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My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by Wizdomm, May 26, 2008.

  1. Wizdomm

    Wizdomm IncGamers Member

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    My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    I have built several PvP poison necros in the past and thought I'd share my experience with my all-vita 125 fcr poison nec.

    Why build a PvP poison necro?

    Because everyone and their grandmother builds boners and hammerdins and wind druids. You really don't encounter many poison necros in PvP. And they do surprisingly well. Most characters are reduced to 1hp after just one nova. And very few characters stash poison reduction gear....although you do sometimes find the occasional antidoting fool in pub duels. In gm duels, there are only a couple of builds that really give you fits.


    Why max-vita/non-block?

    I have built many, many necros in the past and have built SEVERAL pvp nova necs including the standard max-block variety and even a full trang set non-tele nova nec. I have found that there are advantages of going all vita over max block. Those builds that poison necs completely own when they have max-block (such as smiters and barbs), they still do very well against without block (although it now takes a bit more effort to get the win). But those builds that absolutely owned your precious max-block nec...well now they aren't so bad with 125fcr and max-vita. In fact, some of those caster characters that made you pull your hair out before...now they are rather easy.

    Also, since we want to hit the 125 fcr bp AND use the ultimate poison nec weapon (Death's Web), then max block is really not an option since there is not suitable shield that provides a good block rate and good fcr.


    Breakpoints

    We are going for the max fcr for the necro (125) and for a decent fhr bp as well (86).

    FCR frames:

    15 - 0%
    14 - 9%
    13 - 18%
    12 - 30%
    11 - 48%
    10 - 75%
    9 - 125% (you shouldn't go less than 125 with this non-block build)

    FHR frames:

    13 - 0%
    12 - 5%
    11 - 10%
    10 - 16%
    9 - 26%
    8 - 39%
    7 - 56%
    6 - 86% (the minimum a pvp nec should be)
    5 - 152%
    4 - 377%


    Skills

    Poison Dagger - 20
    Poison Explosion - 20
    Poison Nova - 20
    Bone Wall - 20
    Bone Prison - 1+ (all remaining points)
    Teeth - 1
    Corpse Explosion - 1
    Bone Armor - 1
    Bone Spear - 1

    Amplify Damage - 1
    Weaken - 1
    Iron Maiden - 1
    Terror - 1
    Life Tap - 1
    Decrepify - 1
    Lower Resist - 1

    Clay Golem - 1
    Blood Golem - 1
    Iron Golem - 1
    Fire Golem - 1
    Golem Mastery - 1
    Summon Resist - 1

    You also have Battle Command and Battle Orders with the Call to Arms on switch.


    Stats

    Strength - Just enough to wear equipment. (I ended having to put about 40 pts here. Depending on if your jewelry/helms has plus to str, you could go much less.)
    Dexterity - None
    Vitality - Everything else. (You should end up with at least 3K life after BO).
    Energy - None


    Gear

    Death's Web - 2 all skills, 2 pnb skills, and an insane -50% enemy poison res (-55 with facet).
    Spirit Monarch - Plus 2 skills, 35 fcr, 55 fhr , VERY NICE mana (you need it), and some resists.
    Rare Circlet - 2 nec skills, 20 fcr, with resists (bare minimum and not THAT expensive). If you can get some other nice mods, even better. I socketed mine with a "cham."
    Enigma - I use an archon because to eventually equip a spirit you'll need to add str anyway.
    Crafted Ammy - I use a 2 nec/20 fcr/6 to all res ammy. But if you can't find a 20 fcr nec ammy, then a 10 will work (you just cant wear an SOJ).
    Ring 1 - SOJ (rare 10 fcr with res and other good mods if you don't have the 20 fcr ammy)
    Ring 2 - rare 10 fcr with res and other good mods (you likely will need fire resist since Spirit lacks it).
    Arachnid Mesh - 1 to skills and 20 fcr.
    Trang Gloves - 20 fcr, 2 to curses, and +25% to poison skill.
    Treks - 20/20 frw/fhr and nice stat bonuses.

    On switch: Call to Arms and another Spirit Monarch for BO.
    In stash: Anni, Torch, 1 PnB fhr grand charm, 8 PnB life grand charms, and all the res/life small charms you can carry.


    PvP Strategies

    General:

    Before every duel you should BO and cast your bone armor and your fire golem. Then as the duel starts you should Lower Resist every opponent. Your curse has a huge radius and you can curse your opponents while they are still offscreen. The thing that changes, depending on the class that you are dueling, is how to then get off a poison nova on them...and then to finish off the final 1hp they will have left.

    Getting The Last Hit Point:

    The fire golem's aura is the safest way to get the last hp. Teeth or Spear are also safe long range ways to get it. One more nova will do it if you are close to your opponent.

    Barbarians:

    Any barbarian that doesn't tele should be a very easy win for you, provided that you remember that you don't have max-block on this char. A max-block nec could walk right up to a barb and tank a few shots to get a nova off. But now we have to take care not to take hits. Just tele in quick and nova, and tele back out. Then get close enough (while keeping some distance) to recast your golem on him or fire off some teeth/spears. (Easy duel)

    Caster barbs are tougher but not by much. You still have a huge advantage on the fact that you have a bit more range on your primary attack and you deal more damage when it lands. Basic strategy is still the same except that you have to take care that the barb doesn't tele near you and try to WW while you are stunned. Even if they are successful though, you should be able to get off your nova. Then tele away while their life drains, and then go back to get that last hp. (Moderately easy duel)

    Paladins:

    Zealers and Charedins are toast. Just keep a distance and carefully tele/nova them. Once they are poisoned they will likely try to run to town. Cast a bone wall in front of them to prevent them from making it in time. Then fire off another nova or cast your golem on top of them. (Easy duel)

    Hammerdins are a bit tougher but you still have a nice advantage. If they aggressively pursue you then they will eventually get nova'd. If they are more defensive then you can carefully tele in (avoiding the hammers) and fire off a nova, and then tele back out. Since you are max vita you can take a hit from one hammer. But not two. So don't get hit. (Moderately easy duel)

    FOHers are very hard duels. You likely will die in just one hit without serious lite resist and some sorb gear. Keep a golem with you always since the golem sometimes will take the hit instead of you. If you can't tank at least one hit from the FOHer then it is completely pointless to try to duel him. (Very hard duel)

    Sorceresses:

    Cold sorcs are probably the easiest of the sorc classes to duel (assuming they aren't using aa). Be offensive. Keep teleing closer to them in random patterns, avoiding the blizzards or orbs, and you will eventually catch them with a nova. (Pretty even duels)

    Lite sorcs are a bit more dangerous since they have long range skills and short range skills (namely nova). So you want to work your way in to them to poison them, BUT still keep enough distance that they can't nova you. (Pretty even duels)

    Fire sorcs are probably the hardest sorc for you (if they are good). Keep a fire golem with you and don't be afraid to run behind occasionally as a shield. (Pretty even duels)

    Necromancers:

    Bone necros are not that hard for this build. You can take a couple of spears/spirits from them and not die. One nova melts them away. It tends to become a tele-nova/tele-spear battle that often requires a few mana pots chugged by both chars. Fun stuff. (Pretty even duels)

    Poison necros are nothing more than games of cat-and-mouse. The first person to nova the other should win. Timing your tele's so you tele over their nova is crucial. (obviously even duels)

    If you choose to battle a summoner in PvP, then play defensively and keep a distance to avoid getting telestomped, always leaving novas behind you to gradually destroy their minions. Again...keep a big distance from them. If you get tele'd on, you die. (Hard duel)

    Druids:

    Werebear/Werewolf are very easy. No need to even go into discussion on this one. (Easy duels)

    Rabies druids are not very hard provided you keep your distance. Their poison is more dangerous than yours since their poison actually can kill (yours only brings him down to 1 hp). But you have a ranged attack so just keep your distance. (Easy duels)

    Wind druids can be tough. They keep their summoned minions with them and that shields them pretty effectively from your novas. On top of that, they have high life and if they telestomp you then you die. You must keep a distance at all times and try to anticipate where he will tele to catch him with novas. You must have "cannot be frozen" somewhere on your equipment. These duels tend to go on for a long time so keep some mana pots. You must play very smart and not make any mistakes like lazily teleing into their range or being too offensive. (Hard duels)

    Assassins:

    Martial arts sins aren't too bad but remember we didn't go max block and they can do some damage. Keep your bone armor up and basically treat them as you would the barb builds. (easy duels)

    Trapsins are almost impossible to beat. In fact, you should just break down and cry when a trapsin enters the game. To get to them you must try (and I emphasize "try") to tele into the traps and get off a nova, all while taking multiple hits from the traps, and then try to safely tele back out again. Those are extremely long odds against you though. Well, you might say, "Why don't you wait for the sin to come after you." Good luck getting them to chase after you. Not gonna happen. And if it did, the traps are long range and will chip away at you while you still have to find a way to get inside. (Very hard duels)

    Amazons:

    Javazons really come down to whether you have high lite resist and/or some sorb. If you don't then expect to die horribly. If you do then you stand an excellent chance at making them die horribly. (Difficulty is dependent upon gear)

    Bowazons are a big change for those use to dueling with max-block rather than non-block. Unlike all the other melee chars, the bowazon has long range skills (that you no longer have an ability to block with a shield). Your only hope is work your way to them in gradually smaller circles and, once close enough fire off a nova, and try to get back out. The problem with no blocking is that either you won't make it to them, or if you do, their will be many guided arrows waiting to hit you as soon as you stomp to try to nova. Some ways to overcome the blocking problem are to use bone walls against multi shots and golems to block the guided arrows. (Hard duels)

    Conclusion

    Poison necros can be a fun and challenging PvP build that does surprisingly well. I can't count how many times I have dueled someone a few times and heard them say "man, I want to build me a nova necro next." It's also nice to not play one of the more common char builds. There are far too many boners and wind druids in PvP. :)
     
  2. struikje

    struikje IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    I can asure you that even my basic eq ghost (who I have for 4 days) kills poison necros (especially non block) with ease. You forgot to mention that clawblock can block your nova, that you have to keep your gollem up vs assa duels, and that you need to run out of wof/mb instead of trying to tele out.

    I haven't read all the guide, just a few duel "tactics". Every boner will kill you if he knows what he is doing. with theire long ranged attacks they will practically kill you every time, nova range is to short.

    I also read that smiters and zealots are "toast". with no block, low def, charge lock really isn't very hard to pull off.

    I just commented on the char's I have experience with in duels. I suggest you revise your tactics. ;)

    Nice way of presentation though :D.

    Struikje
     
  3. Wizdomm

    Wizdomm IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    True that clawblock is b*tch to deal with.

    False that boners will "kill you every time." I have dueled with this build for some time and I win most duels versus boners. Their attack is long range but I can take a few shots where all I need is to hit them once.

    And I completely stand by statement about chargers are "toast." Unless they jump me, there is almost no way for them to kill me. I just tele nova tele nova good duel. VERY easy duel.



     
  4. RxT

    RxT IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    Just a quick comment about the Smiter/Zealot deal. I use a Max Block Poison Trang Necro and they're pretty simple. I don't have much trouble with them unless, as stated above, I get jumped. It should be a bit simpler for a Necro with Teleport, though. The Paladin will usually charge into your Nova and get hurt by a lot.
    A nice "trick" to use against them is to manipulate the field with Bone Walls so they either a) run into them or b) have to go around them.

    I'd also like to note that Amazons' dodge skills can dodge Nova, too. That's the hardest thing about Bowzons in my opinion.

    Just some quick notes I wanted to post. Poison Necros are sure under-estimated, especially Trang ones. =P
     
  5. paul leung

    paul leung IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    well,my bonemancer somehow have very high posion resist to its standard gear(from treks+ciclet+ammy),i sometime can tank a posion mancer even with my ss. never use fade,antinode,etc.So I say may be not too diffcult for a bonemancer to kill a posinmancer(may be I never ever meet a good build 1 yet).Beside if bonemancer tele-shoot-tele fast enough,it is hard to get posion.

    RXT:you duel in us west ladder?Do you have chars name after the RXT-?

    a well build/skillful trapper is really pain for caster,it is their constantly mb that kill,any one figure out how to duel them yet(not pure defensive,i mean)?
     
  6. RxT

    RxT IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    Yeah, Bone Necros are hard to deal with. They have the edge on Poison Necros through range and speed. But even then I don't think they can get high enough res to kill off -100 poison res.

    I'll have to build a real Poison Necro some time to test things out

    Yeah, I duel US West Ladder. And yeah, all my chars are “RxT-â€. You probably seen my Trang Necro in some duel games before.


     
  7. Wizdomm

    Wizdomm IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    Yea, if your boner can tank more than one nova without melting away to 1hp, then you are doing good. And yes, my duels with boners end up being tele-shoot fests but boners tend to stop and fire off several shots at a time. When I stop I just fire off one nova and keep going. With all the tele-shooting going on, its usually just a matter of time before they run into the nova.

    Also, most poison necs that you may have seen were max block builds (less life and probably less fcr as well).

    I've never figured out a good way to kill a trapper.



     
  8. struikje

    struikje IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    Every max block char will keep a fcr setup vs casters. It's just that you'll never see a decent boner on your screen.

    It also seems weird that you call a matchup vs a bvc a moderately easy duel, when you are duelling a max block char. You do know they are build to kill you?
     
  9. paul leung

    paul leung IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    it is n't too hard to have 75 posion resist after they curse 'lower resist', it is rather if you want to do it.'Lower resist' most likly at around -65 and if they use facet and death, then that is when fade and black pots come in.

    Add me next time when in game:*paull ,bonemancer-dark knight (the only pvp i got)

    bonemancer ad posionmancer more or less share the same charms and gear,so good news


     
  10. Wizdomm

    Wizdomm IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    The point about the poison necs you've likely seen is that were BUILT to be max-block and that (even though they switch gear to duel you) they have a bit less life than a pure vita nec would.

    BvCs are built to kill me but they have to catch me first. That's a tall order since I tele faster than them and leave novas trailing behind me.



     
  11. paul leung

    paul leung IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    i assure u if a bvc want to,they can tele faster than necro.Barb share the fcr bp as sorc.
    not hard for them to reach 8 frames cast and have hugh open wound :dual wizzy.
    Beside,since nova is short range attack,really imo,max block is a must.
     
  12. struikje

    struikje IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    Would you please record some duels for me? It can actually be handy for your build asswell.
    If you show me duels with different bvc's (don't care if they are pub, just not some rand), a ghost/ww hybrid, some decent bone necs, And you can win a respectable amount of duels vs them, then you are some awesome dueller on a poison nec, and I'll retract my words.

    It just doesn't make any sense in my eyes.
     
  13. Wizdomm

    Wizdomm IncGamers Member

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    Re: My non-block, max-vita, 125 fcr nova necro (PvP)

    Man, I wish I could. But my machine lags badly trying to record videos. But I'd be happy to duel anyone with those characters on USEast (ladder).



     

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