map_hack?

PuNKaSS4_20

Diabloii.Net Member
map_hack?

Is it still out there? How do you counter it? I'm a long time player who has never, ever grabbed anything past an soj that I found in a hell cow level.

Anyways, I tried to help a kind soul out (kill diablo) and this mofo was able to tell exactly what i was wearing, exactly from helm to toe. I doubted him at first, but he labled everthing i had equiped.

I guess I could've pk'd him and laughed, but I can only wonder, is this kinda hack still going around?
 
PuNKaSS4_20 said:
Is it still out there? How do you counter it? I'm a long time player who has never, ever grabbed anything past an soj that I found in a hell cow level.

Anyways, I tried to help a kind soul out (kill diablo) and this mofo was able to tell exactly what i was wearing, exactly from helm to toe. I doubted him at first, but he labled everthing i had equiped.

I guess I could've pk'd him and laughed, but I can only wonder, is this kinda hack still going around?
yes and it's more common than ever. there's no counter since blizzard is a bit lax in banning mh users.
 

krischan

Europe Trade Moderator
Bnet tells the player computers which equipment everybody wears, so the computers can correctly display the characters. That means there is no way for you to prevent others to determine what your equipment is.
 

Myrakh-2

Diabloii.Net Member
And despite this design bug (one of many...), it still doesn't work --- I've been told that my Bowazon throws arrows since she isn't wearing a bow...
 

Leohappy

Diabloii.Net Member
itsPizzarific said:
there's no counter since blizzard is a bit lax in banning mh users.
They're unable to even ban botters and bots are much more obvious and hurt the game and servers much more.

AFAIK maphack is tied to the game and not the user so bnet can't really know if someone is using mh or not. That would explain why the battle.net team failed to find a permanent solution which would prevent maphack from working.

But enough of this.
 

Myrakh-2

Diabloii.Net Member
A bot cannot be detected unless you are running statistics --- and with each bot generation, your heuristics would need to be carefully scrutinized, since it is next to impossible to distinguish a decent Mephi-Bot from a braindamaged MFer.
Simple bots may be obvious, but once a scheme is added to detect them they will just get improved programming.

Maphack is a different issue --- it's entirely a result of design bugs, allowing the client to access information that it doesn't actually need. Since the information is there, Maphack can display it --- and there is nothing bnet can do.

AFAICS it is not possible to completely keep unnecessary information out of a client (both server performance and network bandwidth issues require that some things are done clientside), but D2 is exceptionally bad in that respect. Short of rewriting D2 with a more secure client/server protocol this cannot be fixed.

Duping, on the other hand, can be fixed, unless the aforementioned client/server protocol is even worse than I'd guess...
 
Myrakh-2 said:
And despite this design bug (one of many...), it still doesn't work --- I've been told that my Bowazon throws arrows since she isn't wearing a bow...

sounds like the strength bug. if you're using an item or charms to give you the minumum strength (or possibly dex) to use your bow, other players won't be able to see it.
 

Ax2Grind

Diabloii.Net Member
Yes, and more prevalent

PuNKaSS4_20 said:
Is it still out there? How do you counter it? I'm a long time player who has never, ever grabbed anything past an soj that I found in a hell cow level.

Anyways, I tried to help a kind soul out (kill diablo) and this mofo was able to tell exactly what i was wearing, exactly from helm to toe. I doubted him at first, but he labled everthing i had equiped.

I guess I could've pk'd him and laughed, but I can only wonder, is this kinda hack still going around?
Mostly agree with what everyone else has said, with specific exceptions.

Packet-sniffing allowed people to gamble exactly the items they wanted since the server sent the client all of the information concerning the properties of the item before it was purchased. This is how Stones of Jordan were first a hot market item and regular source of currency, before duping. Blizzard changed the way that worked by altering when the client is told what the item is, in this case after it is gambled. This essentially put everything concerning gambling on server-side. The same could be done with appearance, as each picture of someone, say what kind and color of armor was worn, would be sent but not the actual armor name and properties. It seems Blizzard thought it more efficient to let the client do all of that, and we see the result. Of course, this sort of thing could be done with regards to the area map and other concepts but after the gambling fiasco Bliz realized it made a major goof in fundamental program design and would have its hands full rewriting every section to counter PS. They folded their hand.

As for botting, as I've always said, if I were given full view of everything a character did I could spot the difference in a bot and a real player within ten seconds of teleporting from the WSK2 waypoint. Programming a computer to compare efficiency may be a bit tough, but all they need is a copy of the bot itself (which, I'm assuming, they are more than capable of downloading) and they could see how it works. Anti-cheating measures could add alarms when their efficiency level reaches close to that of the bot program to draw the attention of the realm admins and let them make an official determination, the ACP wouldn't actually take any official action whatsoever.

Of course, some of the people here think it's not really possible to detect the difference between a program playing a program and a person playing a program. Let me just say that these cheaters aren't nearly capable enough programmers to be able to simulate the inefficiency of humans to such an extent to be able to fool me yet, and why would they want the bots to be inefficient? It completely defies the purpose of using a bot (other than running it while you're asleep).
 

jmervyn

Diabloii.Net Member
itsPizzarific said:
yes and it's more common than ever. there's no counter since blizzard is a bit lax in banning mh users.
I find it particularly offensive when some bum enters one of my 'crap for crap' trading games and starts begging for the quality stuff I wear, when I'm trying to unload stuff I don't need (like 3 & 4 socket armors).

If I wanted beggars, I'd go to a frees game and drop trou.
 

Dawnmaster

Diabloii.Net Member
Ax2Grind said:
Of course, some of the people here think it's not really possible to detect the difference between a program playing a program and a person playing a program. Let me just say that these cheaters aren't nearly capable enough programmers to be able to simulate the inefficiency of humans to such an extent to be able to fool me yet, and why would they want the bots to be inefficient? It completely defies the purpose of using a bot (other than running it while you're asleep).
I don't know if you're familiar with the Alan Turing Test, but you're quite correct. To stimulate human behaviour, you'd need to be able to manufacture AI (Artifical Intelligence, for the laymen). And AI simply cannot be build due to the way current computers work, in bits and algorythms. The only solution here would be to rethink the way to solve a problem without the use of an algorythm. Perhaps we'll get there one day, but for now, it is an impossibility.
 
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