell. And you don't even need a shield, even though in the case of a holy shocker it doesn't make much sense not to have one.
     
  8. kabal

    kabal IncGamers Member

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    Against the archers, try not to run straight at them. Run in a zigzag pattern instead so you're still closing in on them while dodging arrows. If you don't want to do that, you can always charge them since you maintain full blocking and defense during charge.

    Oh, and FELE is pretty much certain death on higher player settings since the FE damage gets carried with every lightning bolt.
     
  9. frosty

    frosty IncGamers Member

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    Dracul's for Life tap

    Change the string to verdungo's but keep a thundergod's for gloams.

    Drop the players setting if possible.

    You shouldn't have AR problems, considering that you are using Crescent Moon.

    How much life you have? Act 1 Hell is difficult at times as the build needs to adjust to the much harder difficulty.
     
  10. poopie_pants

    poopie_pants IncGamers Member

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    These gloves are simply amazing, and if I owned enough of them, all my melee char's would be using a pair. On another note, Nord's would be a solid weapon to have on switch imo because of the boost to A/R, and added cold damage on top of your holy freeze aura. Sounds like you have a pretty good set up, it boggles me that you are struggling as much as it sounds. Keep at it, no character in hell is a walk in the park, that's for sure :).

    -PP
     
  11. cft

    cft IncGamers Member

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    I have almost the same build in Act 4 NM, and he's having trouble.

    He kills stuff ok, but he is very fragile feeling. I have been increasing DEX to keep block maxed; though I plan letting Holy shield help, so I won't need to spend much more on DEX. Hps (life) is kinda low (~700), and his defense isn't enough to really effect the monsters.

    I have a defiance act 2 merc at the moment. I thought about the HF merc, but I have HF aura as my backup skill, so I stayed with the defiance one.

    I think the problem with my guy is that he needs more life. He doesn't leech a lot, cause most of his damage is elemental. When he gets attacked by 3+ monsters, I'm constantly drinking potions to survive. He's almost died like 6 times crossing the River of Fire.

    Cant remember gear exactly. Resists are good, he's probably using too much +skill gear since I was trying to max his Holy shock damage. For Hell, I know I'll have to swap the +3 skill circlet out for something with resists. Weapon is an Aldur's mace with 2 or 3 shaels in it, and I think I've got a crushflange on switch.

    rings are 2x angelics for the AR boost.

    I have fun with the character, but he's very fragile, and that makes him frustrating at the same time.

    @deathmaster: I think your problem may be the same as mine... I need more life because my guy is too fragile right now.
     
  12. PyroStock

    PyroStock IncGamers Member

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    I also find many other classes easier than the Paladin, mostly because they have minions and/or better crowd control skills. Here's what I find has worked (as in by the end of playing I'm not losing money or ending the game with less FullRejuvs than I started with):

    Don't Walk, Charge - Not only do you (usually) get 1st hit, but you stun and knockback the victim. I usually Charge once or a couple times then Zeal. If an enemy boss is too dangerous for me to zeal, I can do several Charges on them and they cannot even touch me. I don't hurt as bad either from LEs for some reason with Charge. After I charge 1 archer and zeal kill her I go charge to the next. And Charge is also an excellent skill to flee with, *no one* can come close to catching me. Just be prepared to hotkey weapon-switch for a second if you get the Charge bug.

    Gloves - Dracul's Grasp do work wonders for Paladins. If you cannot get those use Laying of Hands or good BloodGloves. I have 12%LifeLeech.

    Get Crowd Control equipment - 'Stone' armor would give you a Clay Golem to at least use as a decoy and some nice defense too. Darksight (I've never found this) for DimVision and Cloak of Shadows would be better. I was using Cranebeak for the summons (I like minions/pets) and MF, but those birds also Blind the enemy nicely. I've found 2 rare rings with 6% lifeleech and nice resists that also have DimVision charges on them, but I don't use/need them for now and went with a higher resist ring instead. On switch I have Lacerator and with a few zeals the whole mob is either Amped (which means x2LifeLeech and x2physical damage) and/or everyone except the boss is fleeing. Either way I win. You might consider Rattlecage on your Merc to give him %Chance to Flee and CrushingBlow or maybe Face of Horror if you want him with Shaftstop.

    HolyShield - I have 18 hard pts in HolyShield, not 1, and when combined with my Defiance Merc my defence is over 12k ("enemy chance to hit ~20%") and I'm only using Griswold'sArmor924. I will probably move to an upgraded Shaftstop or my Leviathan soon. Longer duration means I don't waste time recasting it either or have it fall off during a long battle. The 18pts in HolyShield also mean I spend less points in DEX and put them in VIT. My Life at L78 is 1017, OakSage from Nature's Peace kicks it up to 1525, which also increases the life of my pathetic mercenary to 2265, but L5OakSage *cannot* be depended on so don't think Nature'sPeace is what makes most/all the difference as many times the thing is suicidal and I have to fight without it. Archers kill it in a second.

    DamageReduction - I currently have 49% DamageReduction with Stormshield and String. I know some here say never use Stormshield with a Paladin, but HoZ won't drop and my rare Paladin shields suck... and DamageReduction is huge for Paladins so Stormshield fills the DR need perfectly plus max block and nice defence. My resists are lacking a bit at 57/-1/74/-38, but that's mostly because I have 190%MF on now and I can always pump the Cold/Poison resist up with thaw/antidote potions. I do plan to increase my Cold Resist before Act3Blizzards, if I don't have better CR by Duriel I'll probably use CR charms for him. Your Merc should have DR on too.

    Tactics - You can seperate a big mob by retreating, but I prefer to look for narrow passages, corridors, and doorways to fight in, yet that can be difficult in Act1. However, in tough areas by following a wall you will wake less monsters and run into corners that can be used to seperate mobs. It's nice to have 1/2 of a mob waiting their turn to die. :D
     
  13. Hrus

    Hrus IncGamers Member

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    Haha. Looking at Deathmaster's gear. What problems do you have? LOL.
    My gear:
    Gold Long Sword of self-repair (+97AR, repairs durability) (shopping for faster weapons and using them until they break)
    Artisan's Crown of Frost Shield (+72 MF, chance to cast Frost nova) 39/50 Durability
    Stealth Superior Cuirass 20/50 Dur
    Gemmed Heraldic Shield (+95 resist all) 25/40 DUR
    rare Heavy Gloves (FR 18%, CR 8%, adds 1-5 fire damage, replenish life +4, 20% IAS) 5/14 Dur
    rare Heavy Belt (+5 life, FR 27%, CR 19%, 10% FHR, repairs durability)
    Vidala's Fetlock 11/18 Dur
    Vidala's Snare
    rare Ring (62 mana, 47 AR, LR 10%, 3% LL, replenish life +4)
    rare Ring (+15 Energy, 116 AR, PR 12%, 6 %MF)
    +some crappy charms

    Merc:
    Strength ethereal Partizan,
    rare Hydraskull (10% ED, CR 14%, chance to cast Frost Nova, repairs Durability)
    Godly Ancient Armor of Stability (150% ED, 24% FHR)

    skills (no +skills):
    4 zeal, 5 holy shield, 20 Holy Shock, 20 Holy Freeze, 20 resist lightning, 8 resist cold

    Now you tell me that you have difficulties :rolleyes:
     
  14. mad.as.a.meataxe

    mad.as.a.meataxe IncGamers Member

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    I've found too that Act I is probably more difficult than any of the other acts in hell. My first Pat, Sir Wincalot - a frost zealot, had real trouble in act one with ranged attackers but eventually managed to get by by equipping Shaftstop. That said you do already have some PDR on but perhaps a little more might help. I think you can get attract charges on rings too which is a very useful ability against ranged attackers. Just cast it on one of them and all of his mates start attacking him allowing you to run up and start zealing.

    MAAM
     
  15. sunbearie

    sunbearie IncGamers Member

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    If ranged chars are your bane, how abt a Gloom armour since it casts dim vision on the monsters. Thats should give you a little time to charge up to them.

    Another tip is to use conversion. You don't need a hard pt, just buy a 1-5 conversion sceptor and use it to convert some of the melee monsters. They'll provide a living shield for you while you charge to the archers.
     
  16. Gouda

    Gouda IncGamers Member

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    I used similar tactics on my untwinked no uniques or set items paladin. He was a pure zealot, so a lot more physical damage/leach, but similar amounts of life and defense/blocking. He used conversion a lot, to create a few targets to hide behind. Still Slingers and gloams were a pain due to pierce.
    IIRC conversion doesn't actually need to hit, the conversion chance is applied at each attack. Not sure though, but it always seemed to go quick.

    Other than that: take it easy advance step by step, run away a lot and the best of luck! You'll get there

    Gouda
     
  17. ArchAngel Tiberrius

    ArchAngel Tiberrius Banned

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    Paladins are the most versatile build around.

    Straight away I see two problems. Moser's Blessed Circle and Holy Shield. With the setup you provided you have +7 Holy Shield - how are you achieving maximum block? (Is this achieved through Moser's?) The ultimate shield for a Paladin is Herald of Zakarum. If you don't have it then get it (trade, steal, beg, find). It alone will not stop your woes but it will help. I would suggest placing some more points into Holy Shield as well, the skill is simply incredible since 1.10 was phased in.

    Again, like the others suggested I would switch your gloves for Dracul's if possible. What you are looking for with these gloves is the CtC Life Tap.

    If you can a Delerium helm for your mercenary will help you with some crowd control.

    You really shouldn't have too many problems with archer packs. Get to them quickly and hit them hard.
     
  18. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

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    My setup does not need any additional Dex to reach max block, moser's + GA + holy shield = more than 75% block if the game allows (without holy shield, block rate is 70%+). If I can level him to lvl99, I promise holy shield will be boosted.

    I know HoZ is better (I need the +skills too), however, it doesn't grow on trees. I don't trade, don't MP, don't hack, and once D2 god knows what you want, it will never drop.

    the problem with Dracul's is that I lost it (with a char), never found another one yet, and I don't like to override my merc reaper's either.

    I think I will try to use charge, I have never used it yet, time to give it a go. And I will try to increase HP too, at the moment my pally only has 1.1k (30 stat points saved, if I don't need anything more in str - eg no need to change to heavier gear, they will all go Vit).
     

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