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Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

Discussion in 'Diablo 3 General Discussion' started by fmulder, Mar 15, 2011.

  1. fmulder

    fmulder Site Contributor

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    Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Source: http://www.cgmonthly.com/freearticles/interviews/item/18774-through-hell-by-torchlight.html

    Mostly about Torchlight but D3 gets a mention:

     
  2. Sass

    Sass Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    So...they play D3 and get more ideas to make a carbon copy of.


    I'm actually surprised they're talking about Torchlight as if it's a serious game. It's a D3 clone filler game to waste time until D3 at best.
     
  3. ThomasJ

    ThomasJ Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Max came from Blizzard North and all of the classes ideas we are seeing was Blizzard North's original ideas. All Blizzard Irvine did was tweak them to their liking making them more WoW fanboy friendly.

    Why so suprised about Torchlight. Torchlight is a very popular game now and it just got even more popular when Runic released Torchlight 1 on the Xbox 360 a few days ago.
     
  4. Nizaris

    Nizaris Clan Officer - US West Hardcore

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    It looks like they're recycling a lot of their old ideas - yeah it was their original ideas, but you can also see skills that were directly hi-jacked from Diablo 3's gameplay video.

    The thing about Torchlight is that there's zero intuition - it's a steady downward spiral in a linear progression that fused Fate and Diablo together. I had fun playing the game, but I was dead bored before I even finished the game. I've got a fair amount of hope for T2, but it'll have a fair amount of competition.

    Personally, I had more fun playing the F2P Corum Online (now deceased) than I did Torchlight, but perhaps that's just because there was co-op.
     
  5. ThomasJ

    ThomasJ Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Well you also have to keep in mind that Torchlight was an 11 month project. It wasn't meant to have multiplayer or all the bells and whistles other hacknslash games have. Torchlight 2 will have online multiplayer, lan and you will still be able to use mods. Can't ask for much more!


     
  6. cacophony

    cacophony Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    The one thing I'd ask for is real balance, something Blizz North in all of their various incarnations has struggled w/ and ultimately failed to get done. And it's not even due to bugs; they flat out design skills terribly out of the box. In Torchlight, some of the level 25 skills, the biggest of the big, DON'T SCALE W/ GEAR AT ALL. And they were designed that way! Really? A lot of skills scaled so exceptionally well w/ gear or stats that you only needed one point in them. The damage skills were one point wonders. Mods papered over some of these flaws, but how could some of these conceptual mistakes get made in a released product?


     
  7. FluffyTheFluffer

    FluffyTheFluffer Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    AFAIK Runic is more the "Fate" team than BN.


     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2011
  8. ThomasJ

    ThomasJ Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Agreed that balance is important but in just about every game I have played balance is always on ongoing process and it is also very subjective.
     
  9. cacophony

    cacophony Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    True, but Torchlight wasn't even close. Damage skills completely unaffected by gear or stats? That shouldn't have made it out of the preliminary meetings, let alone the shipped game.


     
  10. Varquynne

    Varquynne Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Thanks for the heads-up regarding the interview, fmulder!

    I enjoyed Torchlight for a bit. It certainly didn't have as much of a lasting appeal as the Diablo titles. I picked Torchlight up for 10 bucks, though, so I feel it was well worth the amount spent.

    Looking forward to Torchlight 2. It should be a fun little game in the interim before Diablo III is released.
     
  11. Turnip

    Turnip Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Umm, what was hijacked from diablo 3 exactly? To the guy above..

    The cartoonyness is the only thing I can spot, but then again the original fate was cartoony as well so it couldnt be that which you mean.
     
  12. Sass

    Sass Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Torchlight is the poster boy of taking D3's ideals and turning it into a WoW clone.

    Besides, the classes are far from original. All they are are the warrior, sorcerer and rogue with a new name. Those are the three core archetypes, so of course it'd use them some how. Its use has no correlation to BN and being more original / "true to D3".


     
  13. FluffyTheFluffer

    FluffyTheFluffer Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    You're getting ridiculous, Sass. The fighter character is the same beefy melee guy he's been in dungeoncrawlers since the dawn of time, and looks nothing like the 55-year-old-roadie-on-steroids that is the D3 barb. The alchemist is absolutely nothing like any character in the D universe - a steampunk nerd in goggles that specializes in robots and shoots lasers. And the gun-toting vanquisher is the model for the demon hunter, obviously, not the other way around. Why do you think the female came first, with dual-wielding crossbows as the marquee ability?

    If anything, TL's biggest strength is its inviting character design that pushes against the fantasy model with a steampunk element without breaking the fantasy ambience, while the art direction of D3 is easily the weakest element.
     
  14. Kiroptus

    Kiroptus Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    TL is... cute. Thats the most I can get for it, I think there is a lot of room to grow but it must find its own identify and stop trying to emulate something else. The shared skills need to go, there needs to have more variety, in the skills and monster behavior as well.

    It needs more depth, the game looked a lot like Fate (Infact I believe they used the same engine) and played like it which is not a very good thing.

    I really wanted to like TL more but in the end it felt so.... discardable. It just didnt have the same appeal as Diablo. I do hope that Schaefer find success because they deserve it, those guys helped a lot the series but if they want to stay behind Diablo's shadow with this casual-fate alike clone, I dont see a long future for them once Diablo 3 is out, infact they may be facing a good competition even with Dungeon Siege 3 and Darkspore.
     
  15. FluffyTheFluffer

    FluffyTheFluffer Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Kiro, good points all - but remember, it was literally a year from design document to download. And the intention all along was to triangulate a game like 'bejeweled' and the traditional ARPG genre - they succeeded at that very well, and making it family-friendly, accessible, and, yes, 'cute' was part of that.

    TL2 will have had a much longer development time and should probably surprise quite a few people with its depth and replayability.
     
  16. Kiroptus

    Kiroptus Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Yeah I understand that it had a very fast development cycle, especially since Max and the others at flagship studios developed a very nice little game at the same time they were tweaking Hellgate, it was Mythos but as they lost the rights to Hellgate due to its poor performance they also lost Mythos and from the interviews, losing Mythos was simply devasting to them, everyone was asking "How do you feel about your failure and all that?" as the Vultures were going from everywhere across the internet (gotta love anominity right?).

    So I remember he said a very similar phrase, he said: "Well, if people want to punish us for failing to deliver a good game experience with Hellgate London, dont bother, trust me, we already being punished a lot, I think few people know how horrible it is to have all your work taken from you, it simply doesnt belong to your anymore, after all the care and sweat we put on it, its just gone, taken from us".

    It was something on that level he said better words than mine, I just cant find the interivew but with that Max himself managed to shut the mouth of many vultures surrounding flagship studios, specially because oddly, Mythos was actually being more enjoyable than Hellgate London many felt that Mythos deserved a chance and that Hellgate was right to have failed.

    What they did with TL was great but as I said, it NEEDs more depth, TL was a great comeback from them but they do need something extra. Maybe a better engine, more story, more lore, more locations (confirmed), new gameplay elements, etc... TL2 needs to be a different game than TL1 to succeed, as the competition is getting fierce, another simple game as TL1 wont cut it for them. I do hope they manage to do it, Torchlight was simply a promise to how much potential they could have now I believe TL2 is the time to prove it. MP adds a lot of depth and challanges as well, balance needs to be looked at acordingly, networking code is a pain to manage (tho Steam can help it), and there is a new class announced. Again, I hope they do well because as D3 is closing to its release a bunch of clones are comming out as well so I dont think that TL is competing only with Diablo as he states on the interview, the other "clones" are also going to be a problem imo, Maxis is filthy rich (the Sims... ugh) who knows how well Darkspore will actually be? It could end up being a surprise. An Dungeon Siege always was the "Diablo fix" for the fans. TL is not alone with the big gorila, there are also the other little monkeys as well.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2011
  17. Turnip

    Turnip Diabloii.Net Member

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    Re: Max Schaefer interview from CGmonthly

    Mythos was pretty fun and captured a lot of what made diablo so fun, blowing up screenfulls of enemies with AOE. I personally dont care for torchlight being as cartoony as it is using the same crappy lighting d3 has, and the gameplay wasnt as great as an action rpg can be being rather slow and repetitive, but I believe the mods have potential to make TL2 an awesome game.
     

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