Pissed off skellies fight back!

Arkardo

Diabloii.Net Member
Pissed off skellies fight back!

You might have read my thread about the annoying guy that attacked me yesterday ("Is this my thanks"). I've been thinking if I could've taken that Paladin on.

What happens if you teleport 18 level 50/52 skellies and the rest of your summons on top of one of those annoying high level Paladins/Barbarians/whatever with lots of health and damage reduction? Does that actually kill them if you used Amplify Damage/Decrepify beforehand?

Let's say you use Decripify and it leaves them with only 25% damage reduction. There's the PvP penalty of 50% as well, so they're back up at 75%. Your Merc gives Might with 200% extra damage. They do have a 75% block rating. That would mean (using some rough numbers to get an estimation) (3 * 18 * 900) / (1.75 * 4)) = 6942 damage EACH SWING. More than enough even if they have 5k life. And that still counts out your Merc and any other minions you might have.

Does this really work this way? I know this is just theory and I probably have missed some factors. Also, the Necromancer himself is the weakness of the army; one lucky hammer and it's game over for you.

Can anyone fill me in? I'm not a PvP expert at all, but my Skelliemancer is the best I have and I'd like to know if I can stand up to random attacks and make those annoying pricks stfu.
 

DaemonAkuma

Diabloii.Net Member
Lol, that was the single most entertaining thing I've read today.

This is what I do to hunt them down (some idiots actually think they can bully a godly necromancer...such ignorance). I summon all my army, fully juiced. Then I go and get 13 souls from somewhere, and 13 dolls from somewhere. Bone armor (just in case), bo everyone with CTA, make sure res is max, and then hostile.

Of course they'll come running out of town thinking no problem. So use LR so when the 39 lightning bolts come roaring down from the souls it does yummy damage. Then cast Decrep (or amp if they're not very fast) and the dolls should be there. Upon their inevitable destruction they'll explode and cause more damage :) After that nice frontal assault the souls will have reloaded and started blasting. I keep decrep on by this point so they can't run me down. The rest of ur army wil probably have attacked by now, so tele to the rear of the person, then tele to them (it throws them off base a bit). Soon as you tele try to time it between their swings/attacks. Tele, run like there's no tomarrow. If by some miracle of God they hadn't already died before, the souls + Infinity merc weapon will round out the deal rather nicely. Enjoy the ear.

Of course, that's just my methodology...
 

bobofuzzlymunky

Diabloii.Net Member
i believe that 6942 dmg has a penalty too... my hdin doesnt get killed instantly by summoners, and he has 3k health. (i know im getting hurt cuz my life goes down so im not just blocking...) if skeles did 7k dmg each hit they would be by far the strongest things in the game. (with 13 of them following you youd be doing a ridiculous amount of dmg.)
 

Arkardo

Diabloii.Net Member
i believe that 6942 dmg has a penalty too... my hdin doesnt get killed instantly by summoners, and he has 3k health. (i know im getting hurt cuz my life goes down so im not just blocking...) if skeles did 7k dmg each hit they would be by far the strongest things in the game. (with 13 of them following you youd be doing a ridiculous amount of dmg.)
I meant all eightteen of them together. :wink3:

But, as a Hammerdin, what is your experience with dueling Summoners? Are they easy/hard to beat?



 

garion

Diabloii.Net Member
i guess part of it is that the opponent will block so of that dmg..and of course many of the skeles will miss..especailly against chars with +25k def right?
 

bogie

Diabloii.Net Member
I think his calculation was with all of the skeles though. Anyway, Im sorry to say that it doesnt really work that way, theres a nice Necro Pet Calculator around here somewhere, and it will tell you the damage per skele you can be expecting.

Edit: Took so long writing the reply that he anwered the question already :azn: .

Now on to calculations

Due to the fact that skeles have a built in dmg of 257% ed at lvl 20, you factor in the fact that skeles will have around 180ish base damage. This then gets multiplied by all of your skeles ed% (built in ed% + might aura) and then this caculates there dmg. With the skeles you described, you can get 1525 dmg per skele, 1525 x 18 = 27450 damage per swing, then the PVP penalty reduces that to 13750 damage per swing. Your amp damage and there DR% will cancel out (DR% isnt physical resist is it?), and then the blocking percent kicks in. Comes out to 3450 or so odd damage per group skele swing (WHOA, much more than I thought, but still less than 6950 damage). This is a HUGE amount of damage nonetheless to be dealing out to a meleer. 3450 is then added to mage damage, which is more than most people expect (as long as you dont get poison mages for dueling :rolleyes: ). Mages do an average of about 420 damage at lvl 50-52, so thats 420 x 18 = 7560 damage per cast, and its unblockable. So thats 7560/2 PVP penalty = 3780 damage per cast, and resists are not a problem if your using infinity on your merc, which will lower your enemies resists to -15 assuming they are maxed in Hell but not stacked (who thinks to resist stack a summoner? Not many can wrap there head around the fact that MAGES DO DAMAGE :grin: , so they will not think to). Your final mage damage comes out to around 4300 dmg per cast. MORE THAN THE SKELES!!! Add the 2 together if you tele-stack and you get 4300 + 3750 = 8050 total damage per hit...... but of course, we havnt taken into account the fact that most Melee characters will have very very high defense, which will greatly lower the chances of your skeles to hit them. Even with the -def on infintity, you will still be looking at some hefty defense (someone have a defense to AR chart around here). The mages however, will always hit regardless of the defense, so as long as the summoner telestacks, the enemy should be dead unless they stack resists. Reviving gloams and a few frenzytaurs to tank will also start to deal huge damage. An army of about 20 frenzytaurs will probally do more damage total though, averaging 105 damage per swing x 8.5 extra damage from might and skele mastery, they get about 890 dmg apiece, then multiply by 25 or so monsters to get 22250 total damage. After all penalties it comes out to over 2700 damage, again without considereing the enemies defense. As skele mast doesnt add any AR to the monsters, and we can assume godly meleers have reduced their chance of being hit to 10% from frenzytaurs, then we can assume that the frenzytaurs will be dealing about 270 dmg per swing as a group.... not very impressive.

Anyway, the point being that defense will save ALOT of melee chars, however, your skeles get a huge bonus to AR when fighting enemies closer or lesser than their lvl (can anyone confirm this). So, mages will actually do huge damage to enemies will brought up to lvl 50+ and with an infinity merc you will be able to destroy most 4k hp and under characters simply by telestacking. :laughing:
 

Zarban

Diabloii.Net Member
13725 damage on the skeles. Or am i wrong and your right?
edit: or did you just round to make it easier?
 

Arkardo

Diabloii.Net Member
Ah, the defense. That was what I was missing here. Hmm, guess I have to get an Infinity, then! :scratch:
 

garion

Diabloii.Net Member
Ah, the defense. That was what I was missing here. Hmm, guess I have to get an Infinity, then! :scratch:
yeah...i mean i have a pally somewhere with around 25k def and 75% block...sooo....that equals lots of misses....



 

jox

Diabloii.Net Member
That would be scary indeed...
the problem with using your summoner in duels is that... by the time you get all your army together, you're so lagged that you can't even get out of town... lol... with all your revives, skelies, golem and merc... and then your 3 minutes of might goes down hill after your revives dies... its not that much fun to keep going to get good corpses... especially after your merc dies ... and he seems to always be the first to go down too... Please understand that i'm not flaming summoners. I love them. Have 2 myself. I'm just sharing my public dueling experience with y'all. It's doable ... but it's not as satisfying as other classes where all you have to do is pick up your corpse after you die and go at it again. It's quite a pain in the butt to keep going to get corpses.



 

Arkardo

Diabloii.Net Member
Well, I'm not really into duelling; I just want to be able to fight back those with a bit too much attitude. :wink3:

Yeah, my skellies can fight back alright. Though it appears they won't make the cut...
 

DaemonAkuma

Diabloii.Net Member
I do not duel; I hunt. :)

I have only pvped 3 times, all three against people I would like to refer to in unfriendly terms that are not admissable by the forum rules (I think you get my drift). I would like to refer to my post up there about souls/dolls. I also maxed mages, and carry an Infinity weap on merc. I killed a Hammerdin, Sorc (she only had enough time to cast Orb once so I don't know for sure what kind she was) and I killed a bonemancer. All three instances there were just unfriendly people basically. I don't attest to being a grand pvp. I dislike it to be honest; I don't get runes, uniques, and exp from killing players.

However I did enjoy all these calculations and had no idea mages were that capable. Like others I seemed to forget to think abuot the massive amounts of defense meleers would have, even with Conviction. I guess it was my mages and gloams doin the killing an dmy skellies just serving as a bothersome distraction :p But yes, not really fun to duel with w/ the whole having to find corpses thing...but these threads should definately aid you in searching out vengeance. If not, PM me the account and I'd happily do a hit :)
 

HYKO

Diabloii.Net Member
the problem with using your summoner in duels is that... by the time you get all your army together, you're so lagged that you can't even get out of town... lol... with all your revives, skelies, golem and merc... and then your 3 minutes of might goes down hill after your revives dies... its not that much fun to keep going to get good corpses... especially after your merc dies ... and he seems to always be the first to go down too... Please understand that i'm not flaming summoners. I love them. Have 2 myself. I'm just sharing my public dueling experience with y'all. It's doable ... but it's not as satisfying as other classes where all you have to do is pick up your corpse after you die and go at it again. It's quite a pain in the butt to keep going to get corpses.
Yes, it is not a "dueler", but it sure can be fun for being unstopable for 3 mins :laugh:
About the lag.. i don't know.. I have never experianced it when i got my full army running.



 

bogie

Diabloii.Net Member
Your right :grin: , but yes, I did round to make my life and my bad computer calculator's life easier.
 

bogie

Diabloii.Net Member
*smacks self on head* posted without realizing there was a 2nd page.

Anyway, I too found it very satisfying to run the calculations and find that mages did very good damage with infinity on merc. Until the word gets out..... *shhhhhhh*
 
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