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Discussion in 'Classic' started by TheCerberus, Apr 19, 2005.
L: PvP Speeder/Whirlwind Barbarian
Critiques and comments?
What's ur strategy ONCE u r cursed by Decrepify? Open tp, flee back to town and wait until the blue cloud over head dispelled?
And im surprised that both boots (Goblin Toes, Hot Spurs)in ur item list don't have FRW. How can u become a speeder without a 30frw boots? Can u catch a nec with 60% frw?
But whatever, speeder is really a excellent killer again those players suffering lag even the lag is not that severe. They even don't see u before they r killed by ur ww.
Decripify is a joke for most speeders all you do is slow down there ww which helps them get more hits on you.
30 FRW are an improvement, this is basic starting equipment.
Plus, you have max Increased Speed and Iratha's/Blinkbat's adds a lot of FRW as well. If you can get +skills, that increases your speed even more. You'll be slowed down, but slowed for a speeder is much faster than regular characters. Necromancers will have to run to escape you, so they won't have any block, = easy hits. They are one of your harder classes though (walls/prisons).
Man I found really nice boots on NM MEPH for my speeder, people who use threads on speeders disgust me greatly.
People who reply to threads they don't want to read in order to make themselves feel important disgust me. What's your point?
I read your little blurb, I don't agree with a lot of points you made about the pvp's gear, mainly because hotspurs just really don't work very well for a barbarian in my opinion.
I guess I can kind of see your point with the nagas, yet I still think that 2 nagas seems like a bad combo.
Good job, you say you don't agree with a lot of points, and then only mention one. Hot Spurs are wonderful against a fire sorceress, but are not needed. Now scroll up, and read it again. See how it says "Hot Spurs*"? And how * means the item is not essential, but can help greatly? If you have a better pair of boots against a fire sorceress, by all means tell me. And consider that this is a guide for the beginner to a new ladder; 30 FRW, 35% FR, etc. boots is not helpful advice for an untwinked character.
EDIT: And really, I'd only use 2 nagas if using the second one outwayed using a resists shield or Swordback. There are no other options really. You could go two-handed, but you'd gain 1 more range to fight against who exactly? Resists shields are great against the elements, but against a necromancer they won't help. Swordback will ignore bone armor, but if you kill them in one WW Open Wounds won't matter at all.
I think I am just disagreeing because I am jealous I can't get that gear.
Your sarcasm is extremely helpful in improving this guide. Thank you.
Enough spamming, please. I will close the thread if it continues.
Let's keep the discusion to the topic on hand.
Idealy if your going to make a speeder vs elemental chars you will want to use a lance instead of nagas that way you have range 5 instead of range 3.
maxing speed? lvl 1-10 you get an extra 36% speed, 10-20 is only a boost of 7%.
like wise with natural resistance, lvl 1-10 you get 54%, 10-20 is only another 13%.
so where else could you put these 20 points now? well, you could max out shout for higher def if you decide to go after a bvb. heck it even helps for pvm. find item is another place but not really a pvp skill. you could experiment useing a speeder with warcry. I just think that those 20 points could be better used than a 7% speed boost, and 13% more resists. the diminishing returns just makes it implausable.
as far as your stats go you should be 100% vit. +0 str, +0 dex. with the right gear you can equipt a -40 lance and be 100% vit. more life = better speed barb.
gear should be similar to the following.
weapon: 300+ -40 lance +2 barb
armor: 24fhr 60life dual resists or dual sat str/dex, or single stat + single resist.
rings: priz, str, dex, AR, +life
amulet: +2 barb, priz, +str, +dex, +life
boots: 30%frw, +str, +dex, tri resist, or dual resist, and fhr
gloves: +str, +dex, tri resist, +life, or dual resist, and fhr (i think you can get fhr on gloves?)
belt: death sash
helm: fhr, +life, tri resist, +stat(str or dex)
an alternitive is you could go with itharas gloves, helm, amulet, for an additional 20% speed and decent resists. also another option is full itharas, and hawkmail for higher % resists and speed. but 9 times out of 10 the barb with the top tier rare items is better than the barb using the set/unique items.
I'd say 10 times out of 10 the barbarian with rares is better than the ones with sets/uniques. But someone starting out on ladder, untwinked, won't have those rares. What else is he supposed to build on?
Lances are for pure caster killers, but this is BvA. You going to use a lance in BvB?
Shout is worthless in PvP. You'd get maybe 4, 5k defense. A barbarian with 11k AR from Angelics will chew through that and spit it out, so it's my personal preference that Shout won't really matter. And yes, I'm very aware of those diminishing returns. But those are still returns, reducing 13% of those elemental attacks or allowing me to catch that Decrepping Necromancer 7% faster. It's a push, but after Whirlwind, Mastery, Battle Orders, you need somewhere to put your points. And Increased Speed and Natural Resists do a better job than Shout.
Since people have been making so many comments on equipment, here's what perfect items would be for me, based on 1.10 items.
- Amulet (1): +2 Barbarian, +20% all resists, +40% cold resists, +20 strength, +60 life, +10 life regeneration
- Rings (2): +150 AR, +90 mana, +30% fire resists, +40 life, +14 minimum damage, +10 life regeneration
- Nagas (2): 200% damage, +300 AR, -30 requirements, +14-20 damage
- Bone Shield with Perfect Diamond (1): +39% resists, +30% lightning resists, +30% cold resists, 17% FHR, +60 life, +5 life regeneration
- Mage Plate with Perfect Ruby (1): +30% fire resists, +40% lightning resists, +30% cold resists, 24% FHR, +98 life, +5 life regeneration
- Grand Crown with Perfect Ruby (1): +30% fire resists, +30% poison resists, +30% cold resists, +98 life, +60 mana, -30 requirements
- Demonhide Sash (1): +30% poison resists, +40% lightning resists, +30% cold resists, 24% FHR, +20 strength, +60 life
- Demonhide Boots (1): +40% poison resists, +40% lightning resists, +40% cold resists, 30 FR/W, +30 life, +5 life regeneration
- Demonhide Gloves (1): +30% poison resists, +40% lightning resists, +40% cold resists, +15 strength, +40 life, +5 life regeneration
*Hot Spurs (1), Hawkmail (1), Twitchthroe (1), Swordback Hold (1), Goblin Toe (1), Berserker's Hauberk (1), Tarnhelm (1), Stone Of Jordan (2) in stash
I have said it once and I shall say it again, you guys are godly rich.
I am using a 283 lance, Full Irathas, Hawkmail, 30 frw 37 lr 34 fr boots, dual res rings
I change boots to goblin toe and change hawk to rattlecage when a barb approaches me, it works fairly well I must say.
However I am being tempted to believe that a martel would be MUCH better than a lance.
It takes me 3 ww's to kill a holy shield FOH din, however he did have 2 sojs and godly gear so I can't feel too noobish.
Lance in Bvb? sure. My friend had one that beat quite a few s-back-twitch///naga///bh barbs
346 lance w/ cold damage and 3xx ar (pamethsyed)
Sigons Gloves and helm (big ar n +strngth)
rcage and gob toe (decent defense, 50% crushing blow)
angelic rings n ammy (huge ar, life, dex, dtm)
and deaths sash
Basically he just directly wwed them twice or so (any more than 2 or 3 direct ww's and he would have died due to no shield) then just ranged them for their remaining life
it was sweet to see a old skool lancer beat all these noob bvbs with bh's
I agree a properly equipt barb that knows what he is doing will win out using the 5 range lance vs the 3 range exec sword, 3 range naga, and 1 range battle hammer.
some of those mods you listed on your items dont exist in classic TheCerberus.
i think helms are capped at 40 mana, and 9min is the best your going to get on ammys/rings. thats all that really stood out, i sorta skimmed through it.
They probably don't, I was looking at the LoD modifiers on www.diabloii.net, and I knew I had a +9 minimum damage ring, but it was in a 9-14 category so I just picked the highest out of the group. My mistake.
And on paper, I figured a lancer could beat a BvB. The extra 2 range works so well axe v. battle hammer that I figured it would work well with lance v. others, but I never came up against a good one I guess. My build had no defense and a lot of speed, however, so I just rushed them taking chances that my shield would block a couple hits, and they never got to outrange me. I still doubt I'd use a lance though; I like axes for some reason (even though a Naga looks like a kitchen knife) and a shield is just very nice.
Question. If he went with dead-on Whirlwinds, wouldn't he risk the other person running away after he was hit with Open Wounds? It'd be pretty cheap, but it'd kill him.
Possible, but a Lance barb can also get open wounds by useing bone flesh so you could make the barb thats running bleed to death as well.
You have a much lower chance of having him get Open Wounds since he has a shield though.
w/ 50 cb and 2k+ ww range 5, cold damage, against a slow barb, they wont be able to hit u w/ ow then run away. Some would die on 1st ww lol