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Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by LunarSolaris, May 15, 2008.

  1. LunarSolaris

    LunarSolaris IncGamers Member

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    Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    So I heard on the news yesterday about a man in Georgia who has recently created a t-shirt that has a picture of Curious George on it eating a banana. Under the picture is a caption that reads "Obama in 2008".

    Now, the man has come under fire (I believe rightfully so) because of the image that he chose to use (a monkey) - likening it to Obama (a black man).

    The man in Georgia was interviewed about the shirt and he claims anyhow, that he only picked Curious George because the cartoon figure looks like Obama (i.e. protruding ears, hairline, etc.). However, critics have criticized based on historical references of monkeys to blacks and the negative connotation in the past.

    Personally, I suspect the man in Georgia did have racial motivation behind the shirt... but the point of my thread isn't about the shirt... I'm raising another point.

    So... we have this shirt and Obama. There clearly is a history in which blacks have been compared to primates in an attempt to historically dehumanize them and to justify violence toward blacks. There is no argument about the history.

    However, for the last 7 years there have been continual comparisons to Geroge Bush to chimps - in fact, many leftist websites and blogs refer to Bush as "Chimpy". There are websites out there such as www.bushorchimp.com where he has been routinely been compared to a monkey.

    Of course, the media hasn't paid any attention over the last 7 years to the routine Bush-bashing or disparaging comments, but this issue with the t-shirt has been made a news-story.

    So the question get's raised: Is there a double standard by the media in making an issue out of this t-shirt? Or... is it different because Obama is black and the historical reference noted earlier? Is it a product of politics and Obama should get ready to get bashed and attacked as well? Or is it something different?

    Personally, I'm a bit torn on the issue. One one side I have a tendency to see the double standard here. Part of me wants to say "what's good for the goose, is good for the gander" - yet a part of me can't disregard the historical connotation and the fact that Obama is black.

    Do you guys think that it's wrong? Is the media playing favorites? Is there a double-standard?

    I lean toward yes on the double standard issue.
     
  2. WildBerry

    WildBerry IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Is it still a double standard when there are different criteria for qualifying for certain sort of treatment (i.e. the historical baggage that you mentioned causes blacks to be defended more vehemently because the connotations for some description, in this case, the monkey, run deeper for them)? Not saying this is necessarily the case, just trying to pin down definitions here.



     
  3. th5418

    th5418 Banned

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    I believe the double standard rises from the fact that many things that George W. Bush did was completely idiotic. If Obama is ready to become president, then yes, he should get ready to be humiliated and bashed by every action he takes.

    On the other hand, this is Georgia. It's extremely racist in some parts of Georgia, and I would not put it past some people to be making an extremely racist crack and trying to cover it up by saying he looks like Curious George.
     
  4. LunarSolaris

    LunarSolaris IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Well, I think that's what makes any debate on this sort of interesting (maybe I'm the only one that sees it that way I suppose).

    Wildberry - a sad part of U.S. history with racism includes a very dark past that had people trying to liken blacks to primates in an attempt to dehumanize them and as a means to justify things such as inhumane treatment, lynchings, and a general means to subvert blacks to a lower rung or class. As such, many in the black community would consider this type of image inappropriate and offensive, regardless of the intent in using it.

    There the second issue comes up, is that if you take out the race issue - is it inappropriate? Or... does race make the difference? I heard the argument yesterday made that if it's inappropriate for Obama, then why isn't it inappropriate for Bush? And furthermore, why is the media making such a big issue with Obama while it hasn't even blipped the radar for the last 7 years the exact same comparison being blatantly made.

    To me... it's a double standard. Even with the race issue. I'd argue that if the likening of a person to a primate is dehumanizing, then the media should be pointing it out for Bush as well as Obama. I see it as difference, and to me it seems to reflect an obvious bias of liberal thought in the media. And that's saying something considering I consider myself a liberal and most definitely have no personal affiliation with Bush - nor do I like his administration or the decisions he's made as president.
     
  5. lewisite

    lewisite IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Honestly why should we care? Ok sure maybe the guy is a racist and if you want to think hes an asshole by all means go for it. However this is AMERICA and people are allowed to be racist.

    Political Correctness is really starting to piss me off.
     
  6. Jaelen

    Jaelen IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    No one said this guy wasn't allowed to be a racist. His shirt isn't getting banned. On the other side of the coin, we are certainly allowed to call him a racist asshole.
     
  7. LunarSolaris

    LunarSolaris IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Keep in mind that the point of my thread isn't about the political correctness of the use of the Curious George cartoon likened to Obama (though I concede that my lengthy elaboration on that point could easly make it seem as such).

    The core issue that I'm asking, is whether there is a double standard in the media that this t-shirt is a big deal, while at the same time, Bush has been incessantly bashed and been given similar comparisons for 7-years now.

    I fully disagree with Bush and the administration. I will likely be voting for Obama (assuming he gets the Dem ticket, which I'm sure he will). However, the "Bush-bashing" that has run rampant over these last many years is tiring and childish at best. It begs the question about gooses and ganders.
     
  8. Jaelen

    Jaelen IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    I don't necessarily think it is a double standard. For it to be a true double standard, both need to have been in the same situation. Now if on down the road, Obama commits some gaffes in office, potential for double standards will then arise. And to be honest, I think there will be double standards in the media for Obama if he wins the presidency.
     
  9. lewisite

    lewisite IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    In that case yes I would say there is quite a large double standard there. It has become trendy in recent years as you suggested to crack jokes about the Bush Administration. Fueled by jokes on popular shows such as Family Guy (which has a lot of them). The majority of people I see doing it could not even tell you the difference between the Judicial,Executive and Legislative branches of government. They do it because it is hip and they want to be part of the "crowd".

    On a side note while I am critical of certain aspects about the current administration I would still not take back my decision to support Bush over his opponents.

    I will be voting for Mccain.


     
  10. stephan

    stephan IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Although I do not know the motivations of the man, if one is compared with a chimp because of policy and the other compared with a monkey because of appearance, I don't see a real double standard.
     
  11. WildBerry

    WildBerry IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    You learned (or rather, brought it with you) it from the Europeans; the precursor for all that is the theory of the Haam's children being black (Africans) and summing the traditional Judeo-Christian black-white/evil-good -duality into it, and that predates white people in America.

    I know the background (in this case), I'm more interested in what you make of it.

    The tradition of such dehumanising and the incidents caused by the said tradition don't have an impact enough to make it two different standards altogether in stead of a double standard? That's consistent with everyone being responsible of their own fortunes, so I guess I'm cool with the idea. I have no set opinion on this, myself, seeing as it is less of an issue to me.



     
  12. Mcwhopper

    Mcwhopper IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    The double standard is a big deal. You can't say one group of people is equal in all aspects to another group of people and then treat them way differently the moment they are made a fool of.

    They were treated very very bad in the past. But so are tens or perhaps hundreds of other races and they dont get treated any different do they? (I'm aiming at for instance the Schots or Irish under the British joke or all the asian races that were colonised by the Western nations). The moment the double standard dissapears is the moment true equalisation is one step closer.

    The media is only fueling the flames this way.




    edit : I just see that while I was rewriting this post for the 10th time that multiple posts appeared that might refute my post or make it useless in any way. Go go editing.
     
  13. buttershug

    buttershug IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    I think Dubya has fully earned his monkey comparison
    Obama has not.
     
  14. Jaelen

    Jaelen IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    I think this would be like using the insult 'greaser' in the 50's. While it is an insult to two different groups, one is based on how they act and the other is based on race. It's not a double standard because the insults don't mean the same things to the different groups.

    Now, if any and all criticism of Obama is labelled racism even if the criticism or insults are justified through actions, then it would become a double standard.

    EDIT: And yes, the media is definately fueling the fire.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2008
  15. LonghornRob

    LonghornRob IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Now this is a tricky one. I would say there is a double standard, but it is justifiable because of the past history with relating blacks and monkeys to one another. I understand that it could be said he's just using the same comparison for two presidents (one future), but you can't ignore the historical context.

    And on a side note, Obama doesn't really look like Curious George in the first place. Bush has a much more monkey-like face than Obama.
     
  16. toader

    toader Banned

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Good for that guy. No matter his reasons, it's a free country.

    Black people can make a shirt with a cracker on it that says "McCain 2008" for all I care.
     
  17. {KOW}Spazed

    {KOW}Spazed Banned

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Earned it? http://www.bushorchimp.com/ It specifically says the site is for his looks. . .so why can't Obama be curious george?



     
  18. crawlingdeadman

    crawlingdeadman IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    there are far more racist (and funnier) shirts out there, it's dumb to chose that one to pick on. there's no media double standard, just media idiocy.
     
  19. Road Ratt

    Road Ratt IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    I heard Bush called an idiot, a moron, stupid, a piece of ****, many many things but never a monkey.

    Just tell Bush to play the race card! :tongue:
     
  20. Merick

    Merick IncGamers Member

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    Re: Man in Georgia creates T-shirt... (debate)

    Wouldn't he give the slogan one of those red "no" signs or make it something pithier or something if he didn't support Obama? Most people would read the shirt and assume he supports Obama. And if he supports Obama, he probably is not likening him a monkey.
     

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