purplelocust
Diabloii.Net Member
TC3 hunting FAQ draft
The poll about TC3 items made me think that perhaps it would be good to have a TC3 FAQ. Here's my effort, comments, additions, etc. are welcome!
Hrus' MF Guide has a section on TC3 items, which is an excellent resource.
Q: What is so special about TC3 items?
A: The set and unique items from Treasure Class 3 (TC3) are often hard to find, particularly ones with a high ilvl. The lowest weapons and armor treasure classes are TC3. Monsters early in the game may drop from TC3 but may not be high enough monster level to drop the higher qlvl S/U items, and monsters late in the game are much more likely to drop from a higher treasure class. As a result, without some kind of dedicated MF effort, it is unlikely to find all the TC3 items.
Q: What are the TC3 items that are so hard to find?
A: Typically, the ones that have a high qlvl (meaning that low level monsters won't be able to drop them) and the class-specific type items that are less likely to drop.
The items Pelta Lunata, Rixot's Keen, Arctic Furs, Biggin's Bonnet, Felloak, Hsarus' Iron Fist, Gull, Hotspur, The Gnasher, and The Hand of Broc all have qlvl 7 or less, so targets like Coldcrow (who is mlvl 7), Rakanishu, Treehead and Griswold (all mlvl 8) are good for those and are generally not the hardest TC3s to find. The Death's Set items are qlvl 8, so though Coldcrow can't drop them, Rakanishu, Treehead and Griswold can.
The Knell Striker, Bane Ash and Torch of Iro are harder to find, not because those targets can't drop them, but because of their item type is only 1/3 as likely to drop as the other TC3 items.
As the ilvl increases, generally the items get more difficult to find. Lenymo, Greyform and Pluckeye (ilvl 10) won't drop from Treehead and company, but that can drop from Normal Andariel.
Things start getting more difficult about when the ilvls get to be greater than what Normal Andariel can drop (she drops items of qlvl 12 and less.) Blinkbat's Form (16), Vidala's Ambush (19), Sander's Paragon (20) and Tancred's Hobnails (27) can't be dropped by Andariel. Oddly, there is Bane Ash in A1 that can drop Blinkbat's.
For Sander's Paragon, it's worth mentioning that because there are two set caps (the other is Infernal Cranium) its chance of dropping from a high level monster is diminished by the chance that Infernal Cranium will get selected instead.
The recent poll indicated that the missing TC3 items are typically Bane Ash, Knell Striker and the Torch of Iro.
Q: What are some good targets for getting TC3 items?
A: It depends upon which ones you are aiming for and whether or not you MP.
Here are some options:
Coldcrow: dependable for TC3 drops, easy to find (she is at one of the extremities of the Cave Level 1 under the Cold Plains that does not have the stairs down to the second level of the Cave) but she can't drop Death's items and above. If you are interested in the Bane Ash/Knell Striker/Torch of Iro, she's a good target as she can drop those.
Bane Ash: easy to get to, but since the drops can come from higher TCs as well, doesn't have as many items from TC3 per run as Coldcrow. He can drop all the TC3 items except the Sander's, Vidala's and Tancred's items.
Andariel: with the "quest drop always" feature, she drops reliably and has some of the best chances for the items except the 4 she can't drop: Blinkbat's and Sander's, Vidala's and Tancred's items.
The normal Cow King: he can drop all the TC3 s/u items, but running him repeatedly requires MPing. A good method for that is described below.
Other typical MF targets (normal Meph, NM Meph, NM Andariel,...): These are good targets but they don't often drop from TC3. They do drop plenty of other useful items regularly so merely in the course of normal MFing you may run across some TC3 items, but they are not a dependable source.
As far as which to run, it depends upon what you want. If you want them all and you don't already have the Sander's, Vidala's and Tancred's items then you can't run something in A1 normal (except the Cow King)
Q: What is a good way of running Coldcrow/Rakanishu/Griswold/other normal A1 targets?
A: The nice thing about these targets is that you typically won't need gear for killing, so you can load up on MF gear to an absurd amount and still kill quickly. It becomes totally a matter of speed. Here are some choices:
1) Just about any Sorc with FCR and teleport: getting to the targets quickly is all that matters.
2) A Tesladin (Holy Shock paladin): everything nearby drops with one pulse for a synergized Holy Shock paladin. A level 40 Tesladin, carrying a Gull, the Angelic items except the sword, Chance Guards, a 3 PTopaz hat and other gear can easily get 300MF and kill lots of monsters quickly, just by walking around. Charge can help you move quickly (but you run out of mana, typically) or Vigor if you just want to race to Coldcrow, for example.
3) A Frenzy barb has great footspeed and can also use Find Item (hork) after killing, so a dual Ali Baba + MF gear barb may be a good choice.
4) Any other fast-travelling character who can kill carrying tons of MF gear, like a trapper with Burst of Speed.
Q: What about running the normal Cow King? I thought you could only kill him once.
A: I prefer the normal Cow King for finding TC3 items but there is some difficulty, because of the fact that a character who can make the cow portal loses that ability if that character is present in the Cow Level when a character who can make the cow portal kill the king (in that difficulty.) Playing alone, that means that you can only kill the Cow King once.
But with MP, you can kill the king repeatedly. There are a number of ways of managing to do this. Here is my preferred method, which uses two characters.
Have two characters, a maker (M) and a killer (K). The maker just has two tasks: get Wirt's Leg and open the portal. The killer enters the cow level and kills the king. Then repeat.
You can do this with a friend (who would probably get bored as maker) or do it yourself with two computers. Since only one character needs to be doing anything at any particular time, it's pretty easy to do. I've done this alot and in fact I used to do it on two computers which were separated by a flight of stairs, which was pretty silly and slow but manageable. Having the computers next to each other is definitely preferable...
A good choice for a maker is an enchantress. She can teleport quickly to get the leg, open the cow portal, and then enchant the killer. She remains in town to avoid the possibility of losing her ability to open the cow portal. In fact, she can enter the cow level anytime but the first time the killer kills the king and not lose the ability to make cows, but there isn't much point and she is likely to be too high level to get any benefit of being on the cow level anyway. It doesn't matter what she does after opening the portal and enchanting - she could stand around doing nothing, wander off somewhere else, or she could even leave the game if she isn't the one hosting. Despite the constant b.net pleas, partying is irrelevant as to losing the ability to make cows, though you will need to party to enchant.
A good choice for a killer is a frenzy barb, if partnered with an enchantress. Since you are MPing, the map gets redrawn each time, so you'll need for the killer to find the cow king's fort, and it is good to have a fast way of moving about. A frenzy barb can move quickly and doesn't need to worry about dying to a few cow hits, so he can charge up frenzy and then run around looking for the fort. Once the barb finds the king's fort and the king, he can kill the king, hork the corpse, and then you can start another game.
Since all you care about is killing the king, a barb can use warcries to make that go more quickly. Howl will scatter cows except for the King so it can isolate him and make it obvious which one he is. Furthermore, if you only kill the King, you don't have to waste time horking the corpses of the Cow King's minions and other cows, which can take a while and use up mana. Sometimes the "Howled" cows will bounce off of the walls of the fort and get in the way, but still it goes pretty quickly.
To summarize, here is my method:
Two characters- enchantress and frenzy barb with decent Find Item.
Enchantress gets the leg, makes the portal, enchants the barb.
The barb wields dual Ali Babas and wears lots of MF gear. He jumps through the red portal, whacks a few cows not to kill them nescessarily, but just to get FRW up and going so he can race around to find the Cow King fort.
One he finds the fort, he Howls to isolate the Cow King, kills the King, horks the corpse, and then it's time to start another game.
Q: What about the non-king cows on the Cow Level?
A: Those are reasonable sources of TC3 items, but not nearly as good as the King. Nevertheless, a good mass cow killer (LF Zon) can run /players 8 cows on her own, avoiding the King to preserve her ability to make cows, and may find some TC3 items that way.
Q: Are there any added bonuses about running the Cow King this way?
A: Yes, there is a decent chance you'll find the Cow King's Set items (except the hat, which can only drop in NM and Hell from the Cow King.) The Cow King set items are another common gap in item grails. You may want to run the NM Cow King for the Cow King's Horns hat, but you can get at least a couple of the set items in normal.
Q: Is it worth running targets just to get the TC3 items?
A: Honestly, probably not. If your goal is to find every TC3 item, then this is probably a good method to complete a TC3 grail. But if you are looking to complete a grail of all the S/U in the game, you'll have to do so many runs of Baal, Pindle, Meph, and area level 85 areas that you'll proabably find all the TC3 items several times over before you find some of the hardest TC87 items, like Asteron's or Tyrael's Might.
Q: What do I do with these items once I find them?
A: Mostly, just put them on a shelf and admire them. Sander's Paragon is part of one of the most useless sets. Knell Striker is not a bad twink weapon, but there are many better choices. The TC3 items that are actually useful are Gull for MF, Hsarus' full set is a good twink set, Hotspur has +max FR, the Gnasher is a good smiter weapon, Death's Set items are great twink items but the limited number of potions in the belt is an annoyance, and Tancred's Hobnails are possibly useful in conjunction with Tancred's amulet for some good MF at a low level.
Q: What about Classic? Does this all still apply?
A: Absolutely! I've actually done this more in Classic than LoD (using a Frenzy barb with dual Gulls instead of dual Ali Babas, for example) and it's a great source of TC3 items there. In Classic, Hotspur, Gull and other TC3 items are actually quite useful, and Gull is a unit of curreny on b.net.
The poll about TC3 items made me think that perhaps it would be good to have a TC3 FAQ. Here's my effort, comments, additions, etc. are welcome!
Hrus' MF Guide has a section on TC3 items, which is an excellent resource.
Q: What is so special about TC3 items?
A: The set and unique items from Treasure Class 3 (TC3) are often hard to find, particularly ones with a high ilvl. The lowest weapons and armor treasure classes are TC3. Monsters early in the game may drop from TC3 but may not be high enough monster level to drop the higher qlvl S/U items, and monsters late in the game are much more likely to drop from a higher treasure class. As a result, without some kind of dedicated MF effort, it is unlikely to find all the TC3 items.
Q: What are the TC3 items that are so hard to find?
A: Typically, the ones that have a high qlvl (meaning that low level monsters won't be able to drop them) and the class-specific type items that are less likely to drop.
The items Pelta Lunata, Rixot's Keen, Arctic Furs, Biggin's Bonnet, Felloak, Hsarus' Iron Fist, Gull, Hotspur, The Gnasher, and The Hand of Broc all have qlvl 7 or less, so targets like Coldcrow (who is mlvl 7), Rakanishu, Treehead and Griswold (all mlvl 8) are good for those and are generally not the hardest TC3s to find. The Death's Set items are qlvl 8, so though Coldcrow can't drop them, Rakanishu, Treehead and Griswold can.
The Knell Striker, Bane Ash and Torch of Iro are harder to find, not because those targets can't drop them, but because of their item type is only 1/3 as likely to drop as the other TC3 items.
As the ilvl increases, generally the items get more difficult to find. Lenymo, Greyform and Pluckeye (ilvl 10) won't drop from Treehead and company, but that can drop from Normal Andariel.
Things start getting more difficult about when the ilvls get to be greater than what Normal Andariel can drop (she drops items of qlvl 12 and less.) Blinkbat's Form (16), Vidala's Ambush (19), Sander's Paragon (20) and Tancred's Hobnails (27) can't be dropped by Andariel. Oddly, there is Bane Ash in A1 that can drop Blinkbat's.
For Sander's Paragon, it's worth mentioning that because there are two set caps (the other is Infernal Cranium) its chance of dropping from a high level monster is diminished by the chance that Infernal Cranium will get selected instead.
The recent poll indicated that the missing TC3 items are typically Bane Ash, Knell Striker and the Torch of Iro.
Q: What are some good targets for getting TC3 items?
A: It depends upon which ones you are aiming for and whether or not you MP.
Here are some options:
Coldcrow: dependable for TC3 drops, easy to find (she is at one of the extremities of the Cave Level 1 under the Cold Plains that does not have the stairs down to the second level of the Cave) but she can't drop Death's items and above. If you are interested in the Bane Ash/Knell Striker/Torch of Iro, she's a good target as she can drop those.
Bane Ash: easy to get to, but since the drops can come from higher TCs as well, doesn't have as many items from TC3 per run as Coldcrow. He can drop all the TC3 items except the Sander's, Vidala's and Tancred's items.
Andariel: with the "quest drop always" feature, she drops reliably and has some of the best chances for the items except the 4 she can't drop: Blinkbat's and Sander's, Vidala's and Tancred's items.
The normal Cow King: he can drop all the TC3 s/u items, but running him repeatedly requires MPing. A good method for that is described below.
Other typical MF targets (normal Meph, NM Meph, NM Andariel,...): These are good targets but they don't often drop from TC3. They do drop plenty of other useful items regularly so merely in the course of normal MFing you may run across some TC3 items, but they are not a dependable source.
As far as which to run, it depends upon what you want. If you want them all and you don't already have the Sander's, Vidala's and Tancred's items then you can't run something in A1 normal (except the Cow King)
Q: What is a good way of running Coldcrow/Rakanishu/Griswold/other normal A1 targets?
A: The nice thing about these targets is that you typically won't need gear for killing, so you can load up on MF gear to an absurd amount and still kill quickly. It becomes totally a matter of speed. Here are some choices:
1) Just about any Sorc with FCR and teleport: getting to the targets quickly is all that matters.
2) A Tesladin (Holy Shock paladin): everything nearby drops with one pulse for a synergized Holy Shock paladin. A level 40 Tesladin, carrying a Gull, the Angelic items except the sword, Chance Guards, a 3 PTopaz hat and other gear can easily get 300MF and kill lots of monsters quickly, just by walking around. Charge can help you move quickly (but you run out of mana, typically) or Vigor if you just want to race to Coldcrow, for example.
3) A Frenzy barb has great footspeed and can also use Find Item (hork) after killing, so a dual Ali Baba + MF gear barb may be a good choice.
4) Any other fast-travelling character who can kill carrying tons of MF gear, like a trapper with Burst of Speed.
Q: What about running the normal Cow King? I thought you could only kill him once.
A: I prefer the normal Cow King for finding TC3 items but there is some difficulty, because of the fact that a character who can make the cow portal loses that ability if that character is present in the Cow Level when a character who can make the cow portal kill the king (in that difficulty.) Playing alone, that means that you can only kill the Cow King once.
But with MP, you can kill the king repeatedly. There are a number of ways of managing to do this. Here is my preferred method, which uses two characters.
Have two characters, a maker (M) and a killer (K). The maker just has two tasks: get Wirt's Leg and open the portal. The killer enters the cow level and kills the king. Then repeat.
You can do this with a friend (who would probably get bored as maker) or do it yourself with two computers. Since only one character needs to be doing anything at any particular time, it's pretty easy to do. I've done this alot and in fact I used to do it on two computers which were separated by a flight of stairs, which was pretty silly and slow but manageable. Having the computers next to each other is definitely preferable...
A good choice for a maker is an enchantress. She can teleport quickly to get the leg, open the cow portal, and then enchant the killer. She remains in town to avoid the possibility of losing her ability to open the cow portal. In fact, she can enter the cow level anytime but the first time the killer kills the king and not lose the ability to make cows, but there isn't much point and she is likely to be too high level to get any benefit of being on the cow level anyway. It doesn't matter what she does after opening the portal and enchanting - she could stand around doing nothing, wander off somewhere else, or she could even leave the game if she isn't the one hosting. Despite the constant b.net pleas, partying is irrelevant as to losing the ability to make cows, though you will need to party to enchant.
A good choice for a killer is a frenzy barb, if partnered with an enchantress. Since you are MPing, the map gets redrawn each time, so you'll need for the killer to find the cow king's fort, and it is good to have a fast way of moving about. A frenzy barb can move quickly and doesn't need to worry about dying to a few cow hits, so he can charge up frenzy and then run around looking for the fort. Once the barb finds the king's fort and the king, he can kill the king, hork the corpse, and then you can start another game.
Since all you care about is killing the king, a barb can use warcries to make that go more quickly. Howl will scatter cows except for the King so it can isolate him and make it obvious which one he is. Furthermore, if you only kill the King, you don't have to waste time horking the corpses of the Cow King's minions and other cows, which can take a while and use up mana. Sometimes the "Howled" cows will bounce off of the walls of the fort and get in the way, but still it goes pretty quickly.
To summarize, here is my method:
Two characters- enchantress and frenzy barb with decent Find Item.
Enchantress gets the leg, makes the portal, enchants the barb.
The barb wields dual Ali Babas and wears lots of MF gear. He jumps through the red portal, whacks a few cows not to kill them nescessarily, but just to get FRW up and going so he can race around to find the Cow King fort.
One he finds the fort, he Howls to isolate the Cow King, kills the King, horks the corpse, and then it's time to start another game.
Q: What about the non-king cows on the Cow Level?
A: Those are reasonable sources of TC3 items, but not nearly as good as the King. Nevertheless, a good mass cow killer (LF Zon) can run /players 8 cows on her own, avoiding the King to preserve her ability to make cows, and may find some TC3 items that way.
Q: Are there any added bonuses about running the Cow King this way?
A: Yes, there is a decent chance you'll find the Cow King's Set items (except the hat, which can only drop in NM and Hell from the Cow King.) The Cow King set items are another common gap in item grails. You may want to run the NM Cow King for the Cow King's Horns hat, but you can get at least a couple of the set items in normal.
Q: Is it worth running targets just to get the TC3 items?
A: Honestly, probably not. If your goal is to find every TC3 item, then this is probably a good method to complete a TC3 grail. But if you are looking to complete a grail of all the S/U in the game, you'll have to do so many runs of Baal, Pindle, Meph, and area level 85 areas that you'll proabably find all the TC3 items several times over before you find some of the hardest TC87 items, like Asteron's or Tyrael's Might.
Q: What do I do with these items once I find them?
A: Mostly, just put them on a shelf and admire them. Sander's Paragon is part of one of the most useless sets. Knell Striker is not a bad twink weapon, but there are many better choices. The TC3 items that are actually useful are Gull for MF, Hsarus' full set is a good twink set, Hotspur has +max FR, the Gnasher is a good smiter weapon, Death's Set items are great twink items but the limited number of potions in the belt is an annoyance, and Tancred's Hobnails are possibly useful in conjunction with Tancred's amulet for some good MF at a low level.
Q: What about Classic? Does this all still apply?
A: Absolutely! I've actually done this more in Classic than LoD (using a Frenzy barb with dual Gulls instead of dual Ali Babas, for example) and it's a great source of TC3 items there. In Classic, Hotspur, Gull and other TC3 items are actually quite useful, and Gull is a unit of curreny on b.net.
