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MULTIZON Viable for Hell pits?

Discussion in 'Amazon' started by Ivor Adella, Jan 30, 2004.

  1. Ivor Adella

    Ivor Adella IncGamers Member

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    MULTIZON Viable for Hell pits?

    Hey all. I've been messing around with an amazon, when taking a break from my necro. I really like her! Maybe more than my skelemancer.

    I've been checking out the forums here, and re-started my amazon after 31lvl cause I opened up every skill, and basically wasted all the pts in javalin skill set, cause I'm defianately going with bows.

    Anyway, I've read tons of stuff on strafe builds, but are there any good multi builds out there viable for hell pit runs? Or does the damage reduction from multi make it a bad choice?

    When I get there, I'll have decent bows, WitchWild and Goldstrike. I plan to eventually put ohm and pul into witchwild, and make it's damage much greater in the pit. But it'll be awhile before I get ohm or pul lol...

    Also, I've heard alot about upgrading uniques, can someone tell me the recipe for that? Is it the one using the SoJ? Hope not, cause I'd really like to upgrade my WWS.

    Thx for responding, if you do!
     
  2. Cambylobacter

    Cambylobacter IncGamers Member

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    I've use purely Multi for the whole pit - even with maxed Freeze and Immo arrow, multi does the job perfectly. I use Buri and have quite a few additional cold charms/effects, coupled with a Holy Freeze Merc and level 27 Valkyrie so it means I'm never really rushed, and if needed I can retreat and the rushing mobs end up moving into my valk and merc whilst I back up with Multi.
     
  3. Moog_playa

    Moog_playa IncGamers Member

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  4. danc133

    danc133 IncGamers Member

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    Come on multi in hell as your main attack that sounds like old time slapstick comedy.
     
  5. Moog_playa

    Moog_playa IncGamers Member

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    Yes, I've heard that before from you...very original, but at least you're only ripping off yourself. My multizon made Mat easily, with no deaths, playing on /players 8 all the way through normal and NM, and /players 3 or 4 during Hell. It's easy to criticize when you've never tried it.

    Or I guess you can just make the same thing everyone else does, since originality isn't your strong point. :)
     
  6. Omikron8

    Omikron8 IncGamers Member

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    Since most regions of the pit (level 1 and stairs on level 2) consist of narrow areas, a 2 or 3 fps strafe with high pierce will easily beat multi in such situations. This is from experience with a level 90 strafezon with around 90% pierce.
     
  7. Moog_playa

    Moog_playa IncGamers Member

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    Just curious, but have you tried Multi? I've used Strafe a ton, but not much in the Pit...weird thing is, the borders (walls) in the Pit seem to not be really firm...sometimes arrows will go right through the walls, so to your arrows, the passages are a bit larger.
     
  8. Cambylobacter

    Cambylobacter IncGamers Member

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    absolutely, the Multi arrows go way wider than the corridors. I've tried Strafe and Multi in the Pit and Multi is my preferred choice.

    Multi got me through Hell no problems, with Freeze arrow as back up/for bosses.
     
  9. race2k3

    race2k3 IncGamers Member

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    Multishot work great on mobs of monsters,better on average than strafe.

    Let's consider an average dexazon with 400 dex.Let 'b' be the average damage of the bow,and let's consider a 7/2 bow for stafe (similar calculation are for 9/3);the 7/2 bow will attack in 8 frames with just a little more IAS than strafe requires.

    Frames No of stafe attacks No of multi attacks
    16 4 2
    24 8 3
    32 12 4

    For 5 monsters,strafe will take 7+4*2=15 frames and hit every monster ONCE
    Multi will take 8*2=16 frames and hit every monster TWICE.

    For more than 5 monsters multi will be FAR superior.

    Dmg on multi is b*3/4*5.
    Dmg on strafe is b*3/4*6.

    So strafe will do 1.2 times the dmg,so even for 5 monsters 1.2<2 so it's less dmg.

    Let's calculate the med dmg per frame for both:

    strafe: monsters*b*9/2/(5+*monsters)
    multi: monsters*b*15/32

    If you do the math (solve the inequeality of strafe>=multi dmg) stafe will do more damge on average for 2 monsters only (2.3 actually),while for 3 or more multi is superior.

    This is theory.As for real gaming,i took my 1.09 Buriza dexazon,upgraded it to colossus crosbow and unsocketed it and socketed with JAH,and switched my PTopaz Skulder's for enigma for the extra strength required (actually i didn't lose that much mf since i also switched IK gloves for chance guard since enigma gives so much strangth).It work great,everything falls very quickly,i don't have to worry about AR (JAh for normal monsters,GA for uniques).I tried stafe (only slvl 6 or so) and it sucks.I think multi is much better than stafe all around.
     
  10. Vandal Hearts

    Vandal Hearts IncGamers Member

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    Isn't it kind of hard to take a 1.09 Buriza off a character who is NON-LADDER and upgrade it to Colossus Crossbow seeing as how, you know, the unique Exceptional-Elite recipe only works on ladder...?

    I cannot say if MultiShot is better than Strafe, but I have used Strafe and I have been very pleased with the results. A high slvl of strafe is critical though since it allows you to compensate for the 3/4 weapon damage and also attain a higher number of minimum arrows fired (there is a formula for this, you can look it up). By using a low slvl strafe, it's not a fair comparison since one of the greatest advantages of strafe (it's compensation of the 3/4 weapon damage) is negated.
     
  11. race2k3

    race2k3 IncGamers Member

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    You are aware of the fact that ladder only items/recipes are all enabled for single player right ?

    And i considered a slvl 20 strafe in the calculations.Since you'll be wearing a lot of mf,you won't have much more (22 or 24 at most,that means another 10-20 % dmg,compared to the 600 % you already have it's not that much).
     
  12. danc133

    danc133 IncGamers Member

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    No you haven't heard it from me b4 maybe a different dan. As for playing the same thing not likely as I like playing offbeat stuff. Shoot I even have a throwing sorc. The debate between multi and strafe is as old as the game itself. Next time your going to comment about a player not a playstyle make sure who your talking to. My reasoning is multi can only hit a monster once strafe isn't bound by that and is cheaper on mana of course YMMV.
     
  13. Xiamet

    Xiamet IncGamers Member

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    Comparing a low level Strafe to a Maxed Multi is not only unfair, it's inaccurate and very unbalanced, especially since you're not taking into consideration damage increases from maxed Strafe and also the fact that a maxed Strafe fires a minimum # of arrows (7, I believe)...meaning fewer targets will get hit multiple times per Strafe Volley. So if anything, fewer targets increases Strafe's effectiveness, and single targets like bosses get hit multiple times per second. Try killing Diablo or Baal with Multishot, and see how long it takes you.

    Need to recalculate your figures and include these factors you left out, with Multi and Strafe maxed.

    To say that Strafe sucks when you've only plunked 6 points into it is like saying multi sucks with only 6 points into it. You haven't utilised the full potential of either skill, and are making judgements based on erroneous experiences.

    -X
     
  14. Cambylobacter

    Cambylobacter IncGamers Member

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    I have said this before and will again; I really believe the strafe - multi argument comes down to playing style. I like the feel of Multi, and simply don't enjoy the mechanics of strafe as much. And probably, the proponents of Strafe feel the contrary.

    There will most likely be situations where one is technically superior to the other, but at the end of the day over the full game, it just comes down to which one a player enjoys the "feel" of more.
     
  15. jwfcp

    jwfcp IncGamers Member

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    sorry if only it were true, one target = one arrow from strafe

    With the exception of "Can put a lot of arrows into a single monster if other monsters are lined up behind it" which holds true to multishot with pierce as well. could you imagine that though, 2 fps shots AND 50% ed? completly sick.

    the fundamental differance between the two are strafe lock vs auto aiming. neither are viable vs bosses. multi can scale to higher # of targets at high levels, strafe deals more damage.
     
  16. jwfcp

    jwfcp IncGamers Member

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    x, sorry, im wrong and i feel nauseous because its so broken. wow, time to start a new char...
     
  17. Moog_playa

    Moog_playa IncGamers Member

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    Keep in mind as well...Strafe requires more prerequisite skill points. Maybe only a point or two, but that's important in 1.10.

    Also, Strafe I believe, spits out one arrow per target and ally on the screen...so your valk will cause another arrow to release, etc. Is this still the case? I haven't tested it recently.

    Plus there's the whole strafe-lock-death thing. Very ugly.

    Again, I'll echo another poster...it comes down to playing style, but EITHER are viable, plain and simple.
     
  18. Makhlath

    Makhlath IncGamers Member

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    Heysa.

    I tried a LF/Strafe hybrid for the pit. Ended up using only LF, since the strafe-lockup made things more dangerous than what I wanted it to be. I move around alot, and like to have the ability to move whenever I want to. I only play hardcore, and if you're on softcore I guess the ocational lockup-death won't matter so much. But I prefer multi over strafe.

    -But thats just my opinion tho. Build you character the way you like to play it. If it doesn't work out, it won't take too long to rebuild her. With the Baal-run games these days leveling is fairly easy.

    -Mak
     
  19. bobert

    bobert IncGamers Member

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    well i like both skills, i think it just has to do with ur playing style and what u like (as mentioned in another post)

    i myself, like multi of strafe just because i have more fun with multi and i enjoy spamming waves of arrows :xrollseye :) :D
     

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