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single player melee sin

Discussion in 'Assassin' started by galzohar, May 19, 2008.

  1. galzohar

    galzohar IncGamers Member

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    single player melee sin

    First limitations to this build (which is why I'm not just using some pre-made guide build):
    -no traps as a main attack (DS is fine of course) as if I wanted to make a trapper I wouldn't be making this post.
    -No bartuc's available, but I do have Firelizard's Talons, Shadow Killer and a perfect cruel scissors suwayyah of quickness (no good +skills). Got dual +3 shadow claws to use on switch.
    -Other items available offer very few +skill bonuses with medium resistances.
    -At least 1 of each rune up to Um, 1 Gul and nothing above that. Various socketed items to make runewords in, although none seem useful.
    -No mods/addons.

    Considering you have ~85 points to use by the time you kill hell baal, you can basically max 4 skills (will not be planning on a 99 build...), so was thinking about:

    1. CoT+PS+DC+mastery - lightning+physical damage. What I fear of with this build is low lightning damage against physical immunes and low physical damage (seems weak damage/sec even with those claws) against lightning immunes, as well as overall weak AOE damage due to low +skills.

    2. TS+DT+CoT+PS - TS+DT for decent AOE and CoT for PI/FIs. My fear is that the damage will be cut too low by both fire and physical resistance of non-immune mobs and by the fact I don't think I have a lot of gear that would give me good str for kicking while keeping survivability reasonable. as well as low damage on both fire and physical immune mobs due to low +skills.

    3. Dual elemental+mastery - doesn't take advantage of the claws though and PS is quite anoying to use to get the desired charge (due to various reasons, mainly the randomness of missing and trying to attack fast, so you either have to attack very slow to see if you got a chargeup or just miss occasionally and get too many chargeups). Also low +skills may make this too weak.

    Which do you think will work best under the budget? Or is there something else I'm missing (that's not a trapper)? Was thinking blade flurry but for that to do real damage I'd need a good 2h and amazing attack rating (I have a rare >400% ED elite maul but no ITD not to mention ITD doesn't work on bosses anyway where blade flurry really shines) - I do guilaume's face for 35% CB and CB gloves which is alright but not a lot.

    Overall I'm trying to make something that won't struggle like a melee sorc/nec or summoner, but it doesn't have to be a killing machine like a hammerdin. Just something to have fun with to get through the game all the way to matriach without having to cast a TP every 2 minutes in fear of dying and having to retrieve corpse ;)
     
  2. Scudstorm

    Scudstorm IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    Overall, all the builds you mentioned are viable. I advice against any Phoenix variant due to the lack of +skills. TS+DT would be fine. Consider Venom instead of CoT for PI/FIs. The pure claw/venom build should work nicely as well.

    CoS and Mindblast will make your life a lot easier, as will DS. Just make a couple corpses, and there will soon be more corpses :p
     
  3. galzohar

    galzohar IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    Yeah 1 pointers are obvious, as they only cost 1 point anyway ;)

    Venom doesn't seem all that strong though... Runnign some numbers seems to overall help killing speed more than maxing DC, but the attack rating against those fire immunes will be quite bad and the damage will be quite low (~1000/sec) against physical immunes (then again PIs don't really have a lot of HP most of the time).

    What's the best way to up kick damage without the survivability cost? I suppose I need to be crafting myrmidon's greaves and hope for good resistances? (got plenty of emeralds and runes, can myrmidon's greaves be shopped in A5?). Is STR worth raising and/or gearing for or do I still only put str for gear and rest in vit to not die? Go for something like lionheart armor or will shaftstop (can upgrade) be a better choice?

    Main weakness of this build though is lack of AOE against fire immunes, but I suppose you can say that about any build that doesn't go for traps nor dual elemental chargeups, and I don't want a trapper and my elemental chargeups will probably be too weak with only something like ~5 +skills.
     
  4. robzombiesslave

    robzombiesslave IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    TS+DT all the way. Also, I agree with the Venom over CoT.

    I've always wanted to make a BF sin. But they seem a tad espensive (if you want a fast killing speed).

    Just one question, what do you mean summoners struggle? I havent died yet with mine yet and im level 87 now. (hardcore :p)

    Edit* Venom is pretty strong, keep in mind venom does its damage over .4 seconds. level 30 Venom will give you 725-745 over .4 seconds. so hypothetically speaking thats 1812-1862 damage per second (if you can refresh it quick enough)

    & level 25 venom does 565-585 per .4 seconds so thats well over 1k damage per second. It wont give you any AOE. However, it should be enough to deal with those PI's. And fire immunes shouldnt be that difficult either.

    Regardless you can buff venom and it will stay active all the time (even against non PI/FI). CoT requires you to charge up, which takes away from other charges.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  5. galzohar

    galzohar IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    Struggle as in they take a long time to kill things, didn't say anything about survivability ;)

    I also checked out DTalon damage/sec but it seems less than what I would get with DC and venom (or just maxed DC).

    Seems like a fully charged up DT is a bit under 10k fire, subject to both physical and fire resistances (so say a pack with 20% to both would only take 64% of that). Should be a decent killer although since the fastest possible would be once every ~1.2 seconds it won't be amazing but should work (again if resistances aren't too high), probably better than other options at least.
    I don't see how to get it noticeably higher, though, as its damage mostly comes from the TS skill bonus which only multiplies the boot damage. Every point of STR or ED% add slightly more than a measly 1 damage point to the base kick which is 2.4 fire damage, which means ~400 str just to increase fire damage output by 10%... At least that damage output will stay the same in full MF gear ;)

    Any point in getting +skill gear or just max survivability (leech/resists/FHR)? Or anything else I should be looking for?

    On the german calculator it seems I will hit 7 fpa with just the cruel scissors suwayyah of quickness alone with TS but need 48 more IAS for 5fpa (10fpa for both weapons as I understand it) using a [0] speed offhand weapon, or 32 using a [-10] weapon. DT need a lot to reach 7 fpa but getting it to 8 won't take much.

    Should I use Firelizard's Talons with a shield for kicking and have the cruel of swiftness+Shadow Killer on swap for fire and physical immunes (which would make buffing BoS every 3 minutes a nightmare as I need the +6 skills from the +shadow claws), or just use some kind of combination of what I already have for both attacks? What should I socket in the weapons? Best ED jewels I have are unfortunately ~20% so if I go with cruel+shadow killer then ED in shadow killer and shaels in the cruel, and thus not rely on any IAS from gear at all and have everything at fastest speed except DT at 8 fpa?

    Another thing I can't decide is on helms: I have guillaume's face for CB/deadly strike, a +2 skills with life leech circlet, a steelskull and a (actually a lot more than one) tal's mask.

    Armor - again, shaftstop or lionhear (or anything else that I'm likely to have)?
     
  6. robzombiesslave

    robzombiesslave IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    I see, simple misunderstanding. Though my necro can kill quiet fast with a nice merc to start the CE chain.. Anyways, I thought you ment survivability wise after reading this. VVV


     
  7. galzohar

    galzohar IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    Well obviously you can't kill if you die every 2 seconds, but not dying doesn't mean you have a good killing speed ;)
    I'm not going to play hardcore or anything, but trying to make the best melee sin out of the gear I have, and by best means fastest possible killing and not getting stuck on any mob types (single player so no rushes/skipping/etc and besides I don't like to have a character not capable of doing certain parts of the game), and to kill fast you need to also not die as dying slows you down (not to mention not very fun).
     
  8. Scudstorm

    Scudstorm IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    PS seems the best solution, although you mentioned you don't like it.

    IMO, not getting the "right" charge isn't a big issue: if you map all your skills on your right mouse button and just hold it down while switching skills, you'll attack so fast you wouldn't notice you sent out a "wrong" charge :p
     
  9. robzombiesslave

    robzombiesslave IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    Yes, but in sc you can play alot more offensively which then in term might keep you alive better. "Best defense is offense" :thumbsup: Dont worry though, you should have both killing speed and survivability.

    lol scud a couple of posts ago you, "advised against PS" :scratch:
     
  10. Scudstorm

    Scudstorm IncGamers Member

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    Re: single player melee sin

    oops, didn't double check his gear :grin:

    Effectively, with few +skills PS wouldn't be a very good idea...
     

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