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Shadow Warrior or Master for untwinked trapsin ?

Discussion in 'Assassin' started by Nubi, Apr 11, 2005.

  1. Nubi

    Nubi IncGamers Member

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    Shadow Warrior or Master for untwinked trapsin ?

    I've just started playing D2X again, and I'm going to make a trapsin.
    My idea so far is to do stats:
    Str/Dex: 79 for greater talons
    Nrg: base, or maybe add 20 or 30 points here
    Vit: rest :)

    For skills I'd max a summon, though which one I dunno for sure. With warrior I can have it toss traps more often, but the master is just much stronger.
    So which one is better for a trapsin using only what she finds ?

    I'll go C/C for more +skills from gambled claws at higher lvls.
    This also means I'll pump a few points in weapon block, I'm thinking somewhere around 5, and then I hope to get +5 from items, is this unrealistic ?
    Also I'll dump a few points into fade, to get my res up, since I have no über items for this purpose.

    The build must be able to survive in HC, so I'm partly following the "ghost" guide here: http://strategy.diabloii.net/news.php?id=556

    For the trap skills I think I've got it under control, so my primary question is which summon to pump ?
     
  2. Day

    Day IncGamers Member

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    First off good luck I realy enjoyed my Trapasin! Mine was softcore - no deaths - one save and exit - got trapped playing when I was tired.

    Base energy is definitly all you need.

    Plus skills are pretty easy to get - you can shop them in Act 5 (just run in and out of the portal). Plus 3 traps claws are fairly easy to shop - around 15 - 20 mins per claw. So plus 5 is very realistic.

    It's possible to get plus 3 traps claws with plus to another skill (but hard). Plus 3 trap amulets can be gambled as well. So plus 9 to traps through shopping and gambling is pretty easy.

    Also consider shopping for plus 3 claws to shadow disiplines - put two of these on switch and get plus 6 to your summons!

    PS assume you got it covered but Fire Blast is very good for Hell (i maxed LS, DS and FB and then added into another lightning skill for synergy). Also would recommend the Holy Freeze merc!

    Alternatively, go for 2 x plus 2 to Assasin skills claws (again shop for them) - (which is what i did) as it gives you plus 4 to important skills like fade, claw block etc).

    I used Master and was very happy - cast at level 17 (includingplus skills).

    I took points in mindblast (never really used it) and cloak of shadows ditto so I'd skip these if I did it again.

    I also took a point in blade fury with a CB blow weapon and shield on switch -at the cost of 1 point - I found this (a) fun and (b) useful - use the Cb against bosses whilst your traps are going off (your to hit won't be great but you can't have everything!). If you go for this a point in Venom adds to the fun.

    I had with plus skills 49% ish claw block and added dex to give me the same with my CB weapon and shield on switch - don't know why just seemed tidy!
     
  3. jerichob

    jerichob IncGamers Member

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    All the suggestions seems very reasonable, but I have one concern. How I can get a good claw block? You mention something like 49%, how can I get there?

    Apologies for such basic questions, but it's really my first time when I play trapsin for real.
     
  4. PallyRanger

    PallyRanger IncGamers Member

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    I went a tiny bit different route for my Trapsin:

    Instead of giving her two claw weapons as a primary choice, I gave her a Bartucs and Spirit monarch shield. The sheild helped with the resists and it gave me a decent chance to block and +2 to skillz so I wont complain. On switch, I have another Bartucs and a rare greater claw with +2 assn skills,+2 to traps,+3 to shadow disciplines, and a couple other useless mods.
    I like the spirit shield/claw combo. Helps out for me because my resists are poor at best even with fade. Just my $.02.

    -PallyRanger
     
  5. Day

    Day IncGamers Member

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    On the claw block the table is

    Level 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 etc


    Chance To Block +% 26 32 36 39 42 44 46 47 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 56

    So you have very bad diminishing returns. I settled on 49% as after that 1 point only gives 1% xtra blocking. Hopefully you will have some plus skills in your set up - You could go with less.

    You could go for slightly less Trap skills so have plus 2 assassin claws (i.e. plus 2 Traps rather than 3 per claw) which would give you plus 4 to traps (so with one point you have 42% block. Failing that its putting a couple of "real points" which will have to come from the Ttrap Synergy's i.e. slightly weaker traps but better survivability.
     
  6. jerichob

    jerichob IncGamers Member

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    The table looks straightforward, but I'm a little confused in general. Are you talking about the claw block skill (under Shadow Disciplines tree, the one with two swords crossed...)?
     
  7. Day

    Day IncGamers Member

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    Thats it - points in the skill give you a chance to automatically block attacks - so 49% of attacks blocked gives a big safety advantage - almost saves you have the damage (note not every type of attack can be blocked) but its still a massive help..
     
  8. jerichob

    jerichob IncGamers Member

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    Okies, now I get it, thanks Day!

    So it seems there are 2 approaches: yours with 2 claws and weapon block skill @ 49% and an alternative is Hoto + Spirit Shield and Mind Blast + running a lot rather than blocking. Both seem very reasonable and I want to experiment with both. The former seems more assassinish to me :) , the latter more like a general strat for a caster. Also the latter requires more expensive equipment (Hoto). Anyway... just some pros and cons... I bet both are fully playable.
     
  9. Ymp

    Ymp Banned

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    The question still stands: which minion is suggested? Master, or Warrior ?

    Also, another question that is slightly ot, but I'd like to make this post count:
    Does the same apply to ormus as to facets when we talk about a trapsin? Meaning that facets don't influence the trap damages... ormus doesn't either?
     
  10. Naliworld

    Naliworld IncGamers Member

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    Pretty much the only difference worth noting is that you have more control over what the SWarrior uses(although, if you want your Shadow to be able to do reasonable claw damage, go with the SM as she gets better claws at higher levels. SWarriors also get defense boosts, but Assassins have never been big on defense, and the Shadow is no exception), but that can be a double edged sword - for a Trapper especially.

    Specifically, you have a limit of 5 active Traps that is shared by both you and your Shadow. If you have five Traps of your own set, and your Shadow decides to cast one of her own, one of your own Traps gets destroyed. Usually, this is a bad thing, as unless you specifically gear your equipment for it, you'll set higher damaging Traps than your Shadow, as a pure Trapper.

    However, due to some oddities/features in how the level for skills the Shadows use is determined, Traps laid by Shadows have the potential to match, or even beat the best human Traps, shot per shot). In effect, since you depend on your Shadow to do the real damage, you become the 'minion', and the SWarrior the 'master'. ;) However, due to some practical problems, this build is not very popular. Check the Assassin FAQ for details(under the Shadow Disciples section).

    SMs on the other hand are autonomous, and that too is a double-edged sword. SMs seem to love casting Mindblast for some reason. When used properly, MB can be a lifesaver and very effective crowd controller, but when overused, it is a huge annoyance due to the conversion effect, which prevents players from killing converted monster and causing them to wait unnecessarily. So if you pick the SM, expect both of the above to happen.

    Also due to the SM's autonomy, don't expect it to be a pure tank. The SM is a fickle beast and chooses when it wants to be on the frontlines, and when it wants to hang back and take a supportive role. IME, SMs usually spawn with a particular mindset in mind, eg. tank, support, MB spammer or an even mix, and recasting seems to help change its mindset, though YMMV. While the SM will still help take some of the load off other players/minions, make sure you have a melee mercenary or play with other characters.

    Ymp: Yes, the Ormus' Robes do not Trap damage in any way(they affect SWeb and FB damage as per normal, though).
     

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