Latest Diablo 3 News
DiabloWiki Updates
Support the site! Become a Diablo: IncGamers PAL - Remove ads and more!

Oh my! There's blood everywhere!

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by pharaoh, Mar 28, 2004.

  1. pharaoh

    pharaoh IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2004
    Messages:
    1,633
    Likes Received:
    46
    Trophy Points:
    168
    Oh my! There's blood everywhere!

    I got to thinking of Open Wounds, and how it can be handy, but generally not something to build a character around. Then I decided "And why the hell not?", looked through my ATMA stashes for some Open Wounds items, and decided it just might be viable. As long as I could get the OW to actually kill things in Hell, I figure I can make a go of it. As far as I know, OW functions more as "loss of life" than "damage", and so will work on anything, regardless of immunities. According to Arreat Summit, it even works on bosses and players, albeit at reduced efficiency (the amount, not the chances of it happening). Two general ideas for builds popped into my head.

    First is the "Rippazon", call her Jackie the Ripper. :) The bow of choice would be Riphook (30% OW, life leech, slow target, plus it's a damn fast bow). Crow Caw would make great armor (35% OW, 15% FHR, 15% IAS), and Dracul's Grasp would be her gloves (25% OW, life leech, +life/kill, 5% chance of Life Tap on striking). The Life Tap on the gloves wouldn't help her, as she'd be using a bow, but if I decided to go with a tanking Act2/Act5 merc, it would certainly help his life expectancy. Perhaps as a belt choice, I could use Hwanin's (prevent monster heal), as it would ensure the OW wasn't overwhelmed by the monster's healing, or maybe Razortail for the piercing mod. Boots would be Gore Riders (10% OW, 15% CB, 15% DS). This setup would give me 105% OW, so anything that got hit would be bleeding. The rest of the gear would be mainly +resists, +skills, +life, and maybe +mana. If I find one in SP, a Witchwild String would make a great backup bow, with a whopping +40 res all, and a handy two sockets (UM runes would be the best option, but I've only got one at the moment). Mana leech would be another key ingredient for this character, especially if using Multishot, and +mana/kill might be useful in the earlier stages of the game (loading up disposable armor/helms with Tir runes is easy and cheap).

    This build would rely on perforating as many foes as possible, such that the OW would run concurrently among many targets. Skills would thus be either Multiple Shot or Strafe- perhaps both- coupled with a generous amount of Pierce. Stats would be enough Str to wear armor, Dex to hit reliably, and a whole bunch in Vit. Added Dex for more bow damage would be lost with such a relatively low-damage bow, and with OW probably killing fairly slowly, I'd need enough life to outlive my foes.

    The second build would be a throwing barb (I haven't thought of a catchy title yet, so feel free to make suggestions). Barbo here would probably be dual-wielding a couple nasty of throwing axes, which would open up the possibility of pumping Axe Mastery and Frenzy for close-quarters combat. The axes would be Lacerators ideally, but I've only got one, so I'd be settling for The Scalper in one hand. All of them have 33% OW, and a generous amount of IAS, as well as the ever-handy "replenishes quantity" mod. Lacerator has "prevent heal", which would help immensely. Armor would be Crow Caw, gloves would be Dracul's, boots would be Gore Riders. This would give me 103% OW, again enough to ensure the ground would be slick with the foul-smelling blood of demons. Mana leech would be handy for this build, but not absolutely essential.

    Skills for the barb would be Throwing Mastery, Double Throw, Natural Resistance (to offset the lack of resists from a shield), Iron Skin, and Increased Speed. Axe Mastery and Frenzy might go in here as well, but probably not. Battle Orders would be a must, and the seldom-used Grim Ward would find a home in this build, providing useful crowd control, and preventing our hero from being swarmed. Again, stats would be Str for the armor/other gear, Dex to wield the axes and hit reliably, and the rest in Vit for life.

    [edit: Knockback would also help both builds a lot, but the only non-weapon source of KB I can think of at this late hour would be Cleglaw's Pincers. Nef would be an easy way to add KB to the zon's gear, but unfortunately, throwing weapons can't be socketed.]

    Anyways, if anyone has any thoughts on either of these builds, replies would be nice. The more input I get, the better my chances are of making it work, and I imagine if JohnnyBravo can push an MA zon through Hell, I can push an OW character through- I can play pretty patiently when necessary.

    Also, I should point out that I actually have most of the gear I mentioned. All I'm missing is Razortail (which isn't hard to find), as well as the second UM rune and Witchwild String, as I mentioned in the zon's gear paragraph. I don't say this to solicit freebies, as I like to find all my own gear (I still remember stunning some poor guy on b.net by turning down the free Windforce he offered me, heh), but instead to show that this concept is a definite go-ahead once I get a better "plan of attack".

    I can hardly wait to see the reaction of certain monsters, such as skeletons and gloams, when blood starts gushing from their nonexistant circulatory systems. :)
     
  2. Darkwell

    Darkwell IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    1,857
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    165
    The chance to trigger OW when you hit looks great. But, do you know the damage(loss of life) done over time. How long do you anticipate for a monster, of say 100 hp, to die?
     
  3. farting bob

    farting bob Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Messages:
    6,129
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    just to help you if you havent read it already.:thumbsup:
    id say its viable, but id want some elemental dmg as well, as just for an example.
    at lvl 60 you'll be doing 5.39dmg per frame on normal monsters, thats 134 per second. which wil take ages to kill stuff even in nm.
    at lvl 84 where youd expect to be in wsk, youd be doing 240 dmg per second, and i can guareentee that when you have 5 burnign souls, 3 death lords and a pack of OB knights 240 dmg per second will be insufficient and youll get swamped.
     
  4. Ehtirno

    Ehtirno IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2003
    Messages:
    47
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    5
    Open Wound Damage is based on your level, i dont remember the formula, But you can do some damage with it... Someone will surely brag about their leet D2 skills and flash the formula all over the place :p :p

    Edit: jeeeezz... What did I just say :roll:
     
  5. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2003
    Messages:
    4,262
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    466
    Dude, post a screenshoot, blood everywhere, I've yet to see it. :worship:

    with OW, you don't need PMH (no heal while OW), so go with piercing.
     
  6. Purkake

    Purkake IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    181
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    41
    OW is really fun to play around with. I once put /players8 on with my strafezon, put on my trusty riphook and went killing nm Diablo. Now that is "blood everywhere" the whole chaos sancuary was covered with big D's blood.

    And pharaoh OW works as negative life regeneration (like malice runeword) it automatically stops monster's regeneration. I would like to try it on DC :lol:
     
  7. Johney

    Johney IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Messages:
    486
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    98
    You could name the barb "jack The Ripper"....... (Wow i'm origional) or Bob Bloody...... Or Willy Would, or "Big Jim who causes enemies to bleed profusely".....
     
  8. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2003
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    255
    As seen from the formulas OW isn't something you can kill with at a decent speed. At least not after the first part of Act I Normal. The good thing is that OW blocks monster regen, and seeing as how it deal some damage, a monster with it will always lose life, so eventually the monster will die. So basically if you can hit it and deal some damage (note OW only triggers if damage is inflicted...a cold, fire and lightning charm in inventory works nicely for this) and you can do so often enough, the monster will die eventually. It could just take a few hours, depending on the amount of life the monster has.
     
  9. Purkake

    Purkake IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    181
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    41
    In 1.09 the formula was:

    Open Wounds Damage = (clvl * 9 + 40) / 256 * 25 * 4

    Did they change it in 1.10?
     
  10. JohnnyBravo

    JohnnyBravo IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2004
    Messages:
    290
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    102
    I'm playing a bowazon ATM and I use Hit Power gloves crafting recipe to obtain knockback. The recipe is Chain gloves (exceptional and Elite work) + PSaph. + Ort rune + any jewel. I beleive any magic mod can appear on these so IAS, plus amazon skills and a slew of over great mods are possible.

    Also she is using an upgraded Riphook which does the trick nicely. You are correct about Open Wounds working on all monsters and it is extremely useful for PI.

    I also suggest putting some OW on your merc. It will stack with your and do more damage. Bloodthief has 35% OW and 12% life leech. I've also used this for my merc and worked well.
     
  11. Derrick1001

    Derrick1001 IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2003
    Messages:
    339
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    77
    I'm not too sure about those damage calculations. My paladin has like a 25% chance of open wounds as a smiter, and I've seen stunned enemies fall over dead while I was finishing off the rest of the pack. This was in Hell in Act 5 (don't remember the players setting).
     
  12. farting bob

    farting bob Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Messages:
    6,129
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    my calculations are taken from the SPf FAQ and are true for 1.10. as other ahve pointed out, as it also prevents monster heal, as long as OW is active on that monster, it will die eventually, muh like posion in that you 'infect' it and then move on, only to find you come back and the monster is now dead.
     
  13. Kremtok

    Kremtok IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2003
    Messages:
    1,151
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    165
    I must compliment you on this truly original idea for a unique build! You will have to keep us updated on the progress of each of these characters. If they work out well, perhaps writing a guide is in order.
     
  14. pharaoh

    pharaoh IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2004
    Messages:
    1,633
    Likes Received:
    46
    Trophy Points:
    168
    Wow, I didn't think I'd get so many responses so quickly. Thanks guys. :)

    Darkwell: Yeah, the OW damage is listed on Arreat Summit. It's a formula based on clvl, so it increases as you gain levels, but it's not an awful lot. At clvl 99, for example, it'd be 12.25 dmg/frame, over 200 frames (8 seconds), meaning 2450 dmg total- and that's at a clvl I doubt I'll ever reach. In other words, it's not a lot. If you're interested in checking the whole formula, http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/items/magic.shtml has the details. Bob posted a similar formula out of the SPF FAQ, but the Arreat Summit version mentions that there's a penalty in PvP and against bosses. You can also check out stats for other special magic mods, like CB and Freezes Target.

    Deathmaster/Purkake: If it works as negative life regen, does it just subtract from the monster's regen rate, or does it actually make the regen negative? For example, say a monster regenerates 10 life/frame, and my OW does 7/frame. Would the monster actually lose life, or just have healing reduced to 3/frame? In the latter case, I'd need PMH to ensure OW actually did something.

    Bob: Yeah, I was aware of the formulas. I checked Arreat Summit, and while the damage does seem a bit low to be killing tougher monsters (ie, anything past Normal, pretty much), that is partially offset by the fact that absolutely nothing in the game can resist it. Hopefully that will be enough, plus I can supplement with elemental/poison dmg charms.

    Zarhrezz: You're sure you actually need to inflict damage, and not just hit, to trigger OW? If that's the case, it's good to know, thanks. Though to be honest, I was planning on loading up with as much elemental/poison damage as possible, given that OW alone would kill pretty slowly.

    JohnnyBravo: OW actually stacks with itself? When I checked Arreat Summit, and it said that OW items "stack in most cases", my interpretation was that the probabilities add together, with the exception of a weapon in one hand adding to another weapon's OW chances. If OW will stack with multiple hits, rather than just be 'refreshed' as poison is, then this could quickly become a VERY good method for killing ANYTHING. As for putting it on my merc, that's a good call, too. I don't know of any helms with OW off the top of my head, but there's a couple armors (Crow Caw and Boneflesh), Bloodthief, Hone Sundan if I had three spare UM runes (which I don't), and Ripsaw (whopping 80% OW).

    As far as using crafting to get hit power gloves for knockback, that would mean giving up Dracul's Grasp, and I'm not sure I'd want to do that. It all depends how much OW I'd be able to stack on otherwise; my goal is to have 100% or better, so I'd be guaranteed a nice gushing wound.

    Derrick1001: Was this in v1.10, or a previous patch? If it's in the current patch, that gives me hope that maybe, just maybe, OW will stack with multiple hits, and speed the bleeding rate. That would be immensely cool, were it the case.

    Kremtok: Thanks for the compliment. And yes, you can rest assured that if this idea works out well, I'll be writing a guide for it. If you've seen many posts of mine, you'll have noticed I tend to be rather, uhm, verbose in my descriptions, which is a nice way of saying I'm long-winded. :)

    Anyways, I suppose I should get back to work. Got a bunch of DFDs to do for my Systems Analysis class, and I've been putting it off all weekend- three guesses as to what I've been doing on the computer instead! Ugh, I hate that class, but with luck, I can play some more this evening. :)
     
  15. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2003
    Messages:
    4,262
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    466
    When OW kicks in, no monster heal at all, so if you do 7 damage per second from OW, no matter what monster heal rate, it will do 7 damage, that's why it is great mod in hell where monsters heal fast.

    I can also comfirm you need to do at least one damage in order OW to work, no matter what damage it is, so elemental charms work just fine.

    You don't really need 100% OW, my merc has 50% OW, he can get anything bleeding in couple of hits.

    Have fun :drink:
     
  16. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2003
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    255
    And comfimed again ;)

    Also, OW does stack as in "adds the probabilities together". It does not stack in the "monster bleeding from multiple wounds" sense, it's just like a (very, very weak) poison for stacking purposes. Note that since the running time of OW is 200 frames (8 seconds) you will want to trigger OW on a monster at least once per 8 seconds to keep regen completely blocked, however hitting with 100% OW every 3-4 frames does not deal any more OW damage than triggering OW once every 8 seconds.
     
  17. strijdje

    strijdje IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2003
    Messages:
    2,477
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    255
    hey, that idea for the double throw barb with dual lacerators is kinda sweet... on our switch a set of dual glimmershreds and your set for PI's... with the OW you'll do massive damage and i already wanted to start such a project... i might check it out :thumbsup:
     
  18. Zarhrezz

    Zarhrezz IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2003
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    255
    A few 100 damage over 8 seconds is hardly "massive damage" Robin =)
     
  19. strijdje

    strijdje IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2003
    Messages:
    2,477
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    255
    still, with the amp from the lacerators, your damage from the fuly synergized double throw and throwing mastery, axe mastery.... pff bring it on with your stupid little energy sorcie :D

    combine that with lotz of ias... ymmie
     
  20. JohnnyBravo

    JohnnyBravo IncGamers Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2004
    Messages:
    290
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    102
    Multiple instances of OW on your character will just add up the percentages. But if your merc has OW it seems that he has his own percentage and stacks with mine. This is just obsevations while using riphook and Bloodthief.
     

Share This Page