Spirit of barbs.

[Sint Nikolaas]

Spirit of barbs.

So here I was wondering something and I couldn't find a good answer in any thread I searched. It's clear to me that the damaged returned from SoB is quite low. Low enough to not bother with it normally in PvP. However when minions come in to play the story gets different, someone dealing damage to a minion is hurting himself alot more then someone dealing damage to a player (no penalty).

So here's the set up:
If a player is doing physical damage of say 6000. He's dueling me, a druid, who for some reason has a point in SoB and summon wolves. With a couple of skills added by my equipment I can have 5 wolves out and about 210% damage returned by the spirit. Let's not worry about the type of druid I am.. just keep to this case.

Alright now the questions.
If this guy is hitting me he'd be doing 1000 dmg and about 166 of that would be returned to him right? Not that interesting..
Now let's say he's hitting a wolf. The minion doesn't fall under the pvp penalties. But how much damage does the wolf take and how much damage would be returned? Let's say the wolf has about 100 life. Would the guy then take 100*2,1 = 210 dmg back? Or would he take 1000*2,1 = 2100 back (IE he being cut in 1/6 because of pvp)? Or would he take 6000*2,1 = 12600 back? That'd be one hefty wolf...

Even if he'd only take 210 dmg back that'd still be quite a bit in pvp.. If you can boots your wolfs life to say 400 then he'd get 800 damage returned. Getting 5 of them would mean 4000 dmg then. IMO it's worth it to just invest that one or two skill points to get a SoB (since you'll probably have the wolves anyway).

So.. what do you guys think? :smiley:

 

[DIEnamic]

first off, he would have to be a moron to keep hitting your wolves.
second, you are forgetting about his DR.
third, wolf needs a ton of hp if it were to actually work.

have you ever seen an iron maidened barb trying to kill a clay golem?

I've thought about trying it as an anti-townguard kind of measure, by stacking my rabies druid with edge, bramble, spirit of barbs and bear. never really tried it though.

imo using clay golem is much more effective due to clay golem having an enormous life pool

 

[conor rocks]

first off, he would have to be a moron to keep hitting your wolves.
second, you are forgetting about his DR.
third, wolf needs a ton of hp if it were to actually work.

have you ever seen an iron maidened barb trying to kill a clay golem?

I've thought about trying it as an anti-townguard kind of measure, by stacking my rabies druid with edge, bramble, spirit of barbs and bear. never really tried it though.

imo using clay golem is much more effective due to clay golem having an enormous life pool

Would a grizzly bear work?

 

[Sint Nikolaas]

Listen, I know about the draw backs and a single swing attack just has to target the player (smite ofcourse).. but I wasn't asking about that, I was asking about the damage.
The only interesting thing you said was ''wolf needs a ton of hp if it were to actually work''. Would this mean that the player will indeed only take back the amount of damage the spirit wolf has in life points? As is the 100 life = 210 dmg?

 

[DIEnamic]

Would a grizzly bear work?

i've tried it, but it doesnt seem to return quite enough damage to kill a barb in one hit. stacked druid with bramble, edge, max spirit of barbs yet the bear tends to die before the barb

keep in mind the barb was twinked out of his mind though. had tons of vita charms and in the end nearly 5k hp. I wouldn't be suprised if it managed to pwn lesser barbs.

Listen, I know about the draw backs and a single swing attack just has to target the player (smite ofcourse).. but I wasn't asking about that, I was asking about the damage.
The only interesting thing you said was ''wolf needs a ton of hp if it were to actually work''. Would this mean that the player will indeed only take back the amount of damage the spirit wolf has in life points? As is the 100 life = 210 dmg?

as far as I can tell, it works like this. though I haven't extensively tested a druid thorns pvp build apart from grizzly, my experiences with a necro thorns pvp build shouldn't be too different.

on a tcp/ip game I tested this with a friend set as a standard bvc. keep in mind I used necro mainly for amp damage to double returned damage.

when using a lesser health golem, like a blood golem for example the damage return was bleak. though he does the same damage to every golem, the damage that would return back to him caps off at the point where the golems hp ends therefore returning much less damage than its capable of.

however by using a synergized maxed clay golem that has a grand total of 28k hp, he merely tickled it while returning pretty much full damage. despite being stacked with DR, the damage he returned was enough to kill himself one hit in most cases.

using charges of spirit of barbs can pump your returned damage through the roof, but its really moot since you already return enough to kill him with level 36 thorns + amp. more insult to injury is never a bad thing though.

by amping and summoning a clay golem in front of myself before he ww'd me, pretty much spelled gg for him.

the difference between the necro and a druid thorns build is that the returned damage is far more significant as a necro because of amp/iron maiden. druids using edge/bramble/sob and a grizzy works decently well, but it'll take most pub barbs around 3-4 hits to do themselves in vs the grizzly, that is if the grizzly is actually still alive at that point. in most cases thats 3 hits more than a smart person would take.

an advantage to a druids thorns build would be that you could also build a pretty strong rabies druid as well. since you would be wearing bramble anyway and rabies has only one synergy, you only have to max 2 skills to have a badass rabies druid. can't say the same for the necro on the other hand.

next time my buddy has free time, I'll test out a thorns druid more. we only really spent about 10 minutes goofing around with it and gave up after we realised that thorns necro blew it away. I suppose you could shop a amp charge wand from akara if you really wanted to make it work though.

 

[conor rocks]

i've tried it, but it doesnt seem to return quite enough damage to kill a barb in one hit. stacked druid with bramble, edge, max spirit of barbs yet the bear tends to die before the barb

keep in mind the barb was twinked out of his mind though. had tons of vita charms and in the end nearly 5k hp. I wouldn't be suprised if it managed to pwn lesser barbs.



as far as I can tell, it works like this. though I haven't extensively tested a druid thorns pvp build apart from grizzly, my experiences with a necro thorns pvp build shouldn't be too different.

on a tcp/ip game I tested this with a friend set as a standard bvc. keep in mind I used necro mainly for amp damage to double returned damage.

when using a lesser health golem, like a blood golem for example the damage return was bleak. though he does the same damage to every golem, the damage that would return back to him caps off at the point where the golems hp ends therefore returning much less damage than its capable of.

however by using a synergized maxed clay golem that has a grand total of 28k hp, he merely tickled it while returning pretty much full damage. despite being stacked with DR, the damage he returned was enough to kill himself one hit in most cases.

using charges of spirit of barbs can pump your returned damage through the roof, but its really moot since you already return enough to kill him with level 36 thorns + amp. more insult to injury is never a bad thing though.

by amping and summoning a clay golem in front of myself before he ww'd me, pretty much spelled gg for him.

the difference between the necro and a druid thorns build is that the returned damage is far more significant as a necro because of amp/iron maiden. druids using edge/bramble/sob and a grizzy works decently well, but it'll take most pub barbs around 3-4 hits to do themselves in vs the grizzly, that is if the grizzly is actually still alive at that point. in most cases thats 3 hits more than a smart person would take.

an advantage to a druids thorns build would be that you could also build a pretty strong rabies druid as well. since you would be wearing bramble anyway and rabies has only one synergy, you only have to max 2 skills to have a badass rabies druid. can't say the same for the necro on the other hand.

next time my buddy has free time, I'll test out a thorns druid more. we only really spent about 10 minutes goofing around with it and gave up after we realised that thorns necro blew it away. I suppose you could shop a amp charge wand from akara if you really wanted to make it work though.

How much damage did it do because maybe 1 point in sob and grizzly would be good for wind druid?