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Is more than 300 MF a waste?

Discussion in 'Diablo 2 Community Forum' started by pliu, Oct 4, 2006.

  1. pliu

    pliu Banned

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    Is more than 300 MF a waste?

    Is more than 300 MF a waste? Say you want to find a CoA.

    The best way for me is run LVL 85 area. Because kill 2.6 mlvl88 uniques in LVL 85 area will have the same drop rate as kiil baal(H) one time. from the data of ATMA , there is no big different in drop rate for MF 300/400/500

    Data from ATMA:
    drop rate Crown of age. SP

    1 : 45526 Baal - [H] The WorldStone Chamber - {mlvl 99}
    1 : 118682 Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **} 0 MF

    1 : 26616 Baal - [H] The WorldStone Chamber - {mlvl 99} 100 MF
    1 : 69409 Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **}

    1 : 21578 Baal - [H] The WorldStone Chamber - {mlvl 99} 200 MF
    1 : 56255 Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **}

    1 : 19301 Baal - [H] The WorldStone Chamber - {mlvl 99} 300 MF
    1 : 50298 Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **}


    1 : 17990 Baal - [H] The WorldStone Chamber - {mlvl 99} 400 MF
    1 : 46913 Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **}

    1 : 17115 Baal - [H] The WorldStone Chamber - {mlvl 99} 500MF
    1 : 44617 Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **}


    Bone Warrior - [H] Pit Level 1 - {mlvl **}

    Kills Total save Per 100MF save MF save%
    118682 0
    69409 49273 49273 100 41.52%
    56255 62427 13154 200 18.95%
    50298 68384 5957 300 10.59%
    46913 71769 3385 400 6.73%
    44617 74065 2296 500 4.89%
     
  2. kuafu

    kuafu IncGamers Member

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    Basically 300MF increases your chance of finding unique item by 136%, and 400MF 153%, so the relative increase is 253% vs. 236%, roughly 7%.
    If you achieved this extra 100MF by socketing your items with Ist/PTopaz or taking on more 7mfsc, your killing speed is not changed at all, so it doesn't hurt at all. If you decide to replace these items with Jewels/Runes/Charms that give you higher damage to kill 7% faster, you can do that too.
     
  3. BloZ

    BloZ IncGamers Member

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    Actually, the MF% itself will still increase, but if you overload yourself with MF gear, you'll be slowed down. Let's say with 300% you kill Mephisto in two minutes. You add 50% MF and still kill him in two minutes. That just increases. But if you get 500% and you now take 5 minutes to kill Mephisto, it's a waste indeed.

    So no, it isn't a waste, as long as you don't get slowed down by too much.

    edit: Wow! Posted the same minute! :shocked:
     
  4. pliu

    pliu Banned

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    I run into this question is becuase I want to decide my MF items for my Summor necro.
    I use this set up except weapon:

    74% P topaz shako
    nigma BP
    change guard
    30% nig
    gold wrap
    40% gheed
    22% MF amulet(+1 necro skill) will replace with +3 summon MF amulet
    some MF sc

    total about 350MF

    for weapon
    I can use Arm of King Leoric, HOTO or gull for 100MF

    what I think gull is bad idea here for 100 more MF.
     
  5. kuafu

    kuafu IncGamers Member

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    A summoner relies on the summoned army to kill. The stats of a skeleton (or any other summon type) is determined by your skill level when it is summoned, and will not change afterwards when you switch weapons (although the number of summons will change due to skill level change). So I think the best plan for you is to summon your ammy with +skill items like AoKL/Hoto, and then switch weapon to use Gull afterwards (maybe a 4-ist monarch as well). This way, you can take advantage of both.
     
  6. mumba

    mumba Banned

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    No its not a waste, the more the better.

    What is a waste tho is if more mf will reduce ur killing speed. Remember how magic finding works (mf + lots of monsters killed). If u have 1000mf but u can only kill 2 monsters a minute thats a waste. If u have 300mf but can kill 20 times faster than the 1000mf guy then u will find a lot more.

    So get as much mf, and still make sure u can clear areas relatively fast. Like I said before, its better to kill more monsters with medium mf than few monsters with huge mf.
     
  7. jag

    jag IncGamers Member

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    MF depends on your situation. If you are running solo you need to balance safety and kill speed against your mf. If you cant survive or you feel like you are killing to slow what good is 500 mf? Most people seem to balance a solo mf character at around 300-400 mf.

    I have had some of my best finds with mf only from enigma and a shako (about 140mf) on my key runner. That char has killed literally millions of monsters so just by sheer numbers i increased my chances for a good drop.

    But crazy high mf can work too -- I have a trapper with nearly 800 mf on-- even with fade i only have 14 all res and really crap damage on my traps. I really cant solo too much safely or effectively. I use this character with friends. They do all the killing in baal runs and knock baal down to nothing letting me get last hit on him. No guarentee of great results but its an increased chance at least
     
  8. Merick

    Merick IncGamers Member

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    I think it would be pretty odd if 300 -> 400%mf didn't mean at least 7% slower killing speed. As for who said ptopaz and ists won't reduce your killing speed: it will slow you down, it means no facets or ed% jewels. For melee characters mf charms means less +max damage charms, for casters it means less +skill charms.
     
  9. kuafu

    kuafu IncGamers Member

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    This is how I look at this problem:
    You base should be your gears with no socketed items, and no charms. That is the base for both your MF and killing speed.
    With that base, you have two routes:
    1) Socket everything with Ist/PTopaz, and put on many 7mfsc. In this case, you get X% increase in MF, but no change in killing speed.
    2) Socket everything with Facets/Jewels, and put on charms that make you kill faster. In this case, you get Y% increase in killing speed, but no change in MF.
    Considering the end MF result as a product of MF and killing speed, you should pick the route depending on whether X is bigger than Y or not.
    Specific to OT's question about her summoner build, route 2 almost gives nothing to the killing speed of the summoned army, so route 1 is better in this case.
     
  10. PFS

    PFS IncGamers Member

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    I'd agree most of the time - particulary for sorcs where each facet will increase your damage/killing speed by a minimum of 6%.

    I think however this is one case where that does not hold though - summon necros don't get any benefit from increased damage jewels - they only benefit from surviveability with dr/ed/stats/resists.
     
  11. Merick

    Merick IncGamers Member

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    Yeah, that's true. I suppose wind druids (except for the cold damage on hurricane), druid summoners, bone necros, warcry barbs, hammerdins, and trappers as well.
     
  12. Gorny

    Gorny Banned

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    Back when I used to play, I used to follow the "More MF is Always Better" mentality. - As long as you don't sacrifice killing ability of surviveability for MF.
     
  13. garion

    garion IncGamers Member

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    i think more MF is always *not* useless....however like gorny said you have to keep in mind your kill speed and vulnerabilities....i suppose 300mf is a nice target to aim for as long as you aren't sacraficing too much...
     
  14. vdzele

    vdzele IncGamers Member

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    yes 300-400 is enough.

    My younger friend had a ~900mf sorc for which he said it's uber mf. I think it was just an opinion of a child who can barely count to 100.

    I made this same kind of topic 3 years ago on this same forum, trust me nothing has change since then, 300 is ok. 900 can barely be noticeable
     
  15. lagalot

    lagalot IncGamers Member

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    My mentality also, as long as Im killing at a decent speed Id much rather have 700mf than 300.Especially when yellow diadems or coronas drop when your running 300mf:shocked: its the what if I had 700mf factor that gets me..
     
  16. BluzMan

    BluzMan Banned

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    Well, I think the author pretty much understands the more mf/killing speed dependancy, so I could say yes, 300 is a very good point to shoot at. For many character builds this is exactly the number when killing speed starts to outweigh MF gains.
     

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