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My FrozenWall build, plz critique

Discussion in 'Sorceress' started by thc-shadow, Apr 4, 2004.

  1. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    My FrozenWall build, plz critique

    I had quite a long conversation with a guy in the ladder channel (im on UsEast Ladder) about a possible sorc build. Since an Un-Synergized Fire Wall does quite a bit more damage then Meteor, we decided on that for a basis + Maxed Fire mastery (comes to 3376-3437, both @ lvl 20).

    The Cross comes from Maxed Frozen Orb and its synergy, Ice Bolt. With Cold Mastery around 5 (after skills this should be plenty enough to get most non-immune enemies down to 0 resist).

    All in all it looks like this

    20 Ice Bolt
    20 Frozen Orb (366-373 per shard, syn added)
    5 Cold mastery

    10 Warmth
    20 Fire Wall (3376-3437, mastery added)
    20 Fire Mastery

    1 Static Field
    1 Telekenisis
    1 Teleport (I cant live without this)
    1 Lightning Mastery (Tele costs alot in 1.10, so with +skills, LM should rectify this)

    Now this is the point that we got to dissagree...

    On my end, i thought adding Chilling Armor would be awesome, since your ice bolts are so high...

    On his end, he said to leave Frozen Orb stand alone (ditch Ice Bolt and sequentially Chilling Armor), and max Thunder Storm, putting 1 in Energy Shield as well.

    IMHO, both are extremely viable, but i just dont think T-Stom is up to snuff nowadays...

    what are your opinions? also, could some one point me to a sorc skill calculator, i wanna see how much, say, a lvl 30 Fwall/Orb +syn will do.
     
  2. Si1enta5sa5sin

    Si1enta5sa5sin IncGamers Member

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    It would take too long to kill fire immunes if you just got TS to go with it, stick with orb.
     
  3. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    thats what i was thinkin
     
  4. Superhal

    Superhal IncGamers Member

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    chilling armor is not affected by points in ice bolt. imho, shiver armor is better vs all non-ranged, fcr is better vs ranged.

    i would go:
    1 pt warmth
    1 pt tp
    1 tk
    1 shiver armor
    rest in frozen orb synergy.

    imho, it's better to do a few things well then to do many things poorly.

    i'm thinking about a build like this using nightwings and ormus.

    the problem i keep running into is the overall usefulness of firewall (high damage, no synergies, requires 40 points, excrutiatingly long timer.)
     
  5. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    shiver it is, too bad bout chilling...damn
    another plus, she's done at a reasonable lvl

    im keepin warmth at 10 base, for sure

    and ya fwall owns, especially with orb slowing everything to a craaaaaaaaaawl

    as for gear, magefists/dfathom/nightwings is what i was thinking
     
  6. prion

    prion IncGamers Member

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    is 10 warmth really necessary?
    just wondering what your reasoning is behind this. Most guides recommend a low level of warmth, usually base.
     
  7. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    simply put, i HATE running out of mana...but now that i think about it, 5 base is probably more suitable
     
  8. Soepgroente

    Soepgroente IncGamers Member

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    1 warmth, really. Really!

    Ice bolt does not help chilling armor, lightning mastery does not help teleport.

    20 orb
    10 cold mastery
    20 ice bolt
    20 fire wall
    20 fire mastery
    1 teleport/warmth/static field

    That's a solid build given you have a mercenary to tank for you.
     
  9. Stiertje

    Stiertje IncGamers Member

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    Firewall in itself may have more innitial damage then Meteor. But with this reasoning you forget a few important things.

    - Firewall is harder to place then Meteor. A monster can walk through the Firewall and barely feel it because it is so little time in the actual damage field. For Firewall you need a way to make the monster immobile, either with a good Merc or in some other way. Meteor places a damage field that is larger in width then Firewall. You may get less average fire damage, but the time it takes a monster to travel through it makes up for this. It also means that you can hit more monsters on a spot with Meteor, just because of the area of effect.

    - Firewall can't be stacked like Meteor. You just can't place many Firewalls on top of eachother with the casting delay and the duration taken into account.

    Firewall @ level 20
    Mana cost: 41
    Cast Delay: 1.4 Seconds
    Fire damage: 1284 - 1307 (ø1296)
    Duration: 3.6 Seconds
    Radius: 30 Yards

    This effectively lets you place 3 Firewalls at a time on top of eatchother, doing 3888 damage per second on a single spot in a line.

    Meteor @ level 20
    Mana cost: 26.5
    Cast Delay: 1.2 Seconds
    Range: 4 Yards
    Fire damage: 955 - 1019 (ø987.5)
    Fire damage per second: 266 - 291(ø 279)
    Fire lenght: 12.6 Seconds

    This effectively lets you place 11 Meteors at a time on top of eatchother, doing 3096 damage per second in a 4 yard range. This is without taking the innitial Meteor damage into account. This is only average fire damage of the after burning effect.


    So, IMO a non-synergised Meteor is better then a Firewall in almost every aspect. Of course you can hit many monsters with Firewall just because it's so long, but the inability to immobilise these monsters make for a very poor damage output. I've made a firewall sorc in 1.09, and even with the lower hitpoints it was hard to kill a monster with Firewall.
     
  10. JustGotOwned

    JustGotOwned IncGamers Member

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    Back in 1.09 I made an orb/firewall/nova/ts sorc, absurd I know but she worked and worked well at that. With orb chilling things and a HF merc doing his job firewall killed faster than nova, and I'm not talking just pure cows either. Now because of. . .aaaah I can't think of the name, the polearm that gives the chance to cast decrep things will be even slower and they'll really roast in the wall, that is unless theyre fire immune.
     
  11. mars_comet

    mars_comet IncGamers Member

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    You mean Reaper's Toll???? :)
     
  12. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    yeah its reapers, and ya i plan on a a2 hf merc. meteor is so damn common, plus i like to be different :)

    how do you get a 3:11 ratio? the timer is a .2 difference...

    the point over meteor is exactly the duration, it does more damage over a shorter duration...meaning critters dont have to fry very long before they're extra crispy.

    i just hate seeing the exact same sorc...every...single...game
     
  13. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    soep, LM doesnt benefit tele??? it doesnt lower the cost?

    stie, ok i get it...12 sec duration+1.2 sec timer=11 meteors toasting the same spot
     
  14. Soepgroente

    Soepgroente IncGamers Member

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    Nop, only points in teleport do (lvl 1 = 24, then 1 mana cost less per slvl where it ends at 1 mana at lvl 24).
     
  15. Salo

    Salo IncGamers Member

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    3 fire walls with a load of +gear will melt anything down in second or two. mephisto with orb/firewall is a sorry sight.

    so is baal, that dolt just sits in it. goey in a flash.

    a -5% fire res jewel or tal set is a great idea. i never noticed anything with the timer, if you know what youre doing, monsters will fall easily to your strong wall.

    1 pt in warmth!! everyone has to get at least +5 to skills ona sorc with crappy gear., put a pair of frostburns on and 6th level warmth does a lot if you dont use mana shield.
     
  16. Superhal

    Superhal IncGamers Member

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    k after some extensive testing with my one char who has ES:

    yes, it kills you. the most often is when i'm trying to tp away with 0 mana and end up in the same place for seconds.

    you don't need 20 tk. i put in 4 tk, and that was enough to make it somewhat workable. the testing sorc has @400 life, 1000 mana. i still died once in a while, but it was a lot less than without the tk.

    this char also had very bad resists. imho, it was better to use ES in this situation.
     
  17. thc-shadow

    thc-shadow IncGamers Member

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    thx all, very insightful

    im thinking magefists over frosties...anyone agree?
     
  18. Stiertje

    Stiertje IncGamers Member

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    Depends. Magefists do have 20% FCR and +1 Fire Skill (handy for Firewall), but the 25% mana regen does not have the same benefits as Frostburns for your mana pool. 40% mana on a Sorc is just very nice. But I would only equip Frostburns when I had enough FCR and when I lacked mana.
     

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