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Poison in 1.10

Discussion in 'Hardcore' started by ZappaFan, Mar 9, 2004.

  1. ZappaFan

    ZappaFan Hardcore Moderator and America Trade Moderator

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    Poison in 1.10

    Did poison change the way it worked with the patch? Seems like in 1.09 a melee character could load up on poison charms and the durations all averaged, but with a ranged character you couldn't do that.
     
  2. STINGER

    STINGER IncGamers Member

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    I recall reading that it has changed but i dont recall specifics.
     
  3. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    Zappa,
    Certainly seems that way to me. I had considered making a Venom bowasin (BoS and a "Zephyr" bow are kinda cool) and loading up the poison sc's, but Venom skill certainly doesn't seem to work well with charms for either hand or ranged attack. I hear it shortens the duration of the charm poison to that of the skill...
     
  4. STINGER

    STINGER IncGamers Member

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    See that was what i heard, or thought I heard was changed, where the duration is shortened by haveing an item or skill wiht a very short duration like Venom. IIRC that no longer works.

    My Kicksin, I maxed out venom and honestly she doesnt seem to kill any quicker which is dissapointing.

    I forget the damages listed, but IIRC my sins poison is/was about 2/3 or her kick damage, and I dont know the amount of kicks/sec I get but it seems that in a 6 kick sequence I should get almost 1.5 of my kick damage with Veno on but it doesnt seem that way.

    I think I will try and get a "stooge" to let me kick them barefooted and see what happens.

    ATM I wish I had gone all out MA and skipped Venom.
     
  5. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    Stinger,
    Yeah, I've come to the same sort of conclusion. While I think Venom is fun, it really just doesn't cut the mustard once you're into Hell. I can see the extra damage on the character readout, but only A1 solo monsters actually die from the poison damage any longer. 20 points into a mediocre capability...

    Too bad there's not any equipment that would grant you varied levels of Pally elemental auras; a Teslasin would be wild.
     
  6. STINGER

    STINGER IncGamers Member

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    I intend to take her thru Hell, I am sure she is physicallly capable with Merc and Shadow. i put on the new Sin boots to up the damage which unfortunately lowered CB but i wanted to give them a shot anyway.

    I will get my Forge, and lvl a bit 9the speedy lvlin then redress for full CB and the next DC spawn I get a chance at she will either kick his butt to death or die!!!!!!!!

    Needless to say in late NM wiht lvl 32 MA lvl 28 Shadow skills and 65% crushing she kills fine but I see some serious slow downs coming in Hell in big games. Solo I think she could probably do excellent but so can many other builds. It has been a fun build although not as i had hoped and if I rebuild it wont have Venom!

    I may try out a nice Dragon Tail TS kicker after I am done wiht her since i happen to have a ton of stuff for one.
     
  7. kardinaal

    kardinaal IncGamers Member

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    The way I heard venom worked, is that it just puts poison duration at a fixed lenght (2 sec? - not shure about that though). It's therefore useless to add extra poison sources to venom. It's no going to raise the amount of poison damage much, and it doesn't affect the duration.

    I don't know anything about other sources of poison being changed. Is this change something new (last few days/weeks), or maybe just the better resistances monsters have in 1.10?
     
  8. LuckyDwarf

    LuckyDwarf IncGamers Member

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    This is what I heard...

    Say you have venom doing 500 damage over... 1 second. Now, I haven't used this skill, so this is not the real ratio. Also, you have this 100 damage small charm over 10 seconds. The venom skill will change that poison charm into 10 damage over 1 seconds, matching the skill duration. This will, in turn, make Venom do 510 over 1 seconds, which is a waste of a 1x1 inventory slot for that small charm. Am I wrong?

    Lucky
     
  9. killerxbabe

    killerxbabe IncGamers Member

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    Yeah I think that's right Lucky, can't remember where i read it, but been researching a lot lately to figure out what to do with my upcoming MA sin.

    Stinger, you say you maxed venom... does it work allright when using blade fury at least? Was thinking of doing the same thing and maybe using my 5/5 psn facet with like a lightsabre for blade fury or something along those lines as an alternate ranged attack when I don't want to get close and kick.
     
  10. STINGER

    STINGER IncGamers Member

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    Well.........its better than nothing with IM!!!

    I am using a Tucs and it isnt impressive. I dont know, maybe I have dropped too much CB for it to be effective, but the poison doesnt seem to impressive to me. the amount per .4 sec sure seems like it should do very well but it takes several to do much in late NM.

    i dont know, maybe it is just that i am always in big games and its just not a big game fast killer. Ill try and get her out tonight and kill with and withotu Venom solo and in big game.
     
  11. killerxbabe

    killerxbabe IncGamers Member

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    Awesome, thnx. Just haven't been able to make up my mind as to whether or not I should go the venom route. Guess I could skip it, but I seem to have this problem with always wanting my characters to be able to go anywhere and kill anything and venom looks like it might be handy.
     
  12. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    For solo, I've got Venom at lvl 30 and it raises my damage by about 500 points. The duration is .4 sec, so each blade can do some decent damage. But since my blades don't always hit (a commmon issue with bladesin build) the damage 'gained' is often far less than I might have had with some extra points in trap synergies.
     
  13. killerxbabe

    killerxbabe IncGamers Member

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    Ok... so I can't stop thinking about my baby sin and what she wants to be when she grows up. Well actually i kinda know, but I'm having some trouble figuring out what alternate weapon to use for the throwing weapon. Lightsabre looks really tempting with the elemental damage and the ITD.

    Also have access to a Bloodmoon my necro found in the pit and the 50% open wounds doesn't sound too bad. Of course there is always the 50% MF on a CaneBreak that I have lying around and it's not a bad weapon even without that and the -25% target defense doesn't totally suck. Even toyed with the idea of using a Cruel Thunder maul lying around, but even it's insane damage wouldn't be enough to curb the 3/8 two hander penalty. Argh, my mules are so PHAT on weapons right now. What do y'all use on the switch for throwing?

    Edit: Does a weapons elemental damage take the 3/4 penalty from blade fury along with it's physical?
     
  14. BaNiSeR

    BaNiSeR IncGamers Member

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    yes, from what i remember the psn charms only apply psn dmg in the same time frame as the venom.

    so as you said lucky, 500 over .4 secconds from venom makes all the 100 over 10 seccond psn charms really only add 4 whole points of poison dmg to the attacks.

    then factor in resistance and it really adds nothing. :S

    and the small dmg that venom adds really does nothing in hell from waht ive gathered from the sin forums, thats why all my kickers never used it. just pure unadulterated crushing blow and raw physical dammage.
     
  15. BaNiSeR

    BaNiSeR IncGamers Member

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    if you mean for MF, i never did a switch. but my kickers also had blade fury and i didnt worry about dammage from fury. the fury was solely there to impart crushing blow from afar. my kickers used whatever claws they found until they could duel wield jade talons (assuming they lived that long, i always think my guys become immortal once they get full crushing blow for some reason...)

    on a side note, open wounds does sound like its a very nice mod, granted ive never used it as i could never find a place for it in any of my assasins
     
  16. ZappaFan

    ZappaFan Hardcore Moderator and America Trade Moderator

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    Well my original question had nothing to do with venom, I'm only talking about how poison sources - mainly from charms - work now for regular melee and ranged characters. For instance my throw barb and my conc barb specifically. For a melee barb, it was really effective to have multiple 100 pdsc in inventory. But for a ranged character, such as my bowazon (or my thrower now), it was better to have just one big charm, because with a ranged character the durations ADDED together, whereas for a melee character the durations AVERAGED. So five 100 pdsc for melee resulted in 500 pd over 5 seconds. With a ranged character five pdsc resulted in 500 pd over 25 seconds, which wasn't really any different than just having one 100 pdsc (unless I was willing to only shoot one arrow every 25 seconds).
     
  17. jmervyn

    jmervyn IncGamers Member

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    Ah - sorry for the pseudo-hijack, Zappa.

    I have definitely noticed something strange along the lines of what you're thinking, but I haven't done any real testing on it yet. I don't think I'll go back to a bowasin too soon, now that I'm in love with BF - perhaps someone reading this has a zon and can comment?
     
  18. STINGER

    STINGER IncGamers Member

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    I have never been a big fan of poison as the timer resets each hit basically making your damage much smaller than listed. Now I have always been a fan of having some poison, especially now to stop regen.

    IIRC back in 1.09 if you have an attack or charm with a very short duration then all your charms would be converted to that duration. Early in Beta IIRC Rah discussed Venom and charms not working like they use to. Unfortunately with that loss of the Beta thread and Rahs concentration elsewhere I am not sure how to get the right info.

    I am sure maybe someone in Stats may know, but it has been known to take some time to get answers in that forum.
     

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