Mystery Char

[LaZeR]

Mystery Char

Well, after seeing this image

I thought to my self- I don't care if it IS the fourth character or not. He looks cool, let's make him one.

Anyway, I thought he'd be a desert D2 A2 char, some sort of an Assasian with better traps and Range attacks (sovling our range problem).
It's been hard to think of Skill Tree that would suit D3 and NOT D2 aka "Unlike the skill trees in Diablo II, the trees in Diablo III are not focused on just one aspect of a character. All known D3 skill trees have a wide variety of skills, with more passive than active, and all allow for a variety of play styles. ".

Assasination Tree
No point of hiding this will be a semi Assa build. This three will include:
1. Skills focused on separating emenies
2. Close ranged high damage 1 hit skills.
3. Traps

Combat Master Tree
His fast sword fightning tree which will include:
1. Fast attack with bonuses for using swords & daggers
2. Passives that will work for both this tree and the Assa tree

Unamed Range Tree
I wanted to put this in the Combat Master tree, but I thought this should get more focus as the main RANGER char. Anyway:
1. Range Bow&Arrow skills
2. Range kinda alchemist skills (throwing potions for ex)


This is about it. Detailed skills will come later. Tell me what you think.

 

[GuardianHadriel]

Re: Mystery Char

naah...:coffee:

 

[Knight_Wolf]

Re: Mystery Char

I think there was already a topic about this picture, it could be true they are planning a desert themed character and this was one attempt at it (other than the Dervish which we know got canceled early on).

Or he could be what Blizz was working on before realizing he is the Barbarian with a different skin then replaced him with the Barb (remember Blizz said the Barb was something else before they settled on bringing him back ... looking at the arm and chest muscles of the character here they pretty much resemble the Barb's strong body built).


Either way ... i too do wish we get a Ranged/light Melee/Assassin/Trickster hybrid with a Desert flavor ... that would be unique and NEW for a change.

 

[Sass]

Re: Mystery Char

Or he could be what Blizz was working on before realizing he is the Barbarian with a different skin then replaced him with the Barb (remember Blizz said the Barb was something else before they settled on bringing him back ... looking at the arm and chest muscles of the character here they pretty much resemble the Barb's strong body built).

At first glance, it reminded me of the barb >>. I initially thought it was a barb in a desert outfit (change based on act? :O )



As for he class, I like the trees so far, but no traps or potions. :crazyeyes:

A light, fast melee (scimitar focus?) with swift combo strikes, mixing in ranged would work.

A desert marauder char would be neat

 

[Knight_Wolf]

Re: Mystery Char

At first glance, it reminded me of the barb >>. I initially thought it was a barb in a desert outfit (change based on act? :O )

Same here

As for he class, I like the trees so far, but no traps or potions. :crazyeyes:

I can understand the "no potion", but why no Traps, they could complement his ranged abilities quite well and make him very interesting, but they need to be done differently from the D2 assassins ones.

 

[NASE]

Re: Mystery Char

Because traps are boring. And aren't really original in combination with light mele and ranged attacks.

 

[Knight_Wolf]

Re: Mystery Char

Because traps are boring. And aren't really original in combination with light mele and ranged attacks.

Why is that, it isn't one bit true that traps are boring just because it wasn't done right in D2, i can already think of various tactics and elaborate trap combos that can be made for this character.

Most common logic basic combination would be traps that slow down your enemies .. once one enemy triggers one all enemies with in the radius of the trap are slowed down .. and the trap stays active for few seconds ... how is that not complementing your ranged skill if you are playing this class .. you can already create several choke points around you and hammer away with a bow or even a powerful slow crossbow at the poor fellows who thought they cornered you.

Or a Trap that pushes enemies back in a certain direction depending on what direction you were facing when you placed it.

Or another that sucks enemies like a large magnet so that you can effectively use some AoE skill or fire enchanted explosive arrows on them.



There are so many ideas for traps that hasn't been done in D2 and many combinations .. not only for traps with other traps .. but traps with skills from other trees as well.

 

[redrach]

Re: Mystery Char

Because traps are boring. And aren't really original in combination with light mele and ranged attacks.

True, traps in D2 were boring. But that doesn't mean they can't be improved upon.
For example, in the D2 mod Median XL, the Assassin has several traps. Two of these are the Seal of Fire and the Rune of Ice. The Seal of Fire rapidly fires at all targets around it (once every frame, or 25 times a second) in a small range. Needless to say, it does a ton of damage, but only if you manage to keep enemies within the range of the trap. Solution: the Rune of Ice. It's a trap which freezes all enemies around it for a long time, but with a very small detection range (almost melee). Plus the Assassin in MXL has a teleport-like skill called Blink, which has a short timer but stuns all enemies around the point you Blink to for a few seconds.
So the typical 'Sealsin' combo is to Blink right on to a pack of enemies, use Rune of Ice to freeze them all, and then spam Seal of Fire while they're frozen till they're all dead.
Throw in the fact that some monsters are immune to fire, others are immune to the freeze or the stun, and you have quite an interesting character to play.

So don't give up on traps just yet. :thumbup:

 

[LaZeR]

Re: Mystery Char

As for he class, I like the trees so far, but no traps or potions. :crazyeyes:

A light, fast melee (scimitar focus?) with swift combo strikes, mixing in ranged would work.

A desert marauder char would be neat

The problem is that he doesn't look "light" or "holy".
You said it- "marauderer", which means he'll use cheap street fighter tricks like TRAPS. That's why traps will fit perfectly with him, if, as said, they'd be completly different than D2 traps.

If he had a ~HOLY~ vibe to him I would agree traps are out. But I guess will save the Holy thing to another char.

P.S-
I'm not talking about if it's the 4th char or not.
I'm saying- Let's make him the 4th char. We have a picture, let the ideas flow~~~

 

[NASE]

Re: Mystery Char

Why is that, it isn't one bit true that traps are boring just because it wasn't done right in D2, i can already think of various tactics and elaborate trap combos that can be made for this character.

There are three things you can do. One is utilise traps as way to get magic skills going, like DII did. It's much more interesting to just use that magic yourself. We agree that this isn't really interesting.

Then, you can have real traps. Things that do damage when monster get close to it. Like something that explodes. Problem is that this will result in a slow paced game, which isn't interesting. You want to do damage, you don't want to lure monsters in your trap (not to mention the multiplayer problems).

And then we have the sort of crowdcontrol traps you describe. But why do we want to traps for that. If you want to slow monsters, you can use something like holy freeze, freezing arrow, mind blast, ground stomp etc. No need for traps, there are more interesting option (more interesting because they can be combined with other skills. Freezing arrow is a bow skill, thus can be combined with other bow skills, your traps is a traps and can only be combined with other traps.)

The things you are describing can be achieved with other instruments without the need to use traps. Then why use a static strange and unlogic system when you can do it different. If you really want something like that, work with static magic as this can be combined with non-static magic. (things like the wizard has in his/her time stop, with that frost nova thing etc.)

 

[Knight_Wolf]

Re: Mystery Char

Then, you can have real traps. Things that do damage when monster get close to it. Like something that explodes. Problem is that this will result in a slow paced game, which isn't interesting. You want to do damage, you don't want to lure monsters in your trap (not to mention the multiplayer problems).

Why slow paced .... and why not lure monsters in my trap if i'm the lure itself .. if they want to get me they will have to move over a ton of damaging traps while i unleash hell on them using my bow and cross bow skills ... i really don't get your point.

Traps are also but a single tree our of three skill trees that this supposed character could have ... i don't see anything slow about placing few traps to cover your back and turning around to bash some strong mob with a scimitar while the traps kill/damage another group that is trying to swarm you until you can turn around switch to your bow and whack them with ranged skills from your bow tree after the traps softened them.

And then we have the sort of crowdcontrol traps you describe. But why do we want to traps for that. If you want to slow monsters, you can use something like holy freeze, freezing arrow, mind blast, ground stomp etc. No need for traps, there are more interesting option (more interesting because they can be combined with other skills. Freezing arrow is a bow skill, thus can be combined with other bow skills, your traps is a traps and can only be combined with other traps.)

That's a very very weird logic .. why WD has zombie dogs why not just use fire magic, why Necro could summon an army of the dead why not just use bone magic ... ask yourself .. Traps are in some way a different type of minions with different characteristics, weak points and strong points.

And crowd control skills or traps are 200% combine-able with any other offensive skills you have .. even your ranged normal attack makes great use of crowd control traps ... at least traps are lay and forget .. they don't drain your mana constantly like using two offensive skills at the same time.

And traps can let you affect multiple locations at the same exact time unlike other skills.

The things you are describing can be achieved with other instruments without the need to use traps.

Same thing could be said the other way around ... Traps .. minions ... etc etc are all tools to achieve the same goals .. kill monsters.

Then why use a static strange and unlogic system when you can do it different. If you really want something like that, work with static magic as this can be combined with non-static magic. (things like the wizard has in his/her time stop, with that frost nova thing etc.)

From when are traps unlogical !!!!?

I don't know but you seem to have had a bad experience with traps in D2 and refuse to see any potential in them .. i have seen whole games built around the idea of using traps and i do know very well there are tons of ways for both combining Traps and Traps and combining other skills with traps .. the idea has a lot of potential really. (Ex: like redrach said .... So the typical 'Sealsin' combo is to Blink right on to a pack of enemies, use Rune of Ice to freeze them all, and then spam Seal of Fire while they're frozen till they're all dead ... it combines two trap types with an offensive movement skill .. and that's just two trap types and a single skill)

 

[Ishtor]

Re: Mystery Char

i think he said it all :coffee:

 

[NASE]

Re: Mystery Char

From when are traps unlogical !!!!?

You want something yet instead of doing it directly, you are making a strange turn just to get it.
Look at it this way. You want to be able to affect a certain region without the need of constant attention (or this, you want to go from France to the USA). Yet instead of making skill that do this, you want to put magic in mechanical things to perform this function (in stead of taking a plane, you are first going to Russia).

You want to be able to freeze monsters in place. You could utilise an arc shoot with a freezing arrow that covers the place in ice. If you want fire damage in on place, you can use the same idea or use immolation arrow.
You can create an arc shot skill that makes the arrow stick out of the ground vertically. Then you can implement magnetic force in the tip to attract monsters (that wear iron/steel).

I don't know but you seem to have had a bad experience with traps in D2 and refuse to see any potential in them [/QUOTE]

I see potential in the idea to affect a region with the need of constant attention. Decoy does exactly that and I like it. I abuse it all the time. Freezing arrow does something similar, certainly with a long freeze time. Hydra does exactly that and I have build (screwed up) a hydra sorcerer.
Yet you don't need to limit yourself to traps if you want to implement this. There are more interesting way to achieve the same effect.

[edit]
Grimwand has a traps-wise effect and yes, I've build a frenzy barbarian with this skill.

[edit2]
Traps for me are more like a '4th tree' that you weave through your other tree rather then a tree itself. it's a utility tool rather then a focus. And if you look at things this way, you don't need/want traps. With a bit creativity, you can create trap like effects with the mechanisms already in your trees.

 

[AtomicJ]

Re: Mystery Char

Um, I hate to slow the thread down, but where was that photo taken? I've never seen this art before, so it's something new to me! :thumbup:

An Arabian Nights-themed class would be cool. The artwork evokes a Rogue or Assassin type character, which is nice (there should be more melee/ranged classes than magic wielders IMO, as magic seems too common and less cool if everyone uses it). It seems like Blizzard is trying to bring together heroes from every continent of Sanctuary for D3. So far (the Diablo equivalents of) Scandinavia, Africa, and the Far East have been represented. Now we're possibly looking at a class from Arabia.

Not to ruin the international flavor or be the guy pushing for more Anglos in the game, but to be honest I'm still crossing my fingers for a Solomon Kane-style Rogue/Amazon/Assassin character, like the one I mentioned a while back: http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=716468. :whistling:

 

[NASE]

Re: Mystery Char

it appears to be a background/poster at some sort of blizzcon.
http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=725666

 

[wishforskillz]

Re: Mystery Char

Or another that sucks enemies like a large magnet so that you can effectively use some AoE skill or fire enchanted explosive arrows on them.

I can imagine the AI saying this.

"Guys, don't go over there, I just saw a pack of Fallen wander like 10 feet from that wall and then they got stuck to the ground. Then a freakin hail of arrows came and killed them."

 

[jakotaco]

Re: Mystery Char

You want to be able to freeze monsters in place. You could utilise an arc shoot with a freezing arrow that covers the place in ice. If you want fire damage in on place, you can use the same idea or use immolation arrow.
You can create an arc shot skill that makes the arrow stick out of the ground vertically. Then you can implement magnetic force in the tip to attract monsters (that wear iron/steel).

Sure if you want the same effect on the monster. But why does every skill have to be a "click on the monster to affect it skill". Besides the usage of such skills would be way different. A trap would be more of a preparation for combat while an enchanted arc shot would be an active combat move.

Now traps does have some limitations, especially in games where monsters mostly stands and waits for the player. With a more active monster AI however traps could be really cool.

I am however a bit uncertain on how they would be able to implement a mechanical trap into a game like diablo. Without adding some magic to the traps I guess it's limited to caltrops or maybe some chemicals on the floor, possibly some flammable oil with a fuse or with some technological achievements possibly a crude landmine.

 

[NASE]

Re: Mystery Char

Sure if you want the same effect on the monster. But why does every skill have to be a "click on the monster to affect it skill". Besides the usage of such skills would be way different. A trap would be more of a preparation for combat while an enchanted arc shot would be an active combat move.

Then you are working with slow paced things. You create your traps in one room, run to the next trying to get the monsters to run into the room with the traps.
This makes it slow paced and will cause problems with multiplayer. Your barbarian ally won't play like this. He will run in try to kill the monsters, get killed, call you a noob and leave. Where's the fun in that?

So eventually, you will probably end up using it just like that arc shot.


P.S. And why couldn't an arc shot function the way you want. Ice on the floor stay ice for some time. And that ice freezes for some time. That magnetic skill will keep on working for a period of time.
A decoy works for a period of time, as does hydra (perhaps a bit short) and grim wand.
You don't need traps. It's not like you want to secure a room for monsters that may or may not come within the next hour.

 

[Sass]

Re: Mystery Char

I can understand the "no potion", but why no Traps, they could complement his ranged abilities quite well and make him very interesting, but they need to be done differently from the D2 assassins ones.

True, I did mean ones similar to the d2 sin's ones.

However, they weren't "boring", or anything like that unless you're bored by that class. I'm bored by hdins, but they require movement and focus, unlike traps

While they could be cool, they'd have to be redone. The way they were in d2 was like a small device casting a spell (lighting, inferno, etc). They weren't like a bear trap, or a dart firing trip wire, or something like that. Heck, explosive runes wouldn't be half bad >>


If implemented like that, I may lean towards it, but I'd rather have the fighting prowess touched on than a bear trap.

The problem is that he doesn't look "light" or "holy".

And that's a problem how? He doesn't have to look holy.

You said it- "marauder", which means he'll use cheap street fighter tricks like TRAPS.

I don't remember traps in SF. Maybe it's just me and my lack of playing for a while. *shrug*

 

[Chorkstain]

Re: Mystery Char

I don't think conventional traps work so well in a game like this. But there are cool things which are kind of like traps, for example Corpse Explosion. I didn't like the way they were designed for D2 since they were just area spells in disguise rather than something that required planning.

So NASE says planning doesn't suit this game, which is right in the sense that you don't want to be planning traps and then luring packs of foes three rooms away. That's not fun or interesting. However you can plan things mid-combat, for example Corpse Explosion. What about a 'trap' which explodes and knocks back foes when they hit the player in melee combat? Actually the Sorceress had spells like that in D2. Anyway that's also a trap in a sense.

What does a trap do in this kind of game, or rather what SHOULD a trap do? It may help to define this sort of thing. Let's try it:

A trap is a technique which counters an enemy action.

This is pretty loose, but it doesn't seem bad. Enemy tries to run towards you, gets impaled by a spike trap. Enemy attacks you, gets exploded/frozen. Enemy casts a spell, receives heavy lightning damage. Going with this theme we could come up with lots of stuff, just think of what the enemy might do.

What this also does is makes the method of trap use an asset and not an inconvenience, as NASE complained about. It requires planning, but doesn't detract from the action. They are contingencies which can be incredibly useful if you use them with discretion and foresight, and they encourage variety since this style of trap is useful for specific situations.

I would classify this type of trap use as defensive and reactive, but it seems OK because they are still potentially great for dealing damage. A trap focused character would excel in controlling combats, being able to neutralize threats before they occur.