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Two minute cooldowns

Discussion in 'Diablo 3 General Discussion' started by Spens, Jul 8, 2011.

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  1. Spens

    Spens IncGamers Member

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    Two minute cooldowns

    Bashiok has mentioned that the last tier of Barbarian skills have two minute cooldowns.

    http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=27811631611&sid=3000&pageNo=1

    Do you like or dislike or are neutral "long" cooldowns like this?
     
  2. Hyliangod

    Hyliangod IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    i don't like it, if theres something that powerful that they need to stick such a long cooldown on it i think it should just be brought down to a more reasonable level rather than having a big cooldown slapped on it.
     
  3. kemo

    kemo IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    I like it from a PvP point of view. BOOM BOOM
     
  4. fnaxqtr

    fnaxqtr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    i dont like it at all. i hope i can spam my awesome abilities like in d2 and if not i can go play wow ..... cds suck! (in pvm)

    for pvp i can understand that feature, maybe in arena there should be cds


     
  5. ElementEight

    ElementEight IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    World of Warcraft all over again?
     
  6. fnaxqtr

    fnaxqtr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    Maybe they add silences as well and raid instances where bossfights taking 1 hour of your lifetime.
    Then CD everything... ITS FINISHED a WOW in Diablo STYLE
    I do hope so much that this isnt going to ruin my expectations of d3....

    ....


     
  7. HardRock

    HardRock IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    Based on my experience with other ARPGs (Titan Quest and Dungeon Siege for example) I don't mind longer CDs. It makes you think about using your powerful skills more tactically, especially in PvP, and possibly even in PvM, depending on the game's difficulty.

    They already did according to the Wiki (which may be outdated ofcourse). Arcane Spell critical hits silences enemies and possibly players too to some extent.
     
  8. Spens

    Spens IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    Waiting to cast something sucks. I like to be constantly using an ability, not spending most of the time auto-attacking, winding up a spell or waiting for a cooldown.

    Hopefully there are enough spamable spells to keep that D2 feel.



     
  9. fnaxqtr

    fnaxqtr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    About that PvP Comment--> Of course there has to be cd on some skills in pvp. But in order to do that they should only use cds in battle arenas.
    And just for the record, if i want to play pvp i go play dota and not diablo. I played lots of PvP in D2 and enjoyed but it doesnt have the features in the game to be actually balanced, maybe that is different in D3 but i dont play Diablo for PVP. I WANNA SLASH SOME MONSTERS and find equip. grind some bosses with my friends ect.


    My reasons would be
    1st: I want to play diablo to slash some enemies with my overwhelming looking skills.
    2nd: I dont care about short cds, but do you really think it is necesarry to put on a 2minute cd onto a skill in diablo? Its fine if its 4 seconds or something

    !!This is all highly speculative, we dont have any information about how long the skills work or how imba they are. And maybe there are some sets in the game which can reduce the cd significantly... we just dont know!!


     
  10. konfeta

    konfeta IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    Some context.

    http://www.diablowiki.net/Barbarian_Skills#Tier_Seven_Skills

    Um.... So... Holy ****. I honestly did not expect 2 minute long cooldowns. Though, in retrospect, should have, given that being able to use those skills every fight would dramatically change how the Barbarian plays... (Summon, Omega-level AoE Nuke, and a super steroid). I wonder how this will interact with arenas, specifically, will cooldowns reset between rounds? Probably, otherwise it would add stalling as a desirable tactic for the losing team instead of just getting it over with and dying.

    Lulz PvP team build - 3 Barbarians with maxed out Earthquake attempt to instagib the enemy team. I would pay extra to be able to pull that off at least once.

    Should be interesting to see how these will be balanced. For practical intents and purposes, that means Barbarian (and other classes likely) are getting "IWIN" buttons for hard situations. I am really hoping that they won't be long duration "IWIN" buttons, as in you use them to clear out the current screen and basically over. Though they might elect to go for varying duration, (Earthquake being a quick nuke, Wrath lasting 5-10 seconds, Ancients lasting a bit longer than that). But I think it's a bad idea. These kinds of skills were cool in Titan Quest, but they were honestly on the "trivialize the game" side. Hopefully, there won't be +skill equipment so that getting a pumped up powerful "IWIN" button has permanent repercussions to your standard monster killing stuff.


    Now, the other interesting bit of news is cooldown reduction equipment. I like that he said "slightly," cooldown reduction is potentially the most powerful, gamebreaking statistic you can put into a game if you don't control it very, very tightly. I am really hoping this will be "Unique item or Set Bonus to reduce cooldown of a single skill" type of cooldown reduction instead of universal "lol -25% to all your cooldowns" bull****.
     
  11. fnaxqtr

    fnaxqtr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    IWIN buttons suck to some extent!
    For Example:
    My favorite D2 Skill Lighting Fury (Java) is also an IWIN button under good circumstances (Infinity Merc, good eqip).

    Whats your opinion on this ? Shouldnt I be able to do some IWIN even if have all the items?


     
  12. konfeta

    konfeta IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    IWIN is fine in small dosages, but really, if you can IWIN your way through the most challenging areas the game has to offer, the game rapidly stops being interesting (at least for me).

    Another problem I suspect with uber skills is their scaling for point. If a skill already starts off being a screen massacre device, how exactly do you scale it fairly compared to normal attack skills? What is the benefit you gain for putting 10 points in Earthquake instead of Shockwave or Cleave? Overkilling monsters ten times over instead of twice over?

    And, lastly, such uber skills have a major problem of being essentially anti-tactics. Every two minutes you can press a button to devastate everything around you. Hilarious. Also, brainless. With something like Leap Attack, Whirlwind, Ground Stomp, or Earthquake there is decision making involved with positioning, timing, attention to resources, etc. (at least I hope there will be). With an uber skill? Hardly likely. Perhaps in PvP or gauntlet style monster/boss fights...

    I mean, they might be able to figure out how to keep such skills balanced, perhaps opportunity cost of points/skill slot that doesn't do anything most of the time is severe enough to make them "balanced," but we will have to see.
     
  13. Telzen

    Telzen IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    Maybe uber skill isn't as uber as you think? Maybe they will only be IWIN buttons if maxed out? We don't know how strong these skills are even going to be.
     
  14. fnaxqtr

    fnaxqtr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    I dont like uber-skills ether but its funny to run threw CS and kill everything ? if you are actually a high char and only looking to get 99 anyway.
    I know what you mean , you want the game to be challenging and not a noobgame which can rescue you from a bunch of monsters which surounded you and already making the killing blow BAM I PRESS RIGHT MOUSEBUTTON FOR UBERUBERBAM and i am safe again.
    I dont want that ether but i want to be IWIN when i have finished the game (hell and have all the items that i need or at least almost)!
    thats what i want


     
  15. fnaxqtr

    fnaxqtr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    yeah everything is hypothetical


     
  16. spindrjr

    spindrjr IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    I certainly wasn't expecting 2 minute cooldowns. In my mind, it seems like most skills in an ARPG should be spammable (maybe most still are). I hope these higher tier spells don't take too many points. It would be painful putting a bunch of points into something I can only use every 2 minutes (or maybe 1.5 with some trait etc.).

    I guess this is another one to file under "I'll have to try it to see".
     
  17. Nojin

    Nojin IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    This is a good thing because it differentiates abilities, and adds incentive to add diversity and strategy rather than spamming your most powerful ability.

    Adding a long CD on powerful abilities forces the player to choose when and where to use these abilities. A player that uses the ability every 2 minutes may not do as well as a player who uses them at strategic moments.

    Additionally, the IWIN concept would only be unbalanced if other character classes did not also have the IWIN button, or analogous abilities. In PVP, there should always be a way to defend against this.

    Last point, there is a possibility that one or more runes could limit the power of the ability, but remove or reduce the CD of it -- thus altering the ability so everyone wins (including those that prefer not to use strategy and would rather spam their abilities).


    EDIT
    One thing I forgot to mention -- the long CD abilities don't necessarily have to be "IWIN buttons." Rather, they just have to be more powerful than your regular abilities. In other words, it could have a relatively small damage bonus over your other abilities (maybe 2x), thus giving you a reason to use it over your spammed spells, but not necessarily automatically winning the battle.

    Some examples of this: the Call of the Ancients doesn't necessarily have to dominate everything on screen. It *DOES* have to look cool, which is an important aspect of the long CD abilities (you have to *look* like you made a huge impact on the battle). But the Ancients that are summoned don't need to destroy everything on screen, they just need to help enough to turn the tide.

    Another example I'd like to use is a defensive ability. I would prefer if an ability like Diamond Skin for the Wizard had a somewhat long CD (though it doesn't need to be 2 minutes). I don't want to see Wizard's in constant Diamond Skin mode, and would rather see them use the ability strategically. We already know Teleport has a CD, so many other abilities such as this could be on the same kind of CD-for-the-sake-of-strategy system.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2011
  18. novocaine

    novocaine IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    i like the idea. it makes it so you dont just spam the same spell over and over like d2
     
  19. cacophony

    cacophony IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    No problems here. I wonder what the longest cooldown on an active ability in the game will be. My money's on 5 minutes.

    Also, there may be traits, runes, and just plain old skill points which reduce the cooldown. Hell, traits could do something really neat; let your other, spammable skills lower the cooldown of your super skills. Example: "Berserker's Discipline. Your Bash or Cleave critical strikes lower the cooldown on your Wrath of the Berserker by 10 seconds. Cannot lower the cooldown below 40 seconds." So, you pop Wrath, smash some faces. Cooldown at 2min. You run around and Cleave some monsters, and you crit. Boom, timer goes down 10 seconds. You can do this four times (lowering a total of 40 seconds). Makes you think about your rotations a bit more.
     
  20. elganame

    elganame IncGamers Member

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    Re: Two minute cooldowns

    2 minutes CD? Mmmm We need to see the skill first but 2 minutes is a long time, sounds like a escape or last hope skill to me.

    About uber skills in the arena, dont forget that the skills will have a diferent impact in PvP as in the PvE. Jay told us so! :O
     
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