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Slow thingy/Beetlebug (?)

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by LprMan, Feb 1, 2004.

  1. LprMan

    LprMan IncGamers Member

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    Slow thingy/Beetlebug (?)

    Hi all!

    I was doing WSK runs with my sorc (FO/Meteor) and I was killing Lister's pack. I had noticed that sometimes Lister and his minions can damage my HF merc seriosly, but sometimes he can be surrounded by them without taking a scratch. That is weird imo, because he doesn't have that high defense. On next run I tested if they can hit me. When I had only Lister left, I just stood and let him attack me. Lister attacked me about 20 times before my merc killed him, and I didn't take any damage, he was unable to hit me. It is not my defense which causes that, Lister has 93% chance to hit me and I have 6% chance to block. I figured out that it is the combination of HF & FO which causes this, double freezed monsters can't hit anything. Also my merc takes damage against Lister only when he is CI and cannot be slowed down by FO. Same thing goes with Baal. My necro can survive the battle against him even with -50 resists when I use Clay Golem (60% slow) and Decrepify because Baal is unable to cast his spells then. He just sits and waits until my skellies & merc kill him. So is this just a normal thing I haven't noticed before or something new/useful?

    My second story is about those beetles. I was playing my WW druid and in act 2 hell and a boss pack of beetles attacked me. I normally started killing them, but...their lightnings dealed HUGE damage. I had ~50% Fres and 75% Lres and about 4500 life. I was killed by 3 lightnings...I think it is because the boss was FE. Does that FE bug affect their lightnings?? Because later in act 2 (Maggot Lair) I was killed in same way again. If this is a bug, I haven't heard of it before
     
  2. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

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    There is DEFINITELY a bug with Beetles and FE. I've mentioned it a few times before with regard to my assassin. I've taken over 500 damage from a minion's hit...48%PDR, 90% fire resist, 95% lightning resist with +20 absorb. You'll notice something similar with CE beetle packs. We all know how lethal a unique with FE (bug) can be to melee, but something in the elemental stacking for beetles makes the entire pack lethal if the unique has elemental enchantments. If there's not elemental mods on the unique you can maul them down without a scratch, if the unique has elemental mods, you're in trouble.
     
  3. Starving Poet

    Starving Poet Member

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    I think the problem stands with things stacking in the wrong way. Let's say a Hell Beetle does something in the range of 100 damage per bolt. All figurative, of course.

    Now, these beetles are always LE so we take that damage and apply the LE tranfer:
    Code:
    [font=Courier New]Lightning Minimum Damage: +66% damage 
    Lightning Maximum Damage: +100% damage 
    Chance to Hit:		 x2 
    Lightning Resist:		75% [/font]
     
    [font=Courier New]If Monster is hit, a Monster level Charged Bolt is released.[/font]
    [font=Courier New]In Nightmare and Hell, Minions gain +33-50% Lightning Damage. [/font]
    
    So that boosts our damage to 166-200 per bolt, now we add on FE on top of that:

    Code:
     
    [font=Courier New]Fire Minimum Damage: +66% damage 
    Fire Maximum Damage: +100% damage 
    Chance to Hit:	 x2 
    Fire Resist:	 75% [/font]
     
    [font=Courier New]If dead, does damage of 75%-100% of max hit points, in a radius of 4 yards.[/font]
    [font=Courier New]In Nightmare and Hell, Minions gain +33-50% Fire Damage.[/font]
    
    And that boosts the damage per bolt to something around 265-400 per bolt.

    I figure the beetles being always LE are counting that mod twice when they become boss packs. Same thing can be said of boss packs of any naturally exploding critter. If you do some tests, you notice things like undead stygians are only a minor annoyance, but once they get a single elemental mod, their damage goes up by like a factor of 10. Again, I think they might be counting their intrinsic FE twice.

    At least that is what I think is happening - because there is really no explanation as to how these calcs would work out otherwise.
     
  4. lone_wolf

    lone_wolf Diablo: IncGamers Member

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    think your right there starving. the crack monkeys have done it yet again.
     
  5. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

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    I think it's alot more than just counting FE or LE twice...to deal 500+ damage to someone with 90% resist requires 5000 damage...~400 is more than 10 times less than that. It's alot more serious than a few doublings.
     
  6. LprMan

    LprMan IncGamers Member

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    I think their death explosion damage is added to their lightning bolt damage some way
     
  7. Starving Poet

    Starving Poet Member

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    Oh, I know. I was just saying that I think the calculations are becoming exponential. They forgot to reset variables or something. It just seems they are taking values on top of values, rather than taking the base calculations and doing an overall sum.

    This can also be seen in the effect of mana burn. Granted I don't ever have character with 500+ mana, but every single mana burn character I've EVER encountered in 1.10 has been able to clear my mana bulb with 1 hit. That includes hits from a mana burned holy fire aura. Even if mana burn is suppossed to do 4x damage, I know that holy fire from a level 20 creature does not do 100 damage and can empty my 400+ mana in one aura hit. (Noticed when I was leveling my last merc.)
     
  8. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

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    Yeah, that's my guess too...would explain the absurb damage numbers seeing as they're based on the monsters' hps.
     

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