Statistics on Resistances

S

sudkamp

Diabloii.Net Member
Statistics on Resistances

Hi,

Is there much difference between the following resistances
- 75 all resist
- 80 all resist
- 85 all resist
- 90 all resist

For example, is 90 resist much different than 85 resist. I've read that a difference of 5 means, you can handle like 3 more meteors or something.

This is discounting any items that contain absorb.
 
stephan

stephan

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Statistics on Resistances

Assume 1000 damage:

with 75 res that becomes 250
with 80 res 200 (20% less than 75 res)
with 85 res 150 (25% less than 80 res, 40% less than 75 res)
with 90 res 100 (33% less than 85 res, 60% less than 75 res)
with 95 res 50 (50% less than 90 res, 80% less than 75 res).
 
lumpor

lumpor

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Statistics on Resistances

Yeah, resists do have rising returns. Same as damage reduction (both integer and %), -defense%, and lessening the chance to be hit (going from 90% chance to be hit to 80% is a decrease of ~11% while going from a 30% ctbh to 20% decreases the number of hits taken by 25%).

Everything that decreases a number has rising returns, and everything that increases a number has diminishing returns. -enemy resistance counts as an increasing number though, because the formula when you multiply resistance is "1-enemy resistance", so when decreasing the enemies' resistance, you actually increase that formula, meaning it has diminishing returns. Increasing resistance is decreasing that number, so resistance has rising returns.

Think of it as this:When something has diminishing returns, it's effective at first, but then every point later is less effective. When you try to lower that number, it first affects the numbers that are affected by the diminishing returns, meaning the lowering makes little difference. But when you get more of the lowering, it starts hitting the lower numbers, where the diminishing returns haven't kicked in yet, meaning it takes away the really mattering numbers. The more it lowers, the more effect it does.

Y'know, if you think a little, you can figure out how much resists help yourself, not that hard. 20/25, shows how much damage a 80% resistance character takes, if the 75% resistance character takes 1 damage.
 
krischan

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Re: Statistics on Resistances

The difference between e.g. 75% and 95% res is as factor of 5, so if your character has 75% (i.e. 75% of the damage of the element in question are negated) and an attack of that element will still hurt you a lot, it will be far less of a threat with 95% res (95% are negated).

Also, there are items which absorb elemental attacks and heal for the absorbed damage which can make you effectively immune to the element (except the remaining damage after absorption kills you outright, as the healing occurs before suffering the damage). It's usually not much they can absorb, so they work better if your resists are beyond 75%. For example, you are more or less immune to lightning from monsters with maximized resists and Thundergod's Vigor which offer a 10% bonus to max lightning resistance and 20 points of lightning absorption.

It's even easier with e.g. the Rising Sun amulet and fire attacks. Even with bad resists you will be more or less immune to attacks from monsters, so getting one is what I'm doing when I'm still poor after a ladder reset, so my first character (a meteorb sorc) is immune to the fire attacks of councils and the bloodlords while doing Meph runs.
 
krischan

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Re: Statistics on Resistances

The OP didn't ask about the result of subtracting 75% from 80% :p The interesting number isn't the negated damage, but the remaining damage, as that's what hurts, so it's actually you who has a distorted understanding about the issue.

You are considering the case from a 0% res perspective while you have to consider it from the 75% point of view. If you define 75% as your point of zero, the difference between 75% and 80% from the 0% watermark means 20% based on the 75% mark.

With other words, with 75% res you suffer 5/4 times as much damage as with 80% and 5 times as much as with 95% while 5% are just 1/20.
 
Arkardo

Arkardo

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Statistics on Resistances

krischan said:
5% of what ? The interesting number isn't the negated damage, but the remaining damage, as that's what hurts, so it's actually you who has a distorted understanding about the issue.

You are considering the case from a 0% res perspective while you have to consider it either from the 75% point of view. If you define 75% as your point of zero, the difference between 75% and 80% from the 0% watermark means 20% based on the 75% mark.

With other words, with 75% res you suffer 5/4 times as much damage as with 80% while 5% are just 1/20.
Click to expand...
I think Blood_and_Iron meant 20%, the difference between 75% (the normal cap) and 95% (the elevated cap). Actually, I agree with him; 20% resist will always take away the same amount of damage. Of course, the more resist, the better.

On a side note: absorb is capped at 40%, so if you have 95% resist and 40% absorb, you will absorb 40% of the remaining 5% damage, leaving you with 1% damage. So, yeah, that's pretty much immune (especially with integer absorb, even though that comes before resists).



 
stephan

stephan

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Statistics on Resistances

Arkardo said:
I think Blood_and_Iron meant 20%, the difference between 75% (the normal cap) and 95% (the elevated cap). Actually, I agree with him; 20% resist will always take away the same amount of damage. Of course, the more resist, the better.
Click to expand...
But the 'meaning' of 'the same amount of damage' has completely changed. Going from 75 to 95 means going from taking a reasonable amount of damage to almost 0 damage. Going from 0 to 20 means still taking a lot of damage regardless. Rather than looking at how much damage it prevents, you should look at how many more hits you can take with more res. This difference is not cosmetic, it's very real.

On a side note: absorb is capped at 40%, so if you have 95% resist and 40% absorb, you will absorb 40% of the remaining 5% damage, leaving you with 1% damage. So, yeah, that's pretty much immune (especially with integer absorb, even though that comes before resists).
Click to expand...
Integer absorb comes after %absorb, not before resistances.



 
krischan

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Re: Statistics on Resistances

The interesting number is the quota of two values, not the difference. Of course, the OP actually talked about a difference, but he didn't mean it in a mathematical sense. The difference between two values has no meaning if it's not considered in comparison to their magnitude - which considering the quota actually is.

At Blood_and_Iron: Sorry if my choice of words sounded a bit harsh, my English vocabulary is a bit limited :whistling:
 
NASE

NASE

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Statistics on Resistances

You can prove anything with statistics. There simply isn't a way to look at them correct - be it relative or absolute. If you look at them from the perspective of a gloam attack to a lvl 1 character, 95% has the same effect as -100% - you're dead anyway.
 
krischan

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Re: Statistics on Resistances

I'm not trying to prove anything. The OP has a question and the kind of answer depends on how he meant it. If he wants to know to which extent it's better to have e.g. 95% res instead of 75%, the answer is that 95% leads to 5 times less elemental damage in comparison to 75% res.

Others might take him literally and calculate the difference between 75% and 95%. However, I'm sure that the OP already knows that.
 
krischan

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Re: Statistics on Resistances

Integer absorb comes after resistances as well. Their order of application is:

Resistances
% absorb
Integer absorb
 
krischan

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Re: Statistics on Resistances

I forgot: There is no physical absorption (i.e. negating damage together with healing the absorbed amount), only damage reduction (i.e. negation of damage without healing) where integer DR comes before % DR and before physical resistance as well IIRC. My previous posting didn't refer to physical damage and DR/PDR.
 
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