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trangouls vs other stuff

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by Imconfused123, Apr 1, 2004.

  1. Imconfused123

    Imconfused123 IncGamers Member

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    trangouls vs other stuff

    what do u think is better for a poison necro and why...

    trangouls or

    shako;
    homo;
    frosties/cast gloves;
    arachnid mesh;
    skullders/any other +skills cept godly crap like enigma/COH

    also, if i make a poison necro in Hardcore, should i go for max block (for of course block, but also chance to hit with PD) or huge HP
     
  2. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    I'll let Mad Mantis or HoSv1 cover all the nice things of hello and such. On to your build:

    Start Here

    That is my guide to a poison / summon hybrid. Now there are many threads on poison necro's and such, you may want to do a search in this forum for them, as the posts and replies of help may be of greater assistance to you.

    So to start...

    I do not like the trangs 3 piece and a biscuit, because with uniques and such, you can get MUCH better total mods then you can with that, except the fire skills. Not taking cost into mind, you can get better +pd / -pr from jewels while getting more +skills. This is without Bramble.

    My ideal (non runeword heavy) build would look like this in terms of gear selection:

    Helm: Shako
    Armor: Up'd Skin of the Vipermagi
    Weapon: Death's Web
    Shield: Homonculus
    Gloves: Trang's (fcr / cold res / +2 curses)
    Rings: +skill (bk / soj) / raven (dex for block) / wisp (oak sage)
    Amulet: Mara's
    Boots: Silkweaves
    Belt: Arachnid Mesh

    Now I know the death's web / arachnid / rings may be expensive, but a poison necro is like a damn MERCEDES-BENZ. Your going to pay for the style and class. If you cannot afford those items, I strongly recommend for a weapon anything with +skills (pn / pnb / all necro), gloomstrap belt is a good one, and a rare / magic ring would work.

    That allots a good amount of +skills, mana, fcr, +pd, -pr, so on and so forth. With above listed gear, p.diamond shield, and a couple sc's for res and your fine. Leaving weapon / armor / helm slots for poison facets.

    As for block. I'd suggest it in SC, especially HC.

    Stats should look something like this:
    Strength: 90 (depending on final gear choice really)
    Dexterity: 180+ (depending on char level, you want 75% chance to block at all times with homo. 180'ish is that amount for 80'ish levels.)
    Vitality: REST (it's life man...should I really explain?)
    Energy: You can get away with base energy if you got good mana gear, and/or are not afraid to buy/use a blue pot once in a while.


    For skills, since Poison only takes up 62 mandatory points, this leaves you with roughly 30'ish points (if you plan on making it into the 80's). You may want to consider using Bone armor, since you'll have some extra points laying around, and defense is great for HC.

    I'd suggest:
    Max Poison Dagger
    Max Poison Explosion
    Max Poison Nova
    1 Teeth
    1 CE
    1 Bone Armor
    Max Bone Wall
    1 Clay Golem
    1 Golem Mastery
    1 Summon Resist
    1 ea curse, more into DV + Decrep + LR if necessary (+skills should carry these pretty far)

    Poison is the killer, curses are the controller, and bone wall / armor are the defense. A strong bone wall will give a good synergy to armor, and a great way to seperate your battlefield.

    You'll need a good merc to take out poison immunes, now this is where wealth comes into play. Normally I'd say just a Holy Freeze merc would do. But this isn't your average Honda. This is fine Mercedes-Benz craftsmanship we're talking.

    Now if you can spare it, get a might merc with a 'DOOM' weapon. This will give him a holy freeze aura + might. So his dmg will be good enough to kill / keep him alive, while slowing everything down for you.

    If you cannot afford 'Doom', just use holy freeze. No question there really.

    So I hope this helps. Take care, and I'll post more answers if you have more questions.

    fluffy g
    :yep:
     
  3. Mad Mantis

    Mad Mantis D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator

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    You are right G about Poisonmancers being expensive. That is why I am not building one at the moment. I do need to look at your posted set-up. Sounds nice.
     
  4. EuroJamie

    EuroJamie IncGamers Member

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    Just out of interest, what are we calling the biscuit here :scratch:
     
  5. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    its a 3 piece set. kinda like at kfc, you can get a 3 piece + a biscuit.

    im funny.

    fluffy g
     
  6. EuroJamie

    EuroJamie IncGamers Member

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    Aha. Well that saves me from scouring D2items for a Cruel Biscuit of Evisceration

    *ponders what extra mods it would have* :scratch:
     
  7. Starcrunch

    Starcrunch IncGamers Member

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    gvandale,
    If its a MERCEDES-BENZ why not go with Bramble or Chains of Honor or Enigma...although I do realize there are some nice mods on Skin of the Vipermagi and it is much easier to get (for instance I have it, while I don't have any of the runewords but if you can make Doom I'm sure you could make Bramble).

    -Starcrunch
     
  8. belth

    belth IncGamers Member

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    You're only getting +1 skills in exchange for the -25% poison resist, rest of the mods are somewhat even. The 20% FCR on Arachnid can be seen to match the Cannot Be Frozen on TO Belt (you can swap out the Raven for a FCR ring for instance) and the total +resists are around the same from the "triad".

    I'd go as far as to say that the -25% poison resist is much more beneficial than the +1 skills in Hell, NM and Normal you can get most monsters to -100% poison resist with a decent Lower Resist and Death's Web, but the amount of immunes in Hell change that.
     
  9. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    belth: i don't think your taking resistance into account. While your info is correct. you get more res off base uniques, leaving your sockets open for p.facets, which inturn up your dmg, and lower res.

    starcrunch: bramble is expensive as hell. i recommend it definately, just dont have one...YET...

    fluffy g
     
  10. Starcrunch

    Starcrunch IncGamers Member

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    Cool, thats what I figured.

    -Starcrunch
     
  11. belth

    belth IncGamers Member

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    I fail to see how I didn't take resists in to account
    but here's an overview:

    TO gloves+Arachnid+Homonculus:
    +30 cold res
    +40 all res
    +190 res total

    TO "triad":
    +40 poi res
    +38-45 fire res
    +70 cold res
    +148-155 res total

    UM the TO Wing and Facet the Homonculus, results in a 15-20 resist edge for the uniqs and the "triad" is still leading with -20% enemy poison res (the total effect varies per monster ofcourse, but simplified).

    With the uniq setup, you'll have at best +45% poison damage and -70% enemy poison resist.
    With the "triad", you'll have at best +45% poison damage and -90% enemy poison resist.
    For a low resistant monster, you won't see much difference between the 2 setups, but with the abundance of poison resistant/immune monsters, the -20% makes a bigger difference than the +1 skill.

    True, you will lack more resists with the TO "triad" (37-42), but nevertheless, you'll have to make up for a lot of resists with the list of gear proposed. Easiest way is to UM everything which in turn removes the possibility of poison facets. Ofcourse you could just trade for a bunch of resist all charms, but then you'll lose out on the amount of P&B skillers.

    Both setups are propably just as viable, with 2 differences:
    With the unique setup you pretty much must have the DW unless you concentrate more on the skellies (which in turn weakens your PN) or don't mind killing slowly in Hell.
    With the "triad", you'll have to sacrifice either sockets or space in your inventory for the gaping lack of resists.

    Anyway, if you can afford a high -poi res DW (low ones are cheap luckily, atleast mine was), you can most likely afford a CoH and have good resists easily and higher -poison res, but then again, you could propably afford Bramble too.
     
  12. HarbingersOfSkulls

    HarbingersOfSkulls IncGamers Member

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    How expensive is one?(since I do have all the equipment)

    Though my Venomacer was more like a Bentley than a MB.

    HoSv1
     
  13. Ohmn

    Ohmn IncGamers Member

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    The good news is you can play a poisonmancer with the trangs. For mf I have socketed trang's helm, and armour with a ptopaz, use a alibaba blade, gheeds and mf rings and amulet. Not great mf ~250 and more depending if you have the juice to get war travelers. You kill in the pit fairly fast. Use CE as a complimentary skill.

    I like the full trangs set becuase it is cheaper than getting a deaths web, bramble and other unatainable items. For a wand you can just use a ume's when you are not mfing.
     
  14. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    hosv1: bentley are cool, but their a bit too jay-z for me. style and class, and a v12 to push your assss down the streets. i rode my bosses v12 7series a while back, and driving it was like humping a model....i couldn't believe i was doing it.

    ohmn: good suggestions. i just dont like 'cheap' characters. it's like dollar wine...

    it may do the job, but you feel like shiit the next day

    fluffy g is your master
    :yep:
     
  15. Imconfused123

    Imconfused123 IncGamers Member

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    so basically what you guys are saying, all costs aside, is that the unique set up beats the trangouls set up?

    since trangouls u get more killing power by -25% Enemy poison res
    (set up)
    TOhelm-facet
    TObody-facet
    TOgloves
    TObelt
    TOshield-um
    Deaths web-facet
    Caster ringsx2
    Caster ammy
    Marrowalks-=-=-=-=-=- yes i plan 2 use bug
    VERSUS----------------------------------------------------
    Uniques with more resists?
    (setup)
    Shako-facet
    VampMaji-facet
    TOgloves
    Arachbelt
    Homo-um
    deaths web-facet
    Caster ringsx2
    Caster ammy
    Marrowalks-=-=-=-=- yes i plan 2 use bug

    since i play HC full resists in hell is a must... i dont wanna get all this godly stuff and die by the stupid lightning ghosts in baal's place (lost my summoning necro by doing that =/... so much good stuff....)

    btw the only thing i plan to UM is a homoculus/TO wing everything else is gonna be socketed with Perfect poison facets. this build is meant to help my bro's orb sorc so we can solo/duel (wtvr u call it when 2 ppl play) in 8 player hell baals.

    PS i think im only gonna put like
    100 str (marrow)
    75 dex (+stats should raise that 2 decent block/AR)
    and the rest on Vita
    Eng-0 since the build im making should have godly (non-runeword) items i wont need much mana

    sorry if u answered this in ur previous posts... but i still cant decide which is better from the stuff i read

    thanks for answering before and thanks in advance for answering this post
     
  16. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    Well, I'm sure belth will say TO is better, whereas I'm a proponent of a unique setup. I'll go through the exact number.

    Helm: Shako (+1 all)
    Armor: Up'd Skin of the Vipermagi (30 res all / +1 all)
    Weapon: Death's Web (+2 all / +2 pnb)
    Shield: Homonculus (40 res all / +2 all / +2 curses)
    Ring 1: SOJ (+1 All)
    Ring 2: BK (+1 ALL)
    Amulet: Mara's (27 res all / +2 all)
    Gloves: TO's Gloves (+2 Curses / +30 Cold Res)
    Belt: Arachnid Mesh (+1 SKills)
    Boots: Silkweave / Marrow

    With this gear, you have a max of 84 strength required, which is for up'd Vipermagi. If you do not up it, then keep it lower. But if you use the Marrow's, then they have a str req of 118, not 100.

    I don't find casting speed to be as important in pvm, due to the fact that PN takes a couple seconds to do it's damage anyway. FCR for PVM would be more important for a boner IHMO.

    And if you use the full Trang's Set, you can unequip ALL pieces of FCR since there is a bug, and load up on +pnb ammy / +1 rings.

    Hope that helps.

    fluffy g hates t.o.
     
  17. Cold493

    Cold493 IncGamers Member

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    If this is a PvM build you probably dont need bramble, and you dont need the TO Glove/belt/shield combo. If its PvP the benefits of Trangs triad way out weigh the benefits of Uniques. 2/1/43 or lower deaths Web are actually not that bad cause everyone who wants one will pay the big bucks for the 2/2/47+. Heres my personal Psnmancer setup, this is a PvP build.
    Shako /w um
    Maras
    40/15 Bramble
    2/2/43 Deaths Web
    2 x Soj
    Trang belt/shield/gloves shield has an UM
    Sandstorm Treks

    I'll be upgrading both my Bramble and DW soon so they'll both be 47+. I also have 10 PnBs and a bunch life and all res scs along with an anni. The weakness of this setup is definetly the esists as pointed out. However with good maras and anni and some Ums and all res jewels socketed here and there. You can more than make up the difference and have -75% enemy psn Res/+75% psn Dmg. Plus you have Lowere resist on top of that taking you down to something in the neighbourhood of -140% enemy psn resist. With the charms I also have a 1100 dmg Bone spear. Anyways I guess I just rambled about my Pvp setup. Uh use the uniques for PvM TO for PvP.
     
  18. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    cookie for your leetness

    g
     
  19. FattyMcGee

    FattyMcGee IncGamers Member

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    belth: problem with TO set is u need quite a few more points in dex for max block. That sucks, esp in HC :-/

    --fatty
     

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