# Shout/Iron Skin defense questions

#### d00m2k

##### Diabloii.Net Member
Shout/Iron Skin defense questions

I'm making a HC BvA and I have some questions:

First, why do a couple guides say max Iron Skin first, then put your remaining points into shout? Shout provides more +defense, unless I'm wrong.

Second, on your average BvB, what is the defense and chance to hit difference between max Shout + 1pt Iron Skin, and 20 Shout/20 Iron Skin?

#### GreyGhost

##### Banned
I think that shout and iron skin are calculated differently, with iron skin adding to base def while shout adds a %-percentage on top.

Maybe you can have someone test the second question for you if they have a character editor or something. *Remember that dexterity plays an important role in blocking too, so don't rely solely on defense.

#### Barloc

##### Diabloii.Net Member
I'm making a HC BvA and I have some questions:

First, why do a couple guides say max Iron Skin first, then put your remaining points into shout? Shout provides more +defense, unless I'm wrong
At lvl 1,iron skin starts at 30% def bonus and shout starts at 100%.
either one of them add 10% per lvl afterwards with no other differences
in how its calculated to your defense. I just tried to test and I get the same

You don't have to cast iron skin to get a def bonus of course, but since you
need to BO anyway, then I would shout, making BO last alot longer. Plus it'll

#### RTB

##### Diabloii.Net Member
I think that shout and iron skin are calculated differently, with iron skin adding to base def while shout adds a %-percentage on top.
No, they add up and are then multiplied with the base defense.

#### Barloc

##### Diabloii.Net Member
Second, on your average BvB, what is the defense and chance to hit difference between max Shout + 1pt Iron Skin, and 20 Shout/20 Iron Skin?
well i dunno if i'd look at it that way but i'd say 30k defense is a good number to use as a basis for def calculations. 19 in iron and 33 wc with gear/warcry weapons is gettin me 23776, and thats with 1908def fort and 450def arreat, no special prebuff -30k easy with some more prebuff items. Barbs using higher eth
armour/helm are gonna be even more, like 40k+ so I say 30k avg.

You can use this to calc chance to hit.
100 * AR / (AR + DR) * 2 * alvl / (alvl + dlvl)
AR = Attack Rating; alvl = Level of Attacker; dlvl = Level of Defender; DR = Defense Rating

#### Eilo Rytyj

##### Diabloii.Net Member
A point in Shout is the same as a point in Iron Skin, correct? 10% per point.

Only difference is that Shout is party-friendly and synergises with BO, BC and Berserk.

I'd say max Shout before putting another point in Iron Skin.

I think it's always been Shout before Iron Skin as the general rule.

#### Camden

##### Diabloii.Net Member
A point into iron skin then maxing shout first is the most logical approach...