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Venom Combined With Poison Skills.

Discussion in 'Theorycrafting and Statistics' started by PFS, Nov 15, 2006.

  1. PFS

    PFS IncGamers Member

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    Venom Combined With Poison Skills.

    I asked this in the Amazon forum, but have some expansions and thought here would be the best place:

    This question comes from this thread: HERE

    Where:

    My Questions:

    1. Is this true that Venom stacks with Poison Javelin?
    2. If Yes - will monsters infected by the clouds from Poison Javalin and Plague Javalin be infected with the same boosted poison damage?
    3. Will this also work for Rabies?
    4. If yes then will it also work for when a monster infects another monster with Rabies?
    5. Long shot - will it work for poison nove or poison explosion on necros?
     
  2. pedu

    pedu IncGamers Member

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    I havent noticed anything weird or super poison with rabies and the venom from grief. Cant say for the rest tho.



     
  3. SSoG

    SSoG IncGamers Member

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    Since I'm the guy that inspired the questions, I'll do my best to answer them.

    1. Yes, absolutely 100% tested and true.
    2. Nope. It's only on actual physical hits that the poisons stack.
    3. Nope. Rabies is the redheaded stepchild of the Poison world. It doesn't work by adding a single long-duration poison- it works by adding a series of constantly reapplying short-duration poisons. Anyway, long story short, Venom will not add with Rabies and last for the full duration like it will with Poison Javelin (although it won't overwrite Rabies, either- the two will stack in a weird way). Needless to say, Rabies is a very odd skill that I could spend an entire post describing by itself.
    4. #3 was nope, so #4 was irrelevant. When Rabies spreads, it carries *NO* additional damage beyond what is provided by the Rabies skill itself.
    5. No, but it will work for Poison Dagger on Necros.



     
  4. PFS

    PFS IncGamers Member

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    Seems like a damn good way to seriously boost damage from Poison Zons...

    Tempted to go out and make one now!
     
  5. SSoG

    SSoG IncGamers Member

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    It's not. Not to discourage you from making Poison Amazons- they're dang good characters!- it's just that the damage bonus from Venom, in the grand scheme of things, is truly pathetic. Remember, with the craziest, l33test of gear it would still take over a minute to take down Baal using Poison Javelin (to say nothing of the 10 minutes it takes to set up the kill before you even enter battle with him). I could name you probably 20 different builds that could kill Baal a TON faster than that. Heck, if you just give your merc some CB and tag Baal with PMH, your merc could probably kill Baal faster than that BY HIMSELF.

    Consider this: A slvl 30, fully synergized Poison Javelin with the Venom from Treachery will deal about 1219 damage second. The keyword here is *PER SECOND*. There's a half-second casting delay, so you'll be throwing fewer than 2 per second (thanks to the attack animation), and Poison Javelin doesn't offer a single drop of AR (meaning you'll need to throw 5-10 times before you finally land a hit). Plague Javelin offers some AR, but that one has a FOUR SECOND casting delay, so that's no good, either. A fully synergized slvl 30 Plague Javelin will deal 1478.9 damage per hit, though- over 20% more damage per second than the Treachery-boosted Poison Javelin. So even adding Treachery doesn't bring Poison Javelin up to Plague in terms of damage per second- and adding some more +skills to the mix only causes the gap to widen.

    For a poison character, you shouldn't care at all about total damage- Damage Per Second is the important statistic, since you can always refresh a shorter duration poison if it runs out. I mean, imagine there was a poison that dealt one damage per second, but lasted for a million seconds. Would you like to sit around for 3 hours waiting for a Fallen to die in Hell? Sure, that poison will deal a million damage EVENTUALLY, but I don't have all day to sit around waiting for monsters to die. Poison Javelin might deal twice as much damage as Plague Javelin sometimes, but it lasts 5 times as long, so you could cast 5 Plague Javelins in that time and deal WAY more damage.

    In other words, that Treachery trick is a gimmick, a useless little trick. For your sake, I'd recommend forgetting I ever mentioned it. Its real-world applications are essentially nil, since it's such a slow-acting poison. If you want to make a Poison Amazon, use Plague Javelin and don't worry at all about Venom.

    Edit: again, don't let this discourage you from making a Plague Javazon if you really want to. High-end Plague Javazons can deal some seriously significant damage per second. With good gear, it's no problem to break 5,000 damage per second applied over entire crowds for 20 seconds, which is 100,000 damage per cast, with no AR needed.



     
  6. RTB

    RTB IncGamers Member

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    You don't need to tag him with PMH, the regeneration rates for the normal act bosses are neglectable. The same as +1 repl life to be exact.

    The AR bonus is bugged, and doesn't apply. Just like the other ranged skills of the amazon.



     
  7. SSoG

    SSoG IncGamers Member

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    I was referring to Hell difficulty. The whole question arose when I discussed how Poison Javelin could be used to 1-hit-kill Hell Baal.



     
  8. Rekk_Dalton

    Rekk_Dalton IncGamers Member

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    i dont thing rtb was referring to "normal" difficulty i think he meant the end boss of each act as opposed to the ubers. I've never seen them regenerate before.
     
  9. SSoG

    SSoG IncGamers Member

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    Hmm... I knew they didn't in Normal difficulty. I always assumed that they did in Nightmare and Hell, but I just never noticed because I always pack PMH, OW, or Poison Damage on all of my characters to counteract regen. Good to know.



     

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