Dondrei
Diabloii.Net Member
The dead aren't in heaven if you're Christian
Correct me if I'm wrong, but on reading the Bible I noticed something very odd. Despite the way Christians always say "she's with God now" and so on, and seem to have this idea that the dead go straight to heaven, the Bible doesn't suggest that at all. In fact as far as I can tell what happens is that the dead are really dead until the Rapture (Judgement Day or whatever else it's called). Then the trumpets play and the dead are given eternal life (no mention of ascending into the clouds or anything, they seem to stay on earth, where Jesus comes back as king). It keeps saying the dead are sleeping, awaiting the return:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but on reading the Bible I noticed something very odd. Despite the way Christians always say "she's with God now" and so on, and seem to have this idea that the dead go straight to heaven, the Bible doesn't suggest that at all. In fact as far as I can tell what happens is that the dead are really dead until the Rapture (Judgement Day or whatever else it's called). Then the trumpets play and the dead are given eternal life (no mention of ascending into the clouds or anything, they seem to stay on earth, where Jesus comes back as king). It keeps saying the dead are sleeping, awaiting the return:
The resurrections occur in stages:KJV said:13: But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14: For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15: For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16: For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
(1 Thessalonians 4:13-17)
52: And all wept, and bewailed her: but he said, Weep not; she is not dead, but sleepeth.
(Luke 8:52)
Not that one should believe Revelation, of course. But it's hinted at elsewhere, including the first one below. These two illustrate that the resurrection is as spirits rather than, you know, zombies:KJV said:4: And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5: But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
(Revelation 20:4-5)
So I don't get it - is this something that got revised when Jesus failed to show up after a hundred years or so like he said and everything got a little awkward?KJV said:12: Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
13: But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:
14: And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
15: Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16: For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17: And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
18: Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
19: If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
20: But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
21: For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22: For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23: But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24: Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25: For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26: The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
(1 Corinthians 15:12-26)
35: But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?
36: Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
37: And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
38: But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.
39: All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.
40: There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
41: There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.
42: So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43: It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
(1 Corinthians 15:35-44)