Re: PIRACY (not copyright stuff, REAL PIRACY)
I can see why it's funny though, as it gives the picture of countries sending boats to the area to just shoot at eachother because they all have cannons on board.
@jmervyn I'll do it nice and simple now, your answer was great, but you still misinterpret mostly of what I wrote, it's very on topic, but not very relevant compared to what I wrote as I don't seem able to write properly so you understand what I'm trying to get at. Therefore I'll just make it nice and simple now.
You claimed that Piracy will never stop. I say that's far fetched, as noone knows what the future may bring, so you've no evidence of your statement. You claimed as a counter that when looking at the past nothing has improved only gotten worse. I say that you can't make measures of the past and research in the brain may be a way to make the society better. You made a lot of interpretations of my brain research statement, but here's what I ment. By researching the brain we can find out how things works, that gives the possibility of finding out what mechanics are involved when people decide to be a pirate, etc., and that would probably make it possible to actually make a life for these people where they'd never have that choice. I don't embrace brain wash, gene selection, postulate that we've no free will or anything like that, but I believe in cause and effect, though where probabilities should be taking into consider, and I know that makes free will impossible, unless you actually believe in the time theories, etc., but as we have very limited knowledge still (yet much more than earlier, just look at the Hodgkin & Huxley experiments, or the Heimburg intrepetation), then I believe it's just a matter of time before we actually find out. Finally your argument about wars doesn't hold, it just supports that technology have advanced and doesn't say anything whether or not people are in general more "evil", which is a term that I don't really believe exists (though I know about "feeling evil", I've experienced it a lot when I was younger, and every time my conscience have learned me a lesson, that implies also for people with lower amount of empathy as they most likely have someone they love, who their conscience would take action upon if they cannot control the "evil urge" or whatever it's when you want to make someone worse just for your own amusement.
Some things to note about your last post:
That's unless you don't believe the brain is under the laws of the nature of course, but that makes no sense as everything is, you just expands the laws as you measure them and not have a solid set of rules that applies for everything. It's the limit of the laws that's interesting, remember that.
Finally it's not up to me to find out what can change the ways down there, but I did so anyway to be nice, as I'd really already written it's a matter of finding the factors of risk and benefit/reward of taking the risk, I could just as well write further investigation is probably needed before we know how the factors actually work (if someone who reported back lived among these people for some time, getting through exactly what they do, it could be a way of finding out).
Finally my stance on this is clear, it's never okay to kill anyone to not having to pay the money, when the hostiles have been captured and given previous experience we know that the pirates releases hostages afterwards (otherwise they would not get money anymore and rescue missions would be started, so it has always been in their own interest) money should always be payed, it's not the question what we should do when they're captured, it's how we prevent it that matters though, no pirates attacks a ship heavily armed unless some extreme factors are taking into consideration, and then it would probably be nicer to just catch the pirates and offer them a life in another country (here I think of stuff like starvation, sickness, been forced through the risk of your life or the lifes of your loved ones). So making it impossible for the pirates to never actually capture anyone, like the danish suggestion would imply, it'd make the risk factor to high compared to the reward factor, unless condition such as I just wrote are in effect, which I also gave the answer for. That should hopefully make my stand pretty clear, oh and a hostage is always a hostage no matter what country the come from, we'd always try to help eachother providing the money to get them released (including the example of pirates being forced through their families being hold hostage).
But as it is now I can easily understand why being a pirate is a good idea, or at least untill the resuce action, which may have a very negative effect, as before you would have an easy target, you wouldn't be forced to hurt anyone, you'd have fun on their expense (taking their food, etc.), and you'd get money (opportunity) to release the only burdening part (the hostages, who have to be fed, who needs a place to be, and who have to be kept safe). Then you can repeat as needed and the risk isn't very high as of course people would pay before risking the lifes of their own citizens, etc, and ships defending other boats can be avoided through spies who sails the area as fishermen or similar. Now when the attack have taken place, we might risk the pirates will shoot the hostages when they feel the least amount of pressure of feel the risk is getting to big, shoot them and leave the place, it's important the pirates feels safe in what they do (when they have an opportunity to succeed), to the safety of the people who go through the area, so they won't panic and kill someone, if there's warships in the area the pirates won't ever have the opportunity, but if they succeed anyway, how unlikely it may be, they at least won't kill the hostages as they wouldn't panic as easily. So that concludes my viewpoint.
Comeon, this isn't necessary and is probably making the debate worse than good, it's clear what the poster meant, he wants any non-allied hostile ship sunk and he'll do it with allied ships being hostile towards the non-allied hostile ships.
I can see why it's funny though, as it gives the picture of countries sending boats to the area to just shoot at eachother because they all have cannons on board.
@jmervyn I'll do it nice and simple now, your answer was great, but you still misinterpret mostly of what I wrote, it's very on topic, but not very relevant compared to what I wrote as I don't seem able to write properly so you understand what I'm trying to get at. Therefore I'll just make it nice and simple now.
You claimed that Piracy will never stop. I say that's far fetched, as noone knows what the future may bring, so you've no evidence of your statement. You claimed as a counter that when looking at the past nothing has improved only gotten worse. I say that you can't make measures of the past and research in the brain may be a way to make the society better. You made a lot of interpretations of my brain research statement, but here's what I ment. By researching the brain we can find out how things works, that gives the possibility of finding out what mechanics are involved when people decide to be a pirate, etc., and that would probably make it possible to actually make a life for these people where they'd never have that choice. I don't embrace brain wash, gene selection, postulate that we've no free will or anything like that, but I believe in cause and effect, though where probabilities should be taking into consider, and I know that makes free will impossible, unless you actually believe in the time theories, etc., but as we have very limited knowledge still (yet much more than earlier, just look at the Hodgkin & Huxley experiments, or the Heimburg intrepetation), then I believe it's just a matter of time before we actually find out. Finally your argument about wars doesn't hold, it just supports that technology have advanced and doesn't say anything whether or not people are in general more "evil", which is a term that I don't really believe exists (though I know about "feeling evil", I've experienced it a lot when I was younger, and every time my conscience have learned me a lesson, that implies also for people with lower amount of empathy as they most likely have someone they love, who their conscience would take action upon if they cannot control the "evil urge" or whatever it's when you want to make someone worse just for your own amusement.
Some things to note about your last post:
Biology is the description of living things, behaviour is a subsection of this.
That's unless you don't believe the brain is under the laws of the nature of course, but that makes no sense as everything is, you just expands the laws as you measure them and not have a solid set of rules that applies for everything. It's the limit of the laws that's interesting, remember that.
It's not smart attacking something with venom if you want an answer back, anyway it's not up to be to prove anything as I don't really have to state anything, I could just as well just have wanted you to prove your point and then countered your warfare point as I did, in stead of actually giving you some space of debate, I think that was nicely done by me, but if that makes you attack me with venom (yes yes figure of speech), then I guess it'd been better if I'd just not given you the opportunity.
Finally it's not up to me to find out what can change the ways down there, but I did so anyway to be nice, as I'd really already written it's a matter of finding the factors of risk and benefit/reward of taking the risk, I could just as well write further investigation is probably needed before we know how the factors actually work (if someone who reported back lived among these people for some time, getting through exactly what they do, it could be a way of finding out).
Finally my stance on this is clear, it's never okay to kill anyone to not having to pay the money, when the hostiles have been captured and given previous experience we know that the pirates releases hostages afterwards (otherwise they would not get money anymore and rescue missions would be started, so it has always been in their own interest) money should always be payed, it's not the question what we should do when they're captured, it's how we prevent it that matters though, no pirates attacks a ship heavily armed unless some extreme factors are taking into consideration, and then it would probably be nicer to just catch the pirates and offer them a life in another country (here I think of stuff like starvation, sickness, been forced through the risk of your life or the lifes of your loved ones). So making it impossible for the pirates to never actually capture anyone, like the danish suggestion would imply, it'd make the risk factor to high compared to the reward factor, unless condition such as I just wrote are in effect, which I also gave the answer for. That should hopefully make my stand pretty clear, oh and a hostage is always a hostage no matter what country the come from, we'd always try to help eachother providing the money to get them released (including the example of pirates being forced through their families being hold hostage).
But as it is now I can easily understand why being a pirate is a good idea, or at least untill the resuce action, which may have a very negative effect, as before you would have an easy target, you wouldn't be forced to hurt anyone, you'd have fun on their expense (taking their food, etc.), and you'd get money (opportunity) to release the only burdening part (the hostages, who have to be fed, who needs a place to be, and who have to be kept safe). Then you can repeat as needed and the risk isn't very high as of course people would pay before risking the lifes of their own citizens, etc, and ships defending other boats can be avoided through spies who sails the area as fishermen or similar. Now when the attack have taken place, we might risk the pirates will shoot the hostages when they feel the least amount of pressure of feel the risk is getting to big, shoot them and leave the place, it's important the pirates feels safe in what they do (when they have an opportunity to succeed), to the safety of the people who go through the area, so they won't panic and kill someone, if there's warships in the area the pirates won't ever have the opportunity, but if they succeed anyway, how unlikely it may be, they at least won't kill the hostages as they wouldn't panic as easily. So that concludes my viewpoint.
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