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Thoughts on MF%

Discussion in 'Sorceress' started by we3dling, Feb 25, 2004.

  1. we3dling

    we3dling IncGamers Member

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    Thoughts on MF%

    Hey yall =)

    Im a happy MF'er... I just completed my MF blizzsorc!

    She has 820 mf with:

    Shako PT
    Skullder PT
    PF nagels
    PF WT
    Gold Wrap
    PF Chance Guards
    4ist shield
    6ist military pick
    44% amu
    and lots of 7%sc =)

    I have blizz dmg at 5-6 k... But i dunno whether to scale down MF% and go with more skills... I kill very effeciently at lvl **, but 8 player meph runs can always be done faster with +5 skills=)

    My point is, guess Im refering to all the mad MF'ers out there like me, how much mf and skills do have?

    When does MF% start to decrease in efficiency?

    Is there some sort of limit where more mf will just hurt ur findings because of lacking killing power?

    I could be better to go with 600 mf and then +5 skills... at least for 8 player games, meph goes down with 3-4 blizz 1 player so that's no worry...

    Anyways... Share ur thoughts!

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  2. Compman

    Compman IncGamers Member

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    Basically you'll have to judge for yourself. If you can kill a lot faster with 500 MF than with 800 MF you will still find plenty of good stuff, and you will be doing runs faster. So in the long run you will have a better efficiency.
     
  3. ConFusion

    ConFusion IncGamers Member

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    Couldn't agree more with Compman. If you want to get into statistics, the penalty kicks in after 100% mf, at first it's not that much (ie. 110% mf becomes 109% uniquefind etc.) but above 350-400% the real hard penalties drop in. You might want to check it out for yourself at the stats site.

    If you can kill much faster with those +5 skills, go for them. It wouldn't be such a big problem if you'd lose 200% mf. After all, if you lose 50% unique find but gain 70% speed then you'll be better off with speed in the end.

    It's all up to you
     
  4. Harby

    Harby IncGamers Member

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    6x IST Military Pick ?!?!!? Poor Ists :( :( :(
     
  5. melianor

    melianor D3 Wizard Moderator

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    ALWAYS, always choose killing speef over MF.
    Thats the only one rule you need!

    Your finds, well you are lucky, be happy ;)
     
  6. sasja

    sasja IncGamers Member

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    It used to be like that in 1.09 (actually, the diminishing returns kicked in after 110% mf), but now they start at only 10% mf. The more mf gear you have, the closer your "unique find" will come to 250%, but it can never be greater than 250% (and with any realistic setup, more than 200% is practically impossible). Your "set find" can never exceed 500%. Here are some numbers:
    Code:
    magic find  100% 200% 300% 400% 500% 1200%
    set find    83%  142% 187% 222% 250% 352%
    unique find 71%  111% 136% 153% 166% 206%
    I think you should get around 200% mf, but after that only increase your mf if it doesn't affect your killing speed.
     
  7. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

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    First off: There's no point in Boss-killing at a player setting greater than 3. 3 players eliminates the no-drop odds from boss drops, anything higher doesn't change the drop at all, just gives the boss more life.

    Then some numbers, taken from the new drop calculator in ATMA (check out the ATMA thread in the Single Player Forum, this calculator is most likely the most accurate drop calculator out there for 1.10 and still being improved):

    50% mf:
    unique 41%
    set 45%
    rare 46%

    100% mf:
    u/s/r 71/83/85

    200% mf:
    u/s/r 111/142/150

    300% mf:
    u/s/r 136/187/200

    400% mf:
    u/s/r 153/222/240

    500% mf:
    u/s/r 166/250/272

    600% mf:
    u/s/r 176/272/300

    700% mf:
    u/s/r 184/291/323

    800% mf:
    u/s/r 190/307/342

    900% mf:
    u/s/r 195/321/360

    1000% mf:
    u/s/r 200/333/375

    Note that mf is given as improved chances of the drop being the indicated rarity, thus relative gains are odds(Y%mf)-odds(X%mf)/(100+odds(X%) * 100%.
    What does this mean: effective improvement going from 600% mf to 800% (for uniques, the rest is less interesting unless you're hunting for high end set items, but you can calculate those yourself):
    190-176/(100+176) * 100% = 5% effective increasement.
    Going from 300% to 800%:
    190-136/(100+136) * 100% = 23%

    So what's our conclusion? Any amount of mf does increase your odds. Always. But the increase might not be worth giving up killing power for. If you can take 6 seconds less to kill 3p hell Mephisto (for example) on a normal 1 minute run, you gain 10% speed = 10% more drops. If you give up less than 10% effective mf to gain that speed, speed is better than mf. Generally 300% is taken as a good % mf, since it can generally be obtained without giving up killing power (using sockets to improve mf instead of kill-power), but if you can have more mf without your kill speed suffering from it, by all means go for it. Personally, I'll just take the 200%-300% that a normal killing setup will give you and leave it at that.
     
  8. rogier

    rogier IncGamers Member

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    does anyone have the odds that an item will be white/magical/rare/set/unique at 0%MF??

    I'm trying to calculate myself some things...about overrriding chances...
     
  9. we3dling

    we3dling IncGamers Member

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    So what is ur MF setup?

    Zargrezz thx for explaining=) But... If this is for pindle I say go with max MF, for he dies almost before I can even switch to MF.. But meph... I must cut my time there...

    So what equipment should i switch to uptain greater killing power and still have like 400-500%

    6ist military pick = 180%
    4ist shield = 100%
    Amu = 44%
    Chance Guards = 40%
    WT = 50%
    Arachnid = +1
    Arkain's Valor = +2
    2 SOJs = +2

    that's +5 skills and approx 520%mf with charms... Or what would u guys suggest?


    By the way, I thought drops were better in 8 player games... I thought elite items dropped more frequently and monsters dropped more items... (not meph though, but still higher lvl items!?)

    Then it's only xtra EXP u gain or what?

    Lastly, I was looking at ebay and I found this: Which I simply cant understand! take a look, ppl around the world must be very very very stupid!

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3080653180&category=33885

    Anyways, thx for ur replies so far!

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  10. melianor

    melianor D3 Wizard Moderator

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    When doing area runs like the Pit, the number of items that drop is higher in 8-player games.

    I'd stick with your switch. Or just stay with your killing gear on. 820%MF, way overpowered switch ;)
     
  11. we3dling

    we3dling IncGamers Member

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    Yes, but...

    820% is very gosu, when doing cow runs... I get 5 sc 2-3 lg and 5 grand charms... that's mf% doing that... that's lile 15 charms per run... pretty sick i think..

    But still... Melianor...any1 reading this, do you have any suggestions how to optimize my sorc?

    Speak freely!!

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  12. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

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    The only time that mf is taken into consideration is when the drop mechanism has already chosen the item type that will drop. Then it will check for plain/socketed/magic/rare/set/unique, this is where mf is applied.
    Thus mf doesn't affect the number of charms and jewelry that drop at all!
    Players 8 does influence the amount of desirable items that drop through sheer quantity of drops. Higher player setting reduces the no-drop chance of most monsters (uniques and champions excluded, since they drop a fixed number of items under all circumstances, higher than 3 players also has no additional effect on boss-drops), thus more items drop, thus more items check mf, thus more magic/rare/set/uniques drop.
     
  13. we3dling

    we3dling IncGamers Member

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    Gosh... I didn't know that! But hey thx for telling=)

    I will make 1 player runs for now... But u can lvl from ** to 89 doing meph 8 player^^

    anyways...

    I think this topic is settled... One question left...

    Could any make a comment of my item setup i preseted earluier..
     
  14. amishamigo

    amishamigo IncGamers Member

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    Yeah, I can. Do you tank at all? If so, go four a jeweler's monarch of deflecting. Huge blocking bonuses and four ists. If you're not into tanking go for a jeweler's monarch of -40 reqs. It'll reduce your strength reqs to whatever skullder's is (I honestly forget)

    Switch the ammy out for a lower mf ammy with skills. The diff between 30 and 40 mf isn't all that much.

    The ebay thing is pretty funny. It's sad that people would even try to sell that, even worse if they succeed.

    Actually the best thing you could do in open pvp is have a weapon that has charges of the highest druid's poison creeper possible, the best plus skills possible, -100% target's defense, - as much poison resistance possible, and huge plus poison damage %, maybe 10k increased poison % or something. If the fool is using a minion, infect them and prance around while they slowly wither away. Remember, poison can't be absorbed
     

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