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Making the most out of Golems

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Mezion, Sep 9, 2016.

  1. Mezion

    Mezion IncGamers Member

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    I just wanted to create some discussion about the Necromancer, and more specifically Golems.

    First of, I am well aware of the usual approach to choosing a Golem
    + Blood is fine depending on the version but was king back in the days when it worked with Iron Maiden.
    + Clay is great for slowing bosses.
    + Fire is ok-ish to pull some aggro.
    + Iron is great for anything else since you can keep the item (even better with a good budget).

    [​IMG]

    So what is there to discuss?
    Well, I'm wondering how would you guys proceed to make the Golem a central part of your character, not just an afterthought. I remember Nightfish talking a little about his experience with Iron Golem and how doing it with IK Maul for example helped a lot to speed things up (easier first corpses for CE).

    So what is your experience with Golems?
    Did you ever try to make a Golemancer?
    Did you ever max out Blood Golem or Fire Golem for some builds?
    Did you ever make good use of a Golem with another class, perhaps from charges of a Runeword?
    Did you ever invest ~half of your points in golem-related skills and made a great Meleemancer to tag along?
    Did you find any specific items to make Iron Golems from (beside the obvious chap runewords with auras)?

    This is the kind of discussion and stories I'm hoping for here, I'm trying to see just how far we can push our construct friends.
     
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  2. Brak

    Brak IncGamers Member

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    The most exciting thing I've done with Golems is to make an Iron Golem out of Hwanin's Refuge for the ctc Static Field...repeatedly cause it dies a lot. So yeah that didn't work too well.

    But I have to say, I've reading this guide, I'm curious to try out a full Trang's Fire Golemancer with Magi, Lower Res and maybe Infinity for support
     
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  3. Mezion

    Mezion IncGamers Member

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    Fantastic info, thanks a lot.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  4. helvete

    helvete IncGamers Member

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    You can make an Iron Golem quadra immune to elemental damage because of its initial immunity to poison, and its 50% lightning resistance. Getting something like Bonesnap, double-upped, socketed with a rare jewel with at least 20% fire/cold resist and with Summon Resist giving at least 50% resistance to summons, that makes for a golem ONLY susceptible to pure magic/physical damage, with enormous damage and 40% CB to boot.

    If you just want the elemental tank, grab any high res pala shield and fill with diamonds as needed.

    Golem life scales with difficulty, so what kills a golem in NM might not kill it in hell.

    Be sure to teleport EVERYWHERE when using an expensive Iron Golem, as they'll vanish into thin air randomly when they decide to lag behind. Them lagging behind isn't always visible client side, so it's a gamble trying to "keep an eye on them". They may still be stuck like a baby in a toilet somewhere.
     
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  5. maareek

    maareek IncGamers Member

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    I posted quite a bit of thoughts on the Iron Golem when I posted my Poisonmancer with Iron Golem + Lightning Iron Wolf Pat years ago, and you're welcome to have a read if you're so inclined, but I will say that given how long their delay on attacks is and how poor their damage is going to be the only role they're going to be really great at is some sort of support role (which you've basically gone over already) so make sure you attune your expectations with that knowledge in mind.

    What I remember from that thread without re-reading is that the IG got significantly more tanky once I started using Kelpie Snare as the base instead of Insight, though certainly level had something to do with the damage he was taking.

    Lastly a note on the "delay on attacks" thing I mentioned earlier in case it's not as widely known as I assume: an Iron Golem has a 15 frame delay between making an attack and doing anything else, meaning that even if he had an attack speed of 3 frames, Rusty would only land a hit every 18 frames (which is to say just under 1.4 attacks per second.)

    All that said, recognize that if you choose to make some golem-centric build it's going to be for fun, so choose what you think is going to be cool and don't be afraid to adjust as you go. And remember to temper those expectations with reality; if you're looking for the golem to do the work you're going to need patience and a specific playstyle (don't let him get swamped/lost) but if you're good with that and know that's what you're signing up for you should do fine.
     
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  6. helvete

    helvete IncGamers Member

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    Doesn't all necro minions (except revives) have that 15 frame delay? Which is part of the reason Beast isn't such a good idea after all?

    EDIT: IIRC I had an IK maul IG oneshot Duriel in normal. IG is great for questing normal and NM, as it makes narrow passages much more comfortable. Provided you muled on something with big damage, that is.
     
  7. maareek

    maareek IncGamers Member

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    Yes, on both counts.
     
  8. pharphis

    pharphis IncGamers Site Pal

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    Only experience I have other than your typical insight golem with 1 pt synergies is when I ran nihlathak with my novamancer. Due to vipers doing insane dmg, I put enough spare points in to golem master/clay golem (?) to reach ~8-10k after summoning. Even then, I still had to waste insight sticks somewhat often (maybe 30 times in 8k runs?)
     
  9. onderduiker

    onderduiker IncGamers Member

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    A few clarifications and corrections for that guide:
    • Fire Golem is normally the fastest golem: according to MonStats.txt, Clay Golem has Velocity and Run 8, Blood and Iron Golem 9 and Fire Golem 10.
    • It's normally Immune to Fire, with Fire Resist = 100 + 100 - Fire Absorb, where FA = min(25 + [75 * [(110*lvl) / (lvl+6)] /100] , 100), so at level 1 it's 164% and at level 60 and beyond it's 100 (plus Summon Resist). This means its FA isn't useful unless hostile Conviction or Lower Resist reduces its fire resistance below 100% (which is possible, since those two are still 100% effective against immune pets).
    • There's 15 frame AI delay, so effective attack speed should actually be 31 frames, or 27 frames with Fanaticism from a Faith bow. The Necromancer Pet Calculator already takes this into account, and its damage should be accurate.
    • There's no link between being Immune to Cold and more susceptible to fire (Oblivion Knights have 60% fire resistance in Hell).
    • Its splash damage upon death or being dispelled is just 100 physical and 100 fire damage, regardless of skill level (although there's 5% chance of a critical hit doubling this). I've probably measured its radius but forgotten it, although it looks to be about 4 yards (which would be the same as Fire Enchanted explosions in Hell).
    • Fire Mastery and +% Fire Skill Damage from items equipped by the Necromancer apply to neither its own damage nor its Holy Fire damage.
     
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  10. PhineasB

    PhineasB IncGamers Member

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    I actually just posted the brief write up for the Iron Golemancer from my 7x7. I'll quote my summary from that post:

     
  11. Brak

    Brak IncGamers Member

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    That's sad. I think I must have mixed up some things with my short stint as a ZeroDogs Witch Doctor in D3.
    Thanks a lot for the clarifications
     
  12. Timinator

    Timinator IncGamers Member

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    I have a IG mancer somewhere in hell. He normally uses an IK Maul to be made. Plentiful supply, does ok damage, and if its gets killed/lost, no big deal
     
  13. Southpaw8668

    Southpaw8668 IncGamers Member

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    Thanks a bunch for the bump on that Fire Golem thread, it was an excellent read and I really wish I was able to use a FG for my character in the Cyberpunk tournament. It would be a ton of fun and give me something else to spend all my extra skill points on.


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