Ruining a man's life for the sake (or lack) of a conscience

Starseed

Diabloii.Net Member
Ruining a man's life for the sake (or lack) of a conscience

Today was a very peculiar day at work and it went a little something like this:

Shortly after I punch in and start working photo, these two girls show up about 16 years old. Apparently this was the third time they'd come to pick up their photos (which weren't ready yet due to massive backup). I ring them up and a few seconds later they come back to tell me that they ordered singles, not doubles. No big deal, but since they already paid, I have to get a manager to refund them.

Now, the manager on shift, just about everyone hates. He's rude, obnoxious, likes to embarass employees in front of customers, berates customers (which, in an odd way, is what gets me the most because the majority of the people ARE nice and do have honest questions/problems) and is a general asshat. So he's blatantly ignoring my pages for assistance and the girl and I start griping and when she asks me if he was the particular manager I needed to talk to, her friend perks up and says "That guy is such a perv!" (more on that in a bit).

So FINALLY she walks up to him, tries to explain the situation again (apparently there was a first encounter of some sort before I arrived, probably regarding her pictures not being ready on time), and he blows her off after a few curt words. Finally he comes over and all he tells me is "Just rescan the envelope".... without giving her the refund. By this point we're all agitated and I rescan it as singles, give her the difference out of my drawer, and just tell her "Here, look, take both sets on me". Of course this is a crass violation of Loss Prevention but by this point, my very being there is pretty much a violation of loss prevention. So she thanks me and leaves....

About fifteen minutes later a woman comes up to photo, asks for my name (which I give her in full) and at first I ask if this was about the double pics but she says no and just asks to speak to a manager, so I page the guy and she explodes on him, asking what a fifty-something year old man is doing hitting on a sixteen year old girl. Apparently he'd passed a comment asking if "he could have a set of pictures" amongst other things to the kid.

Now, because of that very statement, things get kind of messy because I gave the girl both sets. They're not in the wasted prints bin. If loss prevention comes looking for them (which they will, as I'll explain), they're not there. Guess who the first suspected person in possession is going to be?

So he's really shook up about this, in the most literal sense of the word, as I was barely able to take some papers out of his hands they were rattling so much.

So he leaves eventually and the woman comes in AGAIN, this time with the fuzz. They ask for the manager and I'm kind of just in a state of shock and it takes me a few minutes to page the other manager who just took over the shift. They all go into the office and this is what happened (as I found out):

Cop: Do you have his address?
Manager: Uhm.. you can check his paystubs..
*opens safe, cop gets address from paystubs. Cop calls his house*
Cop: Where do you live?
*hangs up phone, cop & mom get in cop car & leave*

The rest is now a complete mystery to me. I was a little worried about my own involvement at first, until I realized a few things:

This particular manager has already told me a story about some high school girl "fabricating" an attempted **** story to her principal involing him.

I find out from a close friend/employee that he was in jail for knocking out his wife who allegedly attacked him with a knife.

He's also made doubles of pictures before that involved couples.. well, yeah. I mean, just enjoying them while they're printing out is one thing but making copies is.. well, yeah.

Even if the girl denies possessing the pictures, I kind of feel like it's not so much worse as option B) no doubt if they were left at work they would have been snatched up by loss prevention and either hidden or destroyed, clearing him and leaving him to continue this kind of behaviour in the future. Score one for billion dollar conglomerates. They'll always score but.. a kick in the shin doesn't hurt.

Yes, his life might be knocked on it's side but from my first-hand experience with him, he's not an innocent man being wrongly accused of anything. At the same time, however, I feel this selfish sense of vindication in the ruin of a man who is, by all points, my arch-nemesis.

I guess the whole thing is the fact that I got involved, which I haven't done in a long time and I'm not really sure where the Hell it's going to take me from here.

EDIT: After all that, I leave out the most important dilemma (hell, it's 2:30am):

Absolve him, explain that I gave the girl the pictures against policy & persecute myself or deny everything, get a slap on the wrist and let the weight fall on him.
 

Pierrot le Fou

Diabloii.Net Member
I didn't understand that at all.

Are there 3 employees involved? 2? Who's the old man? Your manager? Someone else?

Any chance you could kinda make that into some sort of sensical explanation followed by a question we can understand?
 

LunarSolaris

Diabloii.Net Member
It sounds as if there are several factors involved here, and like PLF, I'm not quite following all of it.

From what I can tell, it sounds as if the manager has some shady past... which he should be getting in trouble for... but this is not for sure as it is second hand information... but that he might get in trouble for real based on your giving out both sets of prints to the girl... but you can keep quiet and it could possibly ruin his life... which he might deserve... or that you can come clean about it... in which case he would be absolved and you would get in a little trouble... but not as much as him if you don't.

Did I get it right?
 

DurfBarian

Diabloii.Net Member
I think there are three main players:
1. Starseed
2. Starseed's manager
3. Customer (young girl)

(3) came to the shop and asked (1) for pics. (1) gave her pics, but she had only requested single prints and didn't want to pay for doubles. (3) had to talk to (2) to get the print price worked out. (2) is a jerk. (1) gives her both sets of pics at the lower price, a no-no in the eyes of the shop. Later on (3)'s mom comes in with an angry tale of (2) being a lecherous old man who wants pics of nubile (3). The pics aren't anywhere to be found (since (3) has them) so it looks like (2) took the pics after all. Police get involved.

The question now is: What should (1) do? Admit that (3) got the extra set of pics for free, getting (2) off the hook and possibly putting himself in line for punishment? Or stay quiet and see whether (3) says nothing about the second set of prints?

My advice: If it's really a police matter at this point, total honesty is the way to go. Don't pin your hopes on an unspoken conspiracy where (3) will keep her mouth shut about the free pics and (2) wil go down in flames; the truth will come out at some point, and you want to be the one who was speaking it.
 
Starseed, first of all, from my part; This is a very nice, and wise, thing to do, asking well grown other people for suggestions like this.. you know what I mean, good on ya!

I reckon you should just tell the truth. Or make your boss do something nice for a whole day or something in exchange for you telling the truth (for a change :))
 

adamfgt78

Diabloii.Net Member
Were the pictures just ordinary snapshots are was there something sexual about them?

I would say that you should be forward about giving the girl the double prints. If this thing goes any further with the police, they are bound to ask about them and I wouldn't risk getting an obstuction of justice or whatever charge over this. Plus, its not like you are the sole person that knows the truth; the girls obviously know that they were given the double prints.

Btw, wasn't it you that was asking about how to get fired? It seems like admitting that you gave out the free pictures would be at least a small step in that direction. Besides being the right/honest/smart thing to do.
 

adamfgt78

Diabloii.Net Member
Re: Durf's post:

It wasn't clear to me that the police/manager have even inquired about the location of the second set of prints. I got the impression that Starseed was just assuming that someone would eventually coming looking for them.

Even if he did keep quiet and/or lie about giving away the second set, its not like it automatically put the guy in jail because: 1) Just because no one can find the prints does not prove that the manager has them. 2) Whether he got the pictures seems somewhat irrelevant. It was the proposition that would be considered sexual harassment or whatever the charge might be.
 

Wuhan_Clan

Diabloii.Net Member
For a minute there I thought I was watching One Hour Photo. Btw, that movie didn't make much sense to me either.
 

Drosselmeier

Diabloii.Net Member
Aren´t you the one trying your best to get fired? Do I have you mixed up with someone?

I think you should come clean about what really happened. Sure, he was acting like an *** but you made were the one breaking that rule. Under the circumstances you shouldn´t get to much of a punishment for what you did. You tried to keep a customer and you confessed when you could just as easily have kept quiet.

No matter what the guys done before, that´s in the past. It seems a bit harsh to me to let the guy get arrested/convicted because he´s a general creep. Lot´s of people are creeps but that´s not criminal.

Where do you live by the way? Is it really illegal to hit on sixteen year olds there?
 

tydon

Diabloii.Net Member
IMO:

Ignore the fact that you have any knowledge that you boss is in trouble. Only confess if you are questioned about what happened. This is the whole dont ask, dont tell thing. If your not asked about it, then just consider this your good deed to the girls to prevent the guy from getting the pictures of them.
 

Deramhus

Banned
Starseed said:
Yes, his life might be knocked on it's side but from my first-hand experience with him, he's not an innocent man being wrongly accused of anything.
he's being wrongly accused of this!
 

Fallen_62

Diabloii.Net Member
adamfgt78 said:
Were the pictures just ordinary snapshots are was there something sexual about them?
that is a good point... if there were sexually orientated, there might be more harsh cansiquences... and if they were, you did the right thing, imho, to give them the pics and keep em away from the manager...

as for keeping quiet or talking, i would say let the police know u gave the girl the second set of pics, to keep em from ur manager if nothing else
 

axeil

Diabloii.Net Member
Tough situation. Retribution instinct says let the ****er burn for being a ****er.

Legal instinct says tell the cops what happened and take the slap on the wrist you'll get.

What you actully should do is keep your mouth shut until the cops come to you for questioning and such. That way if they never come you can still get your revenge on this jackass for being a jackass and if they do come you won't get in any legal fix.

As for the "He's being wrongly accused" argument, the police DO have probable cause. The girls reported him hitting on them and given the circumstantial evidence he looks like a likely suspect. Its his own fault for being an idiot and hitting on underage girls.
 

eddy

Banned
The thing is, depending on were he is, what he was doing wasn't illegal. . . the age of consent in alot of countries is 16, and in some lower. In canada it is 14 . . . So as much of a creep as he is, that is legal.
 

simplyLost

Diabloii.Net Member
Drosselmeier said:
Where do you live by the way? Is it really illegal to hit on sixteen year olds there?
it's most likely not illegal dross.. but when the person has been charged(or whatever) with suspected **** of a teen already.. and has a shady past.. the police would most likely want to look into it.. not to mention that the mother most likely stretched the truth a little bit herself when she talked to the police..

Re durf's post:

i agree 100% even if they haven't said anything about the photo's missing.. if you get asked.. then spill the beans.. if you don't.. spill em anyways.. and if it doesn't work out the way it should (i.e. you're life getting ruined) blame durf.

-Lost
 

tydon

Diabloii.Net Member
If the photos contained images that could be considered sexual, his asking for them would be illegal. And it could be sexual harrasment either way, if they can prove that the sexual attention he gave them was unwarranted, and unwanted.


Edit:

Did you put the cost of the 2nd prints in the cash drawer? I mean, if you didnt, you basically committed fraud in a way.... Either way though, you gave the girls the pictures in a unrelated case, he hit on them, not because you gave them prints. Let the police investigate that separately, if they ask you, be honest.
 

Stevinator

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm going to agree with most of the responders here.

assuming we have this situation figured out, you didn't do anything wrong but ring someone up wrong on purpose to make the customer happy. if that is discovered the worst likely to happen is that you'd have to fix the drawer--and only because you told them it was on you...otherwise no one is going to do anything to you. whatever company you work for can't make you shore up your drawer out of your pocket unless they think you were stealing from it.

so don't worry about you. you're fine. if you keep following your gut you'll do much better than those that are jerks about things. (like your boss). It's also very likely that if something does come of this situation your boss's boss will show up and he'll be the one levying any punishments or rewards for your behavior(and much more importantly your boss's).

If anyone asks, don't lie. definitely do not lie...esp to the police...it just makes you look bad and mess up the police. If this guy has done something wrong, you don't want to seem in anyway shady...you want to be the innocent photo shop kid. Tell the story exactly how it happened...leave out what an *** this guy is and how much you hate him unless they ask that. it'll be hard since you think the guy deserves it...but if they hit him for something and he didn't do it...you don't want to be contributing to it.

I don't think it mattters if the photos were sexually explicit. I think the girls can get him in plenty of trouble either way. the serious thing is not the photos, but the sexual harassment. he didn't bring the photos in, he doesn't have any copies of the photos, so even if they were "nubile" photos he never really had possession of them. if the cops think he has them you really should tell them...but I think the cops would need to be able to prove he had them to get him on that. the harassment is the big issue. that's very touchy...and although in some places the age of consent is low, in most of America it's 17 or 18. and even if they were 25 yr olds, he could still have been harassing them.

the key is to let the cops deal with it. don't get yourself in trouble and not to worry about it. the company you work for will want to keep the bad publicity to a minimum. so they're not going to hang you on this..most likely they'll hang your boss...if anyone.
 
Top