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Orb and Hydras, happy together

Discussion in 'Sorceress' started by chubbypuppy, Mar 14, 2004.

  1. chubbypuppy

    chubbypuppy IncGamers Member

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    Orb and Hydras, happy together

    Hi all,

    Just for fun I want to try a hydra/orb sorc again. Both, along with static, are among my favorite sorc spells. I tried pure hydra builds but they become too limiting in hell.

    I know meteorb is better (better synergized and all that), but I figure this will be fun. I've tried this build before but I maxxed cold and I think I got frustrated earlier. Enough time has elapsed that I forgot the frustration :D

    Anyways, has others done successful builds for orb and hydra? How are your skills distributed? I plan to do max block/high vit/no ES.

    I'm thinking of the following distribution:

    cold:

    prereqs
    20 orb
    15 CM

    Fire:

    prereqs
    1 warmth
    10 fireball
    20 hydra
    20 FM

    Lightning:

    1 static
    1 teleport
    1 telekinesis (great against immunes)

    Comments/suggestions welcome!
     
  2. theBlackKnight

    theBlackKnight IncGamers Member

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    94 skill points, doable by level 82 with all skill quests, do us a favor and sink the rest into fireball


    What kind of gear are you looking at?
    something like

    ss
    coh
    shako
    soj *2
    occy /w 15% all resists / 7fhr jewel
    magefists
    maras
    waterwalks / ethereal sandstorm ( saves some points, self repair, good def, and faster hit recovery :D )
    and arachnids mesh?



    ????



    Please more info so that we can help force you into making a new character guide if it is successful :lol:
     
  3. chubbypuppy

    chubbypuppy IncGamers Member

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    Actually...

    Actually 97 skill points as I have listed, doable by level 86 (first level doesn't count).

    Haven't really thought much about equipment yet, but yeah those you listed sure would be nice...

    I'm not sure if this deserves a guide, since I doubt it's optimal like Meteorb. Just something for fun.
     
  4. chubbypuppy

    chubbypuppy IncGamers Member

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    Now that I've had some sleep...

    I wanted to think about this "fun" build before it got any further. I got her to 17 before going to bed, and now I'm having hesitations about continuing.

    Let's assume I'll have +10 skills. That means the hydras will do 1038-1189 pts per spit. Fireballs will do 757-859.

    In comparison to my meteORB (max CM), she does about 8k meteor and 3k fireball. I found that I don't even bother with meteor most of the time now, I just spam fireball for max damage throughput.

    (Here is where I do some fuzzy handwaving, cuz I gotta go soon. Someone help me out)

    Hydra:

    I cast, they appear. They think for a bit, then start spitting. I can repeat every 2 seconds. Btw the spits seems to fly kinda slow. Let's be generous and say they can do 3 spits a sec, for a throughput of 3300 pts per second. Let's just say 3k.

    0th sec: 1st assault team appears and thinks.

    1st sec: 3k. Cumulative total is 3k.

    2nd sec: 2nd assault team appears and thinks. 1st team spits for another 3k. Cumulative total is 6k.

    3rd sec: 2 team spits for 6k. Cumulative total is 12k.

    4th sec: 3rd assault team appears and thinks. 1/2 teams spits for another 6k. Cumulative total is 18k.

    5th sec: 3 team spits for 9k. Cumulative total is 27k.

    6th sec: 4th assault team appears and thinks. 1/2/3 teams spits for another 9k. Cumulative total is 36k.

    7th sec: 4 team spits for 12k. Cumulative total is 48k.

    8th sec: 5th assault team appears and thinks. 1/2/3/4 teams spits for another 12k. Cumulative total is 60k.

    9th sec: 5 team spits for 15k. Cumulative total is 75k.

    10th sec: 1st team gives up and goes home to watch TV. Other 4 teams does another 12k for 87k total.

    --------------------

    OK that was fun. Now let's see fireball with the meteORB. If I just spammed fireball, I can throw 30? fireballs in 10 seconds. Thats 90k.

    If I just did meteor. I think I can do about 1 meteor per sec, with the first one arriving on the 2nd sec. So let' say 9 meteor. That's 72k.

    --------------------

    All looks great for the hydras, assuming my fuzzy math is actually close to the ballpark, or even in the same state.

    So why don't we have a dominance of Orb/Hydra builds? In practice it doesn't seem pan out. Hydras are hard working but pretty dumb. They will spit at walls, focus on the single fire immune guy or just spread their fire all over the place. If they kill a monster, they are usually far away from the other ones so the spits take longer to get there. Finally, fireball synergies well with meteor so if you add spamming of fireballs while the timer counts down for either meteor or hydra, the added fireballs do a lot more damage.

    Anyone else wants to add to this? Please, I love hydras but they are so unloved and lonely at their fire kennels. Worse, people mock you when you cast a hydra, calling you a sponge (which you sort of are, cuz all the monsters are dead before the hydras can put on their pants to leave the house).
     
  5. chubbypuppy

    chubbypuppy IncGamers Member

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    Sniff

    All day and no one replied. No wonder the hydras are all getting fat and lazy on their sofas.

    Another point I forgot to mention in my fuzzy math is that each meteor hit is a (sorta small) AofE, so more than 1 monster will get hit by it, whereas each hydra spit hit is exactly just 1 hit.
     
  6. Ash Housewares

    Ash Housewares IncGamers Member

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    well I can't comment on synergies and damage, but I can comment on functionality, I had a hydra/orb sorc in .09 and while the skills worked well, they were not interchangable or viable at the same time, but I hate casting delays and this sorc just reminded me of playing an elemental druid

    I did get the sorc to lvl89 and was successful in MFing with her, but I ultimately abandoned the build in that when I was confronted with mixed groups of fire and cold immune monsters it just seemed like hydra was always shooting the fire immunes
     
  7. chubbypuppy

    chubbypuppy IncGamers Member

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    Yeah, not supposed to...

    ... cast both hydra and orb alternatively. I learned that in 1.09 too, too bad :) I mean to clear out all the fire immune guys with orb, then let the hydras goto work. Need a strong holy freeze merc to keep things in check...

    ANOTHER thing I forgot about why meteor is superior: It has a residual burn that's equal to the hydra spits. What I mean is that for 53 pts (what I'd spent just for the hydra), I can get a meteor that burns for 1350/sec with just +10 skills. That's about what the hydras would be spitting for.

    Back to the drawing board...

    PS: Even a pure dedicated hydra build is kinda weak. Its synergies at 3% is just not strong (sort of like why people don't synergize orbs unless they are pure orb). Did Blizzard screw up here in game balance or am I missing something. I'm thinking a mistake, judging from hammerdins...
     
  8. Andrew

    Andrew IncGamers Member

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    Well, IMHO, you don't need 15 points into CM for PVM... maybe... 10? 5 more points for Hydra synergy.. lol.
     
  9. royalesse

    royalesse IncGamers Member

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    All great points... In another thread someone put it: Yeah it's viable but you need the patience of a saint to make it work.

    Bottom line: If you're in hardcore go for it. The speed of the hydras and using hydras as Gloam detectors works well for Hardcore (slow and steady wins the race.). If you play softcore and like to shoot from the hip to lay waste to everything... then you should look at another build.

    If you were frustrated before, you'll be frustrated again [sometimes the truth is like sex: it's best when it hurts]
     

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