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Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Yossarian, Apr 4, 2007.
I pissed 2!
Choo choo! Here comes the banning train!
The fact that there are some people who don't have a problem doing what they have to (in an attempt to win) hardly means that the Middle East as a whole doesn't care about their family. And so far as being "less than nice" to their family members go, it's usually a result of them doing what they aren't supposed to be doing (by their standards, that is).
You're going to base a foreign policy decision off of a pyramid without even thinking about it?
Your whole plan works under the assumption that, once separated unequally (and how exactly are you going to do that with populations that are already mixed? Forcibly relocate them?) as far as territory and economics is concerned, they'll simply stay where they are and not fight each other. That's absurd, for the reasons I already mentioned (and more below).
What I also find awfully curious is that on one hand, you say they don't care about their families, and on the other hand, they're something along the lines of "scared of causing their own ruin." If they don't care about their families (and presumably don't really care about anyone else), and think they're going to be rewarded in heaven for fighting and dying, why exactly would they stop fighting (this is on top of all of the other factors, by the way)?
Do you think they're fighting now simply because "they're mixed together"? If not, how is separating them (by forcible relocation, which won't be a sweat at all) going to change anything?
No it's not. It's a totally different culture! You are trying to place American standards and norms on people who are very unamerican. I had a student their who shot his brother because his brother "disrespected him" by saying he was "a boy not a man". That's it, nothing more. he went to his room pulled out a 38 and shot his brother. Dozens of students confided that raping a cousin was common practice. Those rapes can sometimes lead to marriages if they are discovered. Men and women live in totally separate parts of the house.
Ignorance is bliss.
People are generally concerned with self and self worth. Care for the family is culturally based. Again you don't even understand the basics of human wants, never mind Arab cultures. Again I say.
Ignorance is bliss.
Making completely baseless and ridiculous claims again, I see. I suppose all those Arab immigrants here are just pretending to care for their families and sending their kids to expensive schools so they can fit in with the rest of society.
It's funny how you're claiming Mod to be transplanting American values on Arabs, when you're doing the exact same thing. You are basically equating respecting women with caring for family. That, I can tell you from 5500 years of human history, just isn't true.
Ya know Yoss, you're wrong man... Not for what you think, but for the way you treat people. Mod didn't deserve that. No one did. It's messed up. Anyone who disagrees with you, you have to put down in some way. Some how, as a "professor" from your side, I find it hard to believe. Ever heard of "Teach don't Preach". Maybe that will help out when you tell everyone how we suck at research, or our links are fly by media. You created this thread, if you don't like "spoon feeding" the rest of us, then don't create the thread. Point blank.
Awfully convenient for you to leave that last part out eh? Let me repeat it: "by their standards, that is." You know, Yoss, they have a different culture than we do. I might disagree with the practice of stoning women for some religious reason, for example, but, if they see it as right and proper (and necessary out of the respect and honor of the family or whatever), then it is right by their standards. It doesn't necessarily mean that they don't care about their family- it just means that the honor of the family must be preserved (which may very well have consequences on the entire family too, so you can even argue that they had to sacrifice one to preserve the well being of the family as a whole).
Yes, and your proposal is, if we move them to different places that are hardly economically equal, they'll stop fighting. Needless to say, this contradicts your own theory.
And of course, it presumes that the only reason there is ethnic conflict in Iraq is BECAUSE they are mixed together. In other words, your proposal is, "if we forcibly relocate the ethnic groups so that they're separated, they won't fight each other." The only reason that would work, of course, is under the premise that they're fighting simply because they are mixed together.
What makes you think they'll just stay on their side of the border, even if you could forcibly find and relocate the major ethnic groups to different parts of Iraq?
Thanks, but I don't really mind ignorant (and unreasonable) ad homs.
That, and how would one go about separating these people by ethnicity? I'm pretty sure lots of Shiites and Sunnis would object toward being forcibly relocated.
Point taken Kev. You can't help stupid people, so don't try. Gotcha. Because taking about ****, that you know nothing about, is actually about posters trying to improve their own low self-worth in their own eyes and really has nothing to do with knowledge.
Look at our examples:
Mod arguing that nothing says love like rape and murder and actually thinking that makes sense on any level.
Blade getting immigrant Americans confused with Middle Easterns (BTW the Sumerians went Agricultural 11,000-12,000 years ago so we've been in communities longer than 5000 year and man is around 200,000 year old if that's what you meant by history).
Mod rewriting quotes: your proposal is, "if we forcibly relocate the ethnic groups so that they're separated, they won't fight each other." Because that's exactly what I wrote. Ah the old strawman defense. The last bastion of the ignorant and defeated.
So what I see here, is that you can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink and that when not drinking, the horse can start talking and magically turn itself into a jackass. That must be what happened in Shrek.
I see you're back to ranting and raving again.
BTW, professor, most historians define History as the beginning of written records, which is around 5500 years ago.
C'mon guys why can't you debate without resorting to personal attacks? Name calling only diminishes your argument, whether you're right or not. Watch the "ignorance is bliss" stuff.
Why the hell are you asking me? :shocked:
I merely said that in instances where things like stoning of women occur, it's usually because they violated some law (religious or otherwise). It might not seem fair in our eyes, but that's their culture.
Of course, since you think all but a few Middle Eastern people/families rape and murder their own family members, that's really a moot point.
How else would you, exactly, split them up into three areas by ethnic lines? Ask nicely and give them flowers? If that's what you propose, I'll be more than happy to take that point up, but I'm not seeing any other way except forcible relocation. But if you have anything to offer, by all means, show the horse the way.
I'm not, just expanding on your point.
1- The definition of love is not the issue here. Whether or not Middle Easterners care for their families is the issue. An arab man might love his women as he would love his property and not as equal human beings, but that doesn't mean he wouldn't care for them.
2- Where do you think those "immigrant Americans" came from? Or are you going to claim that immigrants leave all their culture behind?