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Instability?

Discussion in 'Wizard' started by gerhard, Jan 5, 2010.

  1. gerhard

    gerhard IncGamers Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 6, 2010
  2. Kingu

    Kingu IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Reminding from some thread here, it may by something along with: More you cast more vulnerable you are, in one way of another.
    Similar to Warhammer Online system.
     
  3. trashX

    trashX IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    "more vunerable and more blasty"

    probably something like this: the more consecutive casts you do, the more damage you deal, with a peak that you can probably increase with a passive.
    also after a certain percentage has gone up you probably start dealing damage to yourself, or a sort of debuff.
     
  4. Cogo

    Cogo IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Right, I didn't see this thread before I made Instability.

    I have just written down my own theories though. Feel free to fill it up or clarify my ideas, and that reference to WAR is also cool!

    Edit:
    BTW, this is my first post on Diii.net :)
     
  5. Leugi

    Leugi IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Sounds interesting...

    I don't know if any of you guys ever played Freedom Force? A character in there named Man-Bot although slow is supposed to be quite unstable when it comes to energy stuff. He is really powerful, yet his power is hard to control. So, something like that might be what we get for the Wizzy.
     
  6. Dyuu

    Dyuu IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Yesh indeed, it directly got me to think about the Dark Elf Sorceresses of Warhammer online.

    For those of you who are unfamiliar with this, the more these characters cast their spells, they build up something called "Dark Magic" (which could be somewhat close to instability). As this builds up, their crit chance gradually increases, but as does the probability for their spells to backfire, causing the same damage to themselves. At max I believe it's something like 50% chance of crit/50% chance of backfire.

    WAR uses a 2-resource system for all their characters. Everyone has action points which charge up over time, and one other resource to their disposal depending on their class. This is what they use to cast their spells, that in turn build up Dark magic. They can then release their Dark Magic through a number of devastating abilities. This however would kind of make it an infinite resource if you take the action points out of the equation.

    I don't think Blizzard would go for something like that (Just my personal guess), but the word instability got me thinking about it right away, and the Dark magic-concept sounds like it could be altered into something instability-like.


     
  7. Shnissigah

    Shnissigah IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    I like trash's idea. Not only would it make you want to use your spells more wisely, but would also add more of an epic feel to it...

    Picture:

    You're wandering around, doing your questing or farming or what have you, when you run into a unique monster. You dispose of the minions effortlessly, but can't seem to get in enough damage in short bursts to keep your health high while still being able to overcome his regen. Finally, you give in and say "**** it." The creature charges. You hold your ground and start casting disintegrate on him. After a few seconds, your health starts draining, lightning arcing from your body, sparks flying from your outstretched hands. Suddenly, it becomes a damage race, and it starts getting hard to tell who's killing you faster: the monster or yourself. Finally, the monster bursts into a cloud of still-warm ash. You take a deep breath and say "GOD that was intense!" followed by the triumphant chugging of a health pot.
     
  8. Sass

    Sass IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Hmmm, it kinda makes her feel like a glass cannon, even with the armor skills. I kinda like it.
     
  9. Khan

    Khan IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    That's what Jay wanted, to make her more blasty and a bigger class cannon. Atleast thats what he said in one of his interviews.


     
  10. Leord

    Leord IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Very cool initiative. Nice to see others have helped out as well...

    Welcome to Diii.net btw :)


     
  11. Flux

    Flux Administrator

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    Re: Instability?

    I doubt we'll see instability draining the Wiz's own hps. I suppose it's possible; a few D1 spells and Sacrifice / Blood Golem could work that way in D2, but it doesn't seem the style of D3.

    From what Jay said in the interview I did with him (quoted on the Insta page), he hates the mage to run out of mana. Says that's no fun. So I'm guessing that actually running out will be (virtually) impossible. Wizards will always have enough to cast spells, and they won't be able to kill themselves doing so. So what's the benefit/detriment, then?

    Start slower speed/lower damage, and they increase with consecutive use/accuracy? I think they'll want to reward wizards for fast action and using lots of spells. We'll be doing something to endanger our character, but I don't think it would be something as simple as steady life drain or potential self-damage. Maybe increasing +damage from any hit you take? Sort of a feedback system there, but only dangerous if you actually get hit. Skillful player can ride the lightning and boost damage, without taking penalty.
     
  12. Wheeze

    Wheeze IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    That was my impression too. The orb fills like barbarians fury with spell usage and when you pass milestones, eg. 20/40/60/80%, you gain more damage but take more damage from enemies too. Falling off again when you stop casting. That wouldn't be a resource as such though, so I'm very prepared to be wrong.

    I think it would end up being pretty lame overall if it was something like, spells do more damage but you have a chance of getting some unexpected spell. Dying because you go spectral blades instead of a defensive skill like nova or teleport would just be frustrating.


     
  13. rrrrathmaberollinhisrs

    rrrrathmaberollinhisrs IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    I think it's as simple as your spells do less damage and are less effective with more instability, which builds up with casting. If it just made your more vulnerable that disadvantage would disappear when played by a careful or skilled character or when partying with a good tank. OP cries would start immediately I'd think.

    And I agree that having different spells pop up would be absolutely insane. Sorcs don't have much life so feedback damage in the form of life-drain would be stupid as well.

    I'm having a thought - maybe it follows a curve? Slow at first so as to be useful... but the longer it goes the faster it increases so, like the Barb, you're encourage to be aggressive because the longer an encounter goes on the faster your Instability rises and when it peaks... COOLDOWN! (Nooooo) Can't cast for a bit and have to run away. Orrr maybe thaaat's when it makes you vulnerable.
     
  14. Sass

    Sass IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    O.O That milestone thing gave me a wicked thought: What if 100% instable equates to a small frenzy. At least some lash-out as an attack. After all, the more instable one grows, the more I guess crazed the person is. It'd be neat :p


     
  15. Gamekk

    Gamekk IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    However it will work, It greatly increase my interests toward that class. It felt it was indeed very bad after you ran out of mana, but I only played a wizard at level 13 so it might get better at higher levels. But being able to cast spells anytime (or without having to wait until after you're dead) will make everything more balanced for that character.
     
  16. DivineSweety

    DivineSweety IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    If the idea behind it is that she will never go ''OOM'' then i think we have a balancing issue because the other melee heroes will sooner or later go low on hp but a good wizard player can just go ''on and on and on and on'' ? eventualy making her the best mf class to go to again ?

    yes im comparing wiz and sorc
     
  17. Zeek

    Zeek IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    I like the sheer power idea behind the wizard. I'm all for making her more powerful at the expense of survivability. Seems like skill will play a huge role in keeping her alive.

    We'll need to know a lot more about instability and the punishment for dying.

    I could see instability doing something like lowering your resistances or defense the more you cast after a certain point. The problem is that it will have to be a timed effect. So, after a big boss battle or something won't that mean most people will go to town or just sit around waiting for the negative effects to wear off? That's kind of boring.

    Oh well, gotta wait and see what Blizzard has in mind. I'm definitely interested.
     
  18. Chorkstain

    Chorkstain IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    Something where the Wizard's spells cause tiny rifts to appear around her, and she can tap into them to access greater spell power, but each time she gets hit, there is a chance for each rift that she has to explode, dealing damage to her. So if you have many rifts around you, and you get hit by a stray arrow, there's a chance that a few of them will explode and you will take a lot of damage, in addition to the initial attack.

    I think I heard Blizzard saying something about having visual feedback to accompany the Wizard's mana system, and I think a bunch of unstable energy void-things around her would do nicely.

    She could even have a bunch of rift related spells...
     
  19. pcguy

    pcguy IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    I'm going to focus on the word, "blasty" that Jay Wilson was using. What this could mean is:
    A) an increased cast rate
    B) More spell damage
    C) Larger spell radius
    D) Longer spell duration
    E) Additional spell effects (Higher chance to freeze, stun, slow)

    Now let us focus on the word vulnerable:
    A) Penalty to defense or block
    B) Penalty to run/walk speed or to hit recovery
    C) Increased chance to be stunned or slowed by an enemy attack
    D) Lowered resistances to magic
    E) Hitpoint Debuff
    D) Health Drain

    I believe the system will combine some effects from that first list with some effects in that second list. To find out what is most probable, match up a few of them and whatever looks the most promising in terms of balance is probably what it is going to be.

    I am voting for increased cast rate and damage for the buffs, and slower run speed, slower hit recovery, or a chance to get stunned during an attack for the debuff. I think this is a good combination because it would essentially hinder the wizard's ability to escape while making her extremely powerful.

    What this would mean in terms of gameplay is that there will be some wizards who will run around a lot and cast lots of small spells and other wizards who will trade that speed in to do extremely heavy damage. This system seems balanced to me because I can apply it to a similar situation in Diablo 2: Comparing a Barbarian with a sword and shield and Concentrate to a Barbarian with Berserk and a huge maul. One will do very steady damage and not be vulnerable while the other will do extremely large amounts of damage and be extremely vulnerable.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2010
  20. Grumpy Old Wizard

    Grumpy Old Wizard IncGamers Member

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    Re: Instability?

    I assume wizards will have the fewest hit points of any class. We'll have to see if Blizzard can implement a spell casting system that makes an already fragile class even more fragile but still playable without dying. It is not going to be fun if you have to stop casting spells and retreat to an area you have already cleared to let the penalties go down so you won't die.

    I really don't like the idea of making it dangerous for the wizard to cast his spells but we'll see what the final system looks like.
     

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