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Thoughts on consolidating the SP trade pool

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by TopHatCat64, Jan 26, 2017.

  1. TopHatCat64

    TopHatCat64 IncGamers Member

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    Hello folks,

    I'll start off by saying, I love to trade. 3 years ago, it seemed like there was always some new thread popping up in the trade forum and we had a lot of active traders. Good times! :)

    Nowadays, things are a lot quieter in the SP trade forum. It seems like we go days between new threads and I'm noticing we have a distinct split between traders in the latest patch (1.14d) and then some folks still in 1.13. That's a shame, because we have so few active traders and I'd love to maximize our pool of potential trade partners.

    So...is there a reason folks aren't upgrading to the latest patch?
     
  2. pharphis

    pharphis IncGamers Site Pal

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    Pretty sure it breaks multiplayer for some people (no more multi.dll?) and doesn't work with things like bliss version switcher, for example, which I use to play older versions.

    Though, I haven't really looked at it much
     
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  3. BKC

    BKC IncGamers Member

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    i did upgrade simply because windows 10 has flickering screens in diablo 2 1.13 and that is not my thing :)
    However i didnt set up a trade profile just yet. (i dont have that much to trade for tbh) so my opinion is as good as air at the moment :)
     
  4. Gripphon

    Gripphon IncGamers Member

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    For me, 2 reasons. No more self multiplayer (not sure is there some new file out there) which is a big deal for me. I perform tests and rushes that way, not having it means go away 1.14. Second reason, all PvP-ers stayed in 1.13. So... hype!
    Well, third reason is I don't see a reason to upgrade. With 1.13 everything works perfectly for me and 1.14 brings nothing new. It is for those players who benefit from changes.

    In the end it has split trading, yes.
     
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  5. Brak

    Brak IncGamers Member

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    I honestly don't see why the two patches are segregated. There's zero content change as it stands
     
  6. darkstarhub

    darkstarhub IncGamers Member

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    I don't trade, but D2 wouldn't even load on 1.13, but since I updated to 1.14d the game has been flawless.
     
  7. Thyiad

    Thyiad Moderator Single Player, D2 Assassin, Barbarian

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    Any split in the trade pool is bad but it has to be balanced between that and simplicity for new traders whose first language may not be English, plus the ability to track items. We had the same discussion over 1.11 and 1.12 or (and the various .a .b etc sub sections). No going back in versions is simple. No going back except between x and y versions isn't. See how people have issues understanding vanilla to modded ok, not the other way (similarly HC to SC ok-ish, not the other way).

    I'm trying to remember who did the last multi-dll (I'm pressed for time right now) but I'll try and dig that info out over the weekend.
     
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  8. Thyiad

    Thyiad Moderator Single Player, D2 Assassin, Barbarian

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    Additionally, I think a bigger issue is that the forum as a whole is more quiet. (Although the SPF gets the last 5 recent posts fairly often.)
     
  9. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    I upgraded because I also play a group game on BNet, so I didn't have a choice.
     
  10. Timinator

    Timinator IncGamers Member

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    One important and GREAT thing about diablo2, you are not really forced to pick a version. Its possible to run multiple. I choose the different folder method. When you have terrabytes of HDD space, 2GB is a rounding error. One of the reasons I have some involvement in 1.14 is some of the tweaks for Windows 10, but nothing really in game. The tweak to not get a hot lap for laptops could be useful.

    They made it sound like there might be upcoming content changes, that might offer a carrot for people to upgrade. Imagine if the rune finding rates were bumped AGAIN. That KO rune you got might have been a BER with better odds. What has normally happened in the past, people think its all done, then we are surprised with actual changes.

    In terms of trading my 2c are worthless as I don't trade, but do appreciate the damage a split community can have. As Thyiad mentions, even having less people to talk to can mean you don't see as much trade bait, and may play less yourself. Some forums will grind to a halt, or people just don't bother to post which is a self fulfilling prophecy.

    Perhaps we need some skilled people, or just one really exceptional one to work out HOW to make those things work in 1.14 Perhaps with the DLLs locked away the old ways won't work. I remember when 1.10 came out. Atma did not work, people were going back to the old ways of muling at first, there was a lot of frustration which was relieved when it was finally compatible.

    At least with 1.14 no actual game bits are nerfed/broken so that isn't a reason to move forward if other challenges can be surpassed.
     
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  11. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    They indeed made it sound like that, so I'm still hoping for some content changes. I'm starting to lose hope though, as it's been so long since the initial 1.14 posts about it though. Bumping the rune drop rates actually isn't necessary though, I think, or at least not much.
     
  12. TopHatCat64

    TopHatCat64 IncGamers Member

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    Thanks everyone for your insight. A pity that the newest patch breaks a lot of our favorite add-ons...that's definitely a good reason to not ugprade. Hopefully some of the smart posters in this forum can eventually figure out how Blizzard cobbled together 1.14.

    @Timinator: I must have missed that quote from Blizzard, but what exactly did they hint at in terms of upcoming content?
     
  13. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    Apparantly they are still keeping track of reported bugs, so that's something :). Even some hint on a high resolution patch for D2 not completely impossible.

    As for the exact quote ... Looking for it now, but so far I can't find it. IIRC it was when 1.14a was released, and it was something along the lines of 'this patch isn't the end, but just the beginning. There's far more to look forward to'. It was certainly put in another way, but that was the meaning of it.
     
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  14. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    The patch 1.14 blogs seem to be gone on the official classic forums, but apparantly I quoted the part that I was referring to in a thread about the patch.

    While maybe not so strong as I made it out to be in my previous post, I'd think it would be really stupid of Blizzard to put it that way, and then not at least have a patch with some serious bug fixing.

    Also see the first part of my post there as to why I still strongly believe that we will see such bug fixing (and maybe content) patch at some point. Although I have to admit my hope is dwindling, as it is taking a lot of time. Then again I don't expect more than 1 or at least very few people working on this.
     
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  15. TopHatCat64

    TopHatCat64 IncGamers Member

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    Very interesting, @T72on1. Thanks for digging up those links.

    I can't say I'm too hopeful for anything beyond an HD mode, but I would certainly be over the moon if they added ANYTHING new to the in-game world.
     
  16. T72on1

    T72on1 IncGamers Member

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    If they release anything, the order of likelihood in my opinion is bug fixing > some minor new content > HD mode > major new content. With the first still likely, the rest not so much so.
     
  17. Xios

    Xios IncGamers Member

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    As much of a Blizzard fanboy as I am, I'm not holding my breath either. Honestly I think they've gone beyond their responsibilities even worrying about the game working on modern systems. It's not like they were under much obligation to do that on a feature complete game from 15 years ago, especially a company that clearly has other projects on the go. I know some people work themselves up in a frenzy about how Blizzard isn't addressing bots or whatever on Battle.net, I personally don't see why as a company they should try. Assign more than a skeleton crew (if they even have such a thing right now) to a game this old to get into an arms race against botters? Seems like folly to me, and doesn't make sense from a business perspective.

    That tangent aside, I do agree that if anything, it might be bug fixes that happen. This is just based off the fact that they already have addressed what bugs are there (they know what needs to be done) and time has helped to narrow down exactly why the bugs are occurring, in some instances people have even been able to point directly to the code/file/text that is causing the issue (meaning they might know 'how' to do it too). That leaves you with a clear check list with plenty to go off of. Seems like just the kind of work that could be assigned to that one or two people when they decide to send someone to look at it.

    Even then, I don't see it high on their priority list, and I can't say I blame them. I would be curious to see the response if one of the people who has taken the plunge into the code to spot these bugs legitimately offered to do temp/freelance work to implement this though.
     
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  18. Lemma

    Lemma IncGamers Member

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    I'm using 1.14d as my primary version and I can confirm that self-MP is still possible, and I believe that all mods permitted in the MP/trade pool should work with 1.14d, so I'm not sure what reason there is to use 1.13, unless you're using mods other than FAM in which case you'd have to separate those characters/stashes from the pool in any case. I'm personally using RWM and a glide wrapper with 1.14d and both work perfectly.

    The only difference with self-MP is that since there's no longer a d2gfx.dll file as Blizzard consolidated it into Game.exe, you need a patched Game.exe file instead. I don't recall where I downloaded the one I'm using, and I'm not sure if it's available on any site that's permissible to link to, but I took a look at it since I'm not in the habit of trusting unknown executables and it looks like the exact same fix as the patched dll, just applied to the portion of the 1.14d Game.exe containing the relevant code that used to be part of d2gfx.dll. It's literally one byte different from the original - at offset 0xF562A, 0xEB is changed to 0x74. Anyone with a hex editor can make their own patched Game.exe by changing that one byte.

    Unless I'm missing something, it seems like the only thing that doesn't work is version switching software, which is a convenience but isn't actually necessary to run 1.14 alongside other versions. If the lack of support from version switchers is what's keeping people on 1.13, I'd be willing to help develop a solution if it meant consolidating the pool. I know the author of Bliss says he has no plans to support 1.14, because he doesn't think there's any reason to upgrade, but it's open source and I don't think it would be too difficult of a feature for someone else to add. I don't think it should take much more than just adding some code to check if it's switching to/from 1.14, and if so, delete/restore the relevant dlls.

    I know a lot of people using 1.13 don't see any reason to switch if it works for them, and if characters and items could move freely between 1.13 and 1.14 then I'd agree. But the way I see it is if we're all going to use the same version, the only other way to consolidate the pool, it's more feasible for it to be 1.14 than 1.13. I see a lot of people saying they're identical so there's no reason to upgrade, but that logic goes both ways. And in fact, while the gameplay might be the same, the compatibility fixes in 1.14 were necessary to keep a 16 year old game working well on modern systems, and there are people for whom 1.14 just runs better. Plus it's the default that you get if you download the installer from Blizzard instead of using a CD, and if you don't think that matters, just look at all the posts from people who have 1.14 and are having trouble downgrading.
     
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  19. Burgomaster3

    Burgomaster3 IncGamers Member

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    Bliss Version Switcher is currently the main reason keeping me from upgrading to 1.14. If it gets upgraded and the self-MPing is indeed easy to fix, I'd most likely upgrade to 1.14. That of course means, that the new modifications to BVS and Game.exe are Forum Approved. I guess trade-pool consolidation would make me a little bit more interested in trading, since it seems most of the traders still in 1.13 are richer guys that already possess most of the interesting stuff I have to offer, like 1.07 stuff etc.

    I'm also not a huge fan of 1.14 changing save directories, but I guess that's the tune nowadays.
     
  20. Lemma

    Lemma IncGamers Member

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    I assumed that the modified Game.exe would count as forum-approved under the rule allowing the modified d2gfx.dll since it's making the exact same change to the vanilla game that the modified dll does, only the code it's modifying has been moved to a different file. It would be nice to get an official word from the moderators on that though, and preferably a link to the modified Game.exe in the mod help thread alongside the link to the dll, to make it just as easy as it is with 1.13.

    As far as the save directory is concerned, it's only the default location that was changed with 1.14, and you can change it to wherever you want your save files to be stored. That change is actually one of the compatibility fixes and was made to prevent issues where the game isn't being run as an administrator, since a normal user might not be able to write to the Program Files directory, but should always be able to write to their user data folder. There's a registry key that controls the save folder, and part of what BVS does when it switches versions is to change that registry key to point to its save folder for that version, so that characters from different versions stay separated. So there's no reason why BVS couldn't do exactly the same thing with the save folder for 1.14 that it does for other versions.
     
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