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Sex Offenders and the Justice System

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by SaroDarksbane, Sep 5, 2006.

  1. SaroDarksbane

    SaroDarksbane IncGamers Site Pal

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    Sex Offenders and the Justice System

    (No, it's not another thread about the spat that Smeg and I have, although I am interested to hear his opinion on the subject. :laugh:)

    Link
    Great. So now people can be punished by the justice system without even so much as a trial. Hurray for freedom.
     
  2. PatMaGroin

    PatMaGroin IncGamers Member

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    Hooray beer!
     
  3. Module88

    Module88 IncGamers Member

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    So, they've never been charged with a sex offense, and they're sex offenders? Yay! I love the guilty until proven innocent system. That's how you stamp out dissent and crime!
     
  4. SaroDarksbane

    SaroDarksbane IncGamers Site Pal

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    BOOOO CREEPY FOOT DOCTOR!

    *writes doctor's name down on sex offender registry*
     
  5. Talga Vasternich

    Talga Vasternich IncGamers Member

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    So someone who plea-bargains their way out of a sex-crime charge isn't really a sex offender?
    How about someone who molested a child/children and bought their way out of criminal charges by paying off their accuser? Are they or are they not a sex offender?
     
  6. thegiantturtle

    thegiantturtle IncGamers Member

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    Terms of the plea bargain should include registration. That would be fine and legal.

    I have problems with this practice anyway. I think the government should force them to testify. The state should bring the charges in the case of sexual abuse and molestation the same way they do in cases of spousal abuse.


    If you read the article, the list was an alternative suggested by the Catholic Church to keep their members from being prosecuted. There is definitely a question of motive here. Also, it was not going to be just a whimsical list that anyone could add to. To be added to the list, a judge would have to civilly declare someone liable. If this civil declaration is proceeded by a civil trial with the standard preponderence of evidence watermarking, I'm cool with it.
     
  7. Module88

    Module88 IncGamers Member

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    Who's fault is that? The lawyer that accepted the bargain or the offender who took what he could get? If someone is a sex offender, you should have enough evidence to prosecute a vast majority of the time. The fact that he's plea bargaining in the first place should tell you something about that person.

    Again, who's fault is that? "Well, I guess I won't press charges since you bribed me"?

    If they committed a sex offense, yes. But if you dont' have the evidence to even bring it to court, who's to say they are? Suspicion doesn't cut it in our system, and I much prefer it that way.
     
  8. Sir EvilFreeSmeg

    Sir EvilFreeSmeg Banned

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    I remember seeing an article soon after this one came out saying that it wasn't going to happen. Damned if I can find it now.
     
  9. Ranger14

    Ranger14 IncGamers Member

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    Yeah, it tells me they are guilty and getting off on a smaller offense. It changes the outcome, but it doesn't change the fact they are a sexual offender. So, it doesn't matter whose fault it is that they weren't charged, what matters is the sexual misbehavior of the person who was let off. He or she is the person who is responsible for their actions. That is who people are concerned about being protected from.
     
  10. SaroDarksbane

    SaroDarksbane IncGamers Site Pal

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    A plea bargain? That's where they plead guilty in return for a lesser sentence, right?

    If you plead guilty, it is no different than if you are found guilty by a jury, so in that case the registration should follow as normal.
    You are a sex offender if you are found guilty in a court of law. Just because you paid someone off does not necessarily make you a sex offender. It certainly hints to it, but it doesn't constitute proof.
     
  11. Module88

    Module88 IncGamers Member

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    Exactly. Pleading guilty. So, if you plead guilty, then you'd be subject to the same thing as someone found guilty in a court of law, no? So where's the problem?
     
  12. MadMachine

    MadMachine IncGamers Member

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    Well that's Ohio for you.

    I can see their point - there are a lot of ways that offenders can slip through the cracks or get mere slaps on the wrist and then absolutely disappear.

    Look at Karla Homolka in Canada. She and her boyfriend Paul Bernardo raped and killed two teenage girls (one was her sister); he's in jail but she got a reduced sentence through a plea bargain and she was out last summer. After a brief appearance right after she got out, she's now completely disappeared.

    I wouldn't mind knowing exactly where she was so that I don't buy a house next door. Or in the neighbouring city. Or province.

    It's been argued that she's way more nutter than he was.

    I know it's a slightly different situation, but still. Geez.
     
  13. Ranger14

    Ranger14 IncGamers Member

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    Well, you came across in your response to Talga when he said that plea bargaining shouldn't change the fact that the person is a sex offender as if it is the attorney's fault and not the offender's fault. Perhaps I misunderstood something there.
     
  14. Dondrei

    Dondrei IncGamers Member

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    WHAT THE HELL!!??

    How is that possible? How exactly can you be a sex offender if you haven't even been CHARGED!!?? It's not even like they're saying if they haven't been CONVICTED...

    I'm speechless. This is insane, surely it's unconstitutional.

    P.S. I can understand why people are touchy about the subject - just recently a notorious serial child rapist called Mr Baldy (he liked to shave his victim's heads... *shudder*) got released on bail or whatever it was, and got caught walking around the streets despite supposedly being under virtual house arrest. And there was a multiple rapist that got out of jail and went right back to his favourite activity. I mean, you think about that guy's victim (he was particularly brutal, just for the icing on the cake) and the fact that he was a known multiple rapist and people just let him go... it's so vile, you just feel terrible for her (okay, so that wasn't a paedophile but it's a similar thing).

    But this isn't the solution.

    How can you say anyone is or isn't if they haven't been convicted?

    P.S. I don't get it, how do you plea-bargain your way out of being charged with a crime? What's your end of the bargain?

    That's what I thought.

    Absolutely.

    Whose.
     
  15. Module88

    Module88 IncGamers Member

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    What I meant was that the lawyers are also very much responsible for accepting such a deal. Plea bargaining doesn't change the fact that he's guilty, because he admitted it. However, suspicion is hardly enough to justify what the law would do.

    That was careless of me.
     
  16. Drosselmeier

    Drosselmeier IncGamers Member

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    Confessing to something else?
     
  17. MadMachine

    MadMachine IncGamers Member

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    Let me get this straight. Mr. Jones is accused of sexually molesting little Penny from across the street, but for a set of bizarre circumstances, is proven not guilty because some of the witnesses' statements raise a reasonable doubt. This new law would still force Mr. Jones to register with the sexual offender information database?

    Don't you think that the media coverage following the court case and the event would be enough of a deterrent?
     
  18. Drosselmeier

    Drosselmeier IncGamers Member

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    This is worse. If it can actually get worse.

    I don't know if you're British of American, but I remember there being some fairly recent upsets about extra judicial prosecution of sex offender cases in Britain at least. The tabloids published lists of sex offenders with photos and adresses. I don't know if that resulted in any slayings, but I wouldn't be surprised. If not, then we can at least assume that most of those guys suffered some embarrassment and probably a bit of harassment. Being a registered sex offender is a bad thing in the eyes of most people you'll meet. I honestly don't care if people harass rapists, but imagine being the target of some of that and being innocent. Once you're in a register anyone can find you at any time for any reason.
     
  19. Dondrei

    Dondrei IncGamers Member

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    The one thing I don't like about publishing lists of child sex offenders (the ones actually proven guilty, that is) is that they all get lumped in together. There was a story a while back about a guy who touched a 15 year old girl's breast when he was 18 (they were in a consensual relationship) and a neighbour or somebody reported it. Now he's on the list right next to child rapists.

    We really need separate categories to deal with the various degrees of "child sex offender".
     
  20. Dondrei

    Dondrei IncGamers Member

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    Happens to everyone. To be honest, it was probably beyond my mandate; I only brought it up because it happened twice.

    Like what? There's a crime beneath sexual interference with a minor (whatever that is)? The same thing but less serious?
     

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