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"Jobless recovery" adds 112,000 jobs last month

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Smeg Head, Feb 6, 2004.

  1. Smeg Head

    Smeg Head IncGamers Member

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    "Jobless recovery" adds 112,000 jobs last month

    Jobless Rate Drops; 112,000 Jobs Added
    So what, we're supposed to complain that it wasn't good enough? It's flippin' 112,000 new jobs! That sure as hell beats no new jobs.

    Using the real numbers of people working and not just the gov't numbers and the job market is doing great. But you have to want to find a job. That's the key.

    Rest of story

    For context:
    Germany has a 10.4% unemployment rate. 4.317 million Germans out of work.

    France in Dec. 2003 had a 9.7% unemployment rate. 2.635 million Frenchies out of work.

    Russia has a 9% unemployment rate. 6.3 million Ruskies out of work.

    The US unemployment rate is 5.6% Imagine the cheers of joy if Germany, France or Russia could have a 5.6% unemployment rate.
     
  2. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

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    That's what the unemployment rate is about, man. It doesn't count unemployed people who aren't out applying.

    Why, clutch the pearls, do I hear a Republican making an appeal to international trends and opinions to forward the argument that if it's good enough for the world it's good enough for us? Where were you when we were sidestepping the UN?
     
  3. toader

    toader Banned

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    Only if your an economist. Otherwise, be happy. Im glad for the jobs, there must be a social theory somewhere or something that states something abotu unemployment rates. Its impossible to have an unemployment rate of zero, so I think 5-6% is pretty good.

    Until someone can find another one, I am going to declare my own social theory:

    Toader's Theory
    Unemployment in a society will never be 0%
     
  4. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

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    I think unemployment, at least as its currently measured so that it's exclusive of potential workers who aren't seeking employment, could hit 0% if there were more government initiatives and the private sector had a less dominant grip on the economy.

    People do have to change jobs from time to time, so maintaining a 0% unemployment rate over a period of time would be a pretty good trick outside of pure communism.

    Under a capitalist system wherein the private sector wields the majority of the power, there will always be workers competing for jobs and getting beaten out, so it probably will never be possible to hit 0% no matter how big that economy gets.
     
  5. Smeg Head

    Smeg Head IncGamers Member

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    Huh? Again I must remind you I'm not a Republican. If I were to choose a party it'd likely be the Constitutionalist. But I'm an independant conservative instead.

    But you didn't get the context. So lemme 'splain summit to ya'll.

    No matter how bad people make our unemployment rate may seem, it's beats the hell out of what Europe has. Yet it is Europe's economy that is held in such high esteem by so many.

    Guspasho keeps ranting about the "jobless recovery" to me. Well here it is. 112,000 new jobs according to the gov't and 469,000 to the aforementioned household survey. It's thats jobless, then I'm going to love it when we have a surge in jobs.
     
  6. Xynrx

    Xynrx IncGamers Member

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    That is a little misleading. You neglected to mention how many people 5.6% of the US is. In fact, 5.6% of the US population is more than the 4.317 mil from Germany, 2.635 mil from France, and 6.3 mil from Russia combined. The actual figure in people is 16.352 mil unemployed in the US alone.

    I don't know why, but I am suddenly getting a flashback to when you said it doesn't matter how much %GDP a nation gives to international aid because the US gives more $$$ in total without coming nearly as close to the % GDP.
     
  7. maccool

    maccool IncGamers Member

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    Ah, we see what we want to see and ignore the rest.

    So, if my math is correct at this rate it will only take ~16+ years to make up the jobs lost during Bush's first 4 years. Bush is going to be slaughtered on the economy issue, but he's got a tried and true ace in the hole; 9/11. That works on everything.
     
  8. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

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    In that case I'll sit this one out and wait for Gus tag your argument in the nuts by pointing out how 112,000 gained and 2.7 million lost compare and contrast with each other. The alligator eats the big one.
     
  9. advil

    advil IncGamers Member

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    it failed to meet wall street's expectations by about a third, for what that's worth.
     
  10. Damascus

    Damascus IncGamers Member

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    http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/040209/opinion/9edit.htm
     
  11. Smeg Head

    Smeg Head IncGamers Member

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    You're math is wrong. Job growth will continue to grow at an ever increasing rate like it has every other recovery. No recovery takes 16 years. :xrollseye
     
  12. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

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    What they didn't tell you was that "more than 2 million" = 2.7 million. So, something like 23 years I think?
     
  13. maccool

    maccool IncGamers Member

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    Way to understand the subtle art of sarcasm, Smeg.

    5, 16, 23 years. Who's counting?
     
  14. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

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    Sarcasm or not, it's still a valid point. Bush can't pat himself on the sack just yet, he's replaced 1/23 of what he's destroyed, and that's only talking about domestic economy.
     
  15. Smeg Head

    Smeg Head IncGamers Member

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    Well mac, apparently you guys are. You keep bringin up the number of jobs lost. Those are the gov't numbers. They don't include the number of independant contractors, self-employed and contract workers. How do you really know that jobs were lost in the first place if you won't use the right numbers?

    EDIT:
    Duped, pray tell exactly how did Pres. Bush make people lose their jobs? The dot-bomb that was on Pres. Clinton's watch? 9-11, which would hurt any economy?

    And while we're are it, how did Pres. Clinton make jobs? The dot-com bubble? Exactly what did he do to help the insane dot-com bubble? I can tell you how he broke it. Attacking Microsoft. That day can be traced back to the beginning of the bubble popping.
     
  16. IDupedInMyPants

    IDupedInMyPants Banned

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    The measurement of unemployment itself underaccounts for actual unemployment. If we go down this road everyone's arguments on both sides are completely unsupportable.

    Do you think 2.7 million people lost their jobs and suddenly became successful at-home businessmen thanks to Sally Struthers or something?
     
  17. Squeezle

    Squeezle IncGamers Member

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    You do realize that the President doesn't have such a great effect on the economy, right? A lot of these problems were caused years before Bush was appointed President.
     
  18. Damascus

    Damascus IncGamers Member

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    So the government can't change the economy? This would be news to me.
     
  19. toader

    toader Banned

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    No, the way Smeg stated it made it NOT misleading. If they said the US had 16 million unemployed while Germany only had 4, France only 2.5, and Russia only 6 million. THATS misleading.

    You cant look at raw numbers, you have to looks a % when compared to the total sample. We have more people unemployed because we have ALLLLOT more people in our country than they do.

    You know what argument it reminds ME of: when people say we have the largest national deficit ever. Well, guess what, we do have the largest $$ amount of deficit ever. BUT, if you look at the $$ amount deficit we have and compare it to out GNP, you will get a % of how much the deficit is. And guess what...magically...this is NOT the highest % deficit we have ever had, nowhere even close.

    You have to look at % based on the sample. You cannot just compare raw numbers...that is faulty.
     
  20. toader

    toader Banned

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    The government can direct the economy, thats about all. Its like a living thing, you cant just change it on a whim.
     

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