Trying to build a trapper

[jag]

Trying to build a trapper

I have read some of the guides on trappers, maybe i have missed the answers to my questions.

1. Can a dual fire/lightning PvM build be viable for Hell?
2. Is the sentry corpse explosion physical or elemental damage?
3. What synergies are best in my idea of a dual fire lightning trapper? Increasing # of shots or % of damage?

I plan to get decent armor, shield and as many skillers as i can find for assassin skills. I will be looking for a weapon mainly for + skills more than for actual combat usage. The only item i already have for this build is a +3 trap skills amulet requiring level 50 something on one of my mules

I have no problem literally investing every skill point in just the fire and lightning columns. My though by having both is to have a decent chance of overcoming immunes in hell.

Do i need to diversify into some shadow skills to make this viable or is this possible

 

[Speedwrath]

Firstly, the questions:

1) Can a dual fire/lightning PvM build be viable for Hell?
Well I think it will depend if you can get the damage high enough. I'll discuss that later.

2) Is the sentry corpse explosion physical or elemental damage?
It os 50% fire damage and 50% physical damage. Because of this, fire immunes won't get a lot of damage, and neither will physical immunes. Fire AND physical immunes I think will get no damage, but I haven't tested that. And yes, they DO exist. -_-

3) What synergies are best in my idea of a dual fire lightning trapper? Increasing # of shots or % of damage?
Since you can only pretty much max 4 skills by level 80, and since +skills do not add to synergies, you are left with a very hard choice. Read what's next.

Question 1 and 3 are sort of linked. If you want to do enough damage with both, you won't be able to do HUGE Lightning damage or HUGE Fire damage. You'll have to do a bit less of both. I'm imagining you'll use Lightning Sentry and Wake of Inferno as main skills. If you look at your tree, you'll see that Fire Blast gives MORE bonus (10%) than Wake of Fire (7%). So you'll want to get Fire Blast AND Wake of Inferno for a high Fire damage.

As for Lightning, you'll see that Lightnign Sentry gets 12% bonus from all the other Lightnign skills. BUT WAIT!!! Death Sentry also gives bonus to Wake of Inferno! So getting Lightning Sentry and Death Sentry would be a nice option too, plus it would give you Corpse Explosion as another damage source.

You still have 12 skill points left at level 80. You can start maxing another skill for synergie, or you can put points in like Mind Blast or Shadows or Burst of Speed / Fade.

As for maxing damage, try and look for a wand with Lower Resist charges. Those are good. Also, get AS MANY +trap items as you can, for it will really help. The best thing you can get is an Act 2 Merc with Infinity runeword, as that gives your Merc the Conviction aura, which will lower enemies' resistance and increase your damage A LOT! It makes SOME Lightning Immune monsters become Non-Immune, so you can see how usefull that is.

If you get all of this, then I think you "might" have a chance in Hell, but I don't expect you to be a super killing machine.
You'll be like my Poison Necro: he's slow... but he gets there in the end.

 

[Cave]

I made a few lightning/fire trappers and from experience I think FB is a better choice then wake of fire or wake of inferno.

Best way to go, atleast my oppinion, is to have lightning sentry as main skill.
Will you use him for mf'ing later? If so, where? If you are going to run bosses like meph CBS is pretty strong.
Leveling/quest-wise, DS is a better choice then CBS.
CBS is pretty much useless because two reasons.
1: Doesnt pierce
2: Miss small targets. (but strong against single large targets)

Both DS and CBS gives bonus to LS.
And it's not very often you run across large single targets.
So I would first max LS, then one of the synergies.
If I had to remake my trapper I would have spent more points to DS.
What I did was to focus on CBS but I realized I never use it.
And make sure you have FB maxed(or almost) before entering hell diffuculty.

I don't like being dependant on my merc to drop the first few corpses for my DS to tear up lightning immune enemies. So it's very nice having FB as backup, it acctually does significant damage as it get bonus from all traps.

Traps require alot of skill points so don't expect to have a strong shadow warrior/master. And I agree with Speedwrath that a lower resist wand comes handly. However I play untwinked and have a teleport staff on switch, I play hardcore and it has saved my *** a few times.

A pretty cheap weapon is a long sword with a Spirit runeword. +2 skills, 100+ mana and some other mods. Rhyme shield is pretty easy to get too, if your not very rich.

 

[jag]

So let me see if I have this right as being possible
Level 80 build - total of 92 skill points (including quests)

20 to fire blast
10 to wake of fire
20 to wake of inferno - 13k-15k fire damage

1 to shock web
1 to charge bolt sentry
20 to lightning sentry
20 to death sentry -- will shoot 11 times at 1-3299 per shot lightning + max range on CE

Probably easiest to just load up fire to start with. Once level 30 then build up lightning. Not too many immunes in normal to worry about.

I will definitely need to get decent equipment for defense and speed. Merc suggestion is good too

 

[jag]

totally messed up the damage calculations -- sorry for double post but exceeded the time limit to edit it...

So let me see if I have this right as being possible
Level 80 build - total of 92 skill points (including quests)

20 to fire blast
10 to wake of fire
20 to wake of inferno - 439-511 fire damage 10 shots

1 to shock web
1 to charge bolt sentry
20 to lightning sentry
20 to death sentry -- will shoot 11 times at 1-1040 per shot lightning + max range on CE

Probably easiest to just load up fire to start with. Once level 30 then build up lightning. Not too many immunes in normal to worry about.

 

[Cave]

Hmm.

I don't know how Inferno work in traps but I know normal Inferno sorcs cast is bugged, only half damage. Apparently the beam is acctually 2 beams and cannot damage at the same time. Maybe someone here on forum knows if traps is affected by the same bug.

I never built a trapper that focus on fire damage. I always have LS as main skills and try to max LS synergies as much as possible.


My lv78 looks like this(half thru hell):
20 FB
18 SW
20 CBS
20 LS
1 DS

I use FB instead of Wake because it gain synergi bonus from ALL traps.
Now I only haft to focus on adding skills to LS synergies. Win-Win situation if you ask me. High lightning damage and fire damage as bonus.

If I had to rebuild my current build it would look like this at lv78:
20 FB
9 SW
20 CBS
20 LS
10 DS

It would give me alittle more radius on my DS, CBS(my boss killer) would be weaker then it is now but it would still damage more then LS on single targets.


I used act2 defiance merc. If I could find a good eth polearm I could make him an insight, traps tend to eat mana lika crazy.
Guess you could use holy freeze merc too but for some reason my defiance merc always seem to last longer. Iam no merc expert.

 

[Speedwrath]

Using THIS calculator, which I find very handy:

http://diablo2.ingame.de/spiel/skills/calc/index.php?char=assa

It calculates the damage for us and tells us synergies for the skills. Pretty useful, no? I know it's in German, but from the symbols, and using a bit of logic and common sense, you can pretty much use it just as normally as a German player would.

And from those damages ranges... I might say... if you go to Hell, you might get disappointed.

I put in your skill set up in the calc. Then I put in some +skill points that you should get from your items.

For the poor, you can get a two +3 trap claws, +2 trap Circlet and +3 trap Amulet for an extra of 11 extra points. Your damage goes up significantly, and it might be possible to do Act 1 Hell easily with that. But other acts... I don't know.

Now if you're rich... Oh yes boy have you got a good build here. Yes indeed. If you are rich you can get:

- Two +3 trap claws (for +6 total)
- A +3 to traps Amulet
- A nice helmet that offers +2 skills (Shako, Andy's, Delirium, etc.).
- Enigma Runeword, which adds +2 skills and gives you Teleport.
- Arachnid Mesh Spider Web Sash for +1 skills and some other cool stuff.
- Two Stone of Jordan Rings which will add +2 to your total skills.
Fast boots, and a FCR gloves will also help. I don't think you can find +trap gloves, but if they exist, YAY!!!!!

And also, let's say, 5 trap skillers, and let's not forget our Act 2 Mercenary with Infinity in it.

Now if you get all of that, you will have 21 extra skill points. That will boost your damage to:

Fire Blast: 4461 - 5224 Fire Damage. Forget the other fire traps, that's all the fire damage you need!!!
Lightning Sentry: 1 - 4142 Lightning Damage. That's what I used to do with my old trapsin, but she was PURE LIGHTNING!!!
Wake of Inferno: 1241 - 1359 Fire Damage. But why use this, when you have Fire Blast which attacks MUCH faster than this one?
Death Sentry: 1 - 3264 Lightning Damage. Plus the Corspe Explosion at MAXED radius it will be casting. It's almost worth replacing Lightning Sentry.

And this is only the damage listed WITHOUT your merc's conviction aura!!! You'll actually be doing much more than that against monsters affected by your merc aura.

So yeah, you could do very well with a build like this, but you'll need some very expensive stuff. :/

 

[Cave]

I normally use d2items's skill planner, very easy to use.

Iam halfway thru hell(just about to kill meph) and all I have is +2 skills.
Havnt come accross any problems yet.
Been trying to gamble for a good circlet/amulet/claw, probably spent over 5mil gold and not a single +assassin/trap item. This is why I don't gamble with real money!

btw speed, those skills I wrote ealier, that's not my final skills. I will try to max them all(18 in SW) but I am only lv78 right now.
Only said what I had this far, perhaps I failed to inform I would try to max them all when I had the points enought to do so.

 

[jag]

Thanks all -- very helpful

Dont know the assassins that well -- seeing now the damage possible fb i realize i dont need to really go much further in fire skills -- dump rest in lightning - get my shadow and i should be good.

 

[Speedwrath]

I normally use d2items's skill planner, very easy to use.

Iam halfway thru hell(just about to kill meph) and all I have is +2 skills.
Havnt come accross any problems yet.
Been trying to gamble for a good circlet/amulet/claw, probably spent over 5mil gold and not a single +assassin/trap item. This is why I don't gamble with real money!

btw speed, those skills I wrote ealier, that's not my final skills. I will try to max them all(18 in SW) but I am only lv78 right now.
Only said what I had this far, perhaps I failed to inform I would try to max them all when I had the points enought to do so.

That's a pure lightning build. :/ I don't know how you manage.

But what I was trying to explain is how a Fire AND Lightning Assassin could do well in Hell. A pure lightning assassin like yourself will have trouble against lightning immunes like those Beasts that throw lightning balls at you. They come charging at you so fast that Fire Blast with that damage won't get rid of them in time.
The build I suggested takes care of Fire AND Lightning Immunes. My WW Barb does 5k damage, and he kills groups pretty quick. Fire Blast will be doing MORE than 5k damage, so against non-Fire immunes, you can imagine...

 

[utaelr]

Just one thing id like to point out real quick that could make a huge jump in your build. put at least 1 single point into each and every synergy you have. having that 1 point will allow your +skills items to bump them up to significant lvls where you might come out fairly well off, ESPECIALLY with Fireblast and its 50 million synergies.

 

[Cave]

utaelr: +skills items doesnt add synergi bonus. Only real points do that.

I manage pretty fine. Sure, my damage isnt super high yet, due to the lack of +skill items. But I get the work done. Took a while to learn how FB works, sometimes you have too shoot infront of them so it would hit.
If there are alot of lightning immune rushing me, I try to get them into a ball then cast CoS. Then start throwing FBs, when first corpse drop I use DS, most of them has reduced life due to FB radius.

I am one of those guys who get bored when things are to easy. So this char suits me perfect. But I am confident, with the claws/circlet/amu you mentioned speedwrath, a "pure" lightning assassin with maxed FB, can kill very rapidly. (unless they are both fire and lightning immune, then you haft to rely on the physical damage from DS and your merc)

But I guess maxing FB comes at a cost, my shadow skills are very low. So low I don't even use my shadow warrior/master due to the fact she dies after 2-3 hits. But Iam sure she will improve once I get more +skills.

How would you place your skills, speedwrath?
For a versitile build, doable in hell.

 

[Speedwrath]

Easy - I just wouldn't make a trap assassin. ^_^

Unless I was very rich and could afford ANYTHING. Read that HUGE post of mine where I give some equipment to use. That would be what I would where. As for skills I'd put:

20 Fire Blast
20 Shock Web
20 Lightning Sentry
20 Death Sentry
10 Charged Bolt Sentry
1 to all Shadow Discipline skills except Fade, Venom and Shadow Master. Finished at level 85, and it will KICK butt in ANY area of Hell.

 

[utaelr]

Interesting Cave thanks for the info there. thought they did add.