Immunities - Strategy and Tactics

Psychic Watch

Diabloii.Net Member
Immunities - Strategy and Tactics

"Dealing with every character's worst nightmare."


Suppose we have a mod situation where any monster can spawn with a random immunity or resistance, in addition to their natural resistances. Monsters also appear in much more random locations. Parking or skipping areas is not an option.


Which solo-character/items combination would have the best chance of dealing with any potential immunes?


Consider the following monster bonuses:

F/C/L Enchanted: +75% resist to that element
Magic Resistant: +40% F/C/L resist
Mana Burn: +75% Magic resist
Spectral Hit: +20% F/C/L resist
Stone Skin: +80% Physical resist



So for example, the famed Wailing Beasts skipped by Hammerdins far and wide. They have a natural 50% Physical, 100% Magical, and 75% fire resistance.

Let's say we encounter a boss Wailing Beast with Mana Burn, Stone Skin, Fire Enchanted. The random immunity tacked on is Lightning. This gives 3 unbreakable immunities (Physical, Fire, Magic) and a fourth reduced to 70% at best. Your friend, the BlizzSorc, is on holiday along with all the cold mages and rogues.


Chipping away with your 6-Sapphire Long Battle Bow might do the trick in this case. But what about any other worst-case-scenario combinations?
 

Milb

Diabloii.Net Member
Open Wounds. :grin:
Indeed, that's what I was going to post when I read it :smiley: I never really used it before but I found it invaluable when playing my Bowazon who had no other source of damage when the enemy was an unbreakable PI.



 

chumley669

Diabloii.Net Member
Interesting topic, and I'd love to hear other viewpoints. I've been thinking long and hard about this because of my pure Blizzsorc. She annhilates anything non-cold immune, but it's the other 33% of the critters that give her fits. She's at Lvl 82 right now, camped out at the River of Flame, shaking in her shoes at the thought of taking on the CI Oblivion Knights. Taking on the immunities is an interesting topic, indeed.

And where are these Wailing Beasts???? I just started a Hammerdin, seemed like everyone else had one (moo!), and I haven't found those things yet.
 

Thyiad

Moderator Single Player, D2 Assassin, Barbarian
In one of the temples in Kuraust. Upper/Lower/Bazaar somewhere round there. I imagine you'll find them. :evil:
 

kabal

Diabloii.Net Member
Blessed Hammer ignores Demon/Undead resists, and I remember RTB saying that Mana Burn magic resist doesn't affect magic damage anyways. AFAIK there's no combination of mods in the game that could make anything non-Wailing Beast resistant to BH. In the end it boils down to finding a new way to kill Wailing Beasts and then slaughtering everything else with hammer as usual.

So to answer your question, I say regular hammerdin with 1 point Vengeance, an eBotD zerker, Gores for OW, and an Act 2 Might merc carrying Infinity. Substitute Infinity for a hard point in Conviction on the hammerdin and eBotD zerker for the highest damage weapon available if neither of the two are available to you.

Edit: I suspect that's not a very interesting or innovative answer, but given the current game mechanics I'm fairly certain it's the best one.
 

Milb

Diabloii.Net Member
A related question: How come Pindle when Lightning Enchanted is not always Lightning Immune? Say If he spawns LE and CE, does it pick an immunity randomly?
 

Psychic Watch

Diabloii.Net Member
So as long as at least one damage type can hurt the monster, it will trigger Open Wounds? How long would it take to bring down any given mob relying just on that?


kabal said:
Blessed Hammer ignores Demon/Undead resists, and I remember RTB saying that Mana Burn magic resist doesn't affect magic damage anyways. AFAIK there's no combination of mods in the game that could make anything non-Wailing Beast resistant to BH. In the end it boils down to finding a new way to kill Wailing Beasts and then slaughtering everything else with hammer as usual.
Those were my thoughts as well - that the main concern for a Hammerdin would be encountering any pack of animal monsters (non-demon/undead) with the Magic Immunity added on.

I didn't know that about Mana Burn, do you recall the reason it doesn't affect damage? How badly does Mana Burn affect ability to cast BH?


Avenger might work - is there anything they'd have trouble with? Something like a Spectral Hit, Magic Resistant, Stone Skin with Poison Immune added on?



Milb said:
A related question: How come Pindle when Lightning Enchanted is not always Lightning Immune? Say If he spawns LE and CE, does it pick an immunity randomly?

Hell Pindle should be Lightning Immune in that case since 33% LR is the base in Hell for "Reanimated Horde" types, +75% for the enchanted, if I'm reading monstats.txt right.
 

kabal

Diabloii.Net Member
Since 1.10 monsters can have at most 2 immunities, although they can be highly resistant to more. In Milb's example, Pindle is naturally poison immune, so he can't be both LI and CI even if he spawns LE and CE. I don't know how the game picks which element gets the immunity in those cases though.

@Psychic Watch: Mana burn instantly drains the entire bulb, but it's really only mana burn snakes that pose a problem for hammerdins with their autohit charge attacks.
 

aidennz

Diabloii.Net Member
Avenger might work - is there anything they'd have trouble with? Something like a Spectral Hit, Magic Resistant, Stone Skin with Poison Immune added on?
That would probably be the only thing. To shut down a well equiped avenger it would need to be C/L/F immune and physical immune and then the avenger could have passion on switch(grants berserk).



 

Crazy Runner Guy

Diabloii.Net Member
That would probably be the only thing. To shut down a well equiped avenger it would need to be C/L/F immune and physical immune and then the avenger could have passion on switch(grants berserk).
Thus it is impossible to shut down an avenger. Nothing can be immune to their attack.

crg



 

RTB

Diabloii.Net Member
F/C/L Enchanted: +75% resist to that element
Magic Resistant: +40% F/C/L resist
Mana Burn: +20% Magic resist
Spectral Hit: No effect on resists
Stone Skin: +50% Physical resist
kabal said:
Blessed Hammer ignores Demon/Undead resists, and I remember RTB saying that Mana Burn magic resist doesn't affect magic damage anyways. AFAIK there's no combination of mods in the game that could make anything non-Wailing Beast resistant to BH. In the end it boils down to finding a new way to kill Wailing Beasts and then slaughtering everything else with hammer as usual.
I can't remember ever saying that. Magic resist affects magic dmg, but for BH/HB it doesn't matter as much because they ignore the magic resist of demons/undead.

Since 1.10 monsters can have at most 2 immunities, although they can be highly resistant to more. In Milb's example, Pindle is naturally poison immune, so he can't be both LI and CI even if he spawns LE and CE. I don't know how the game picks which element gets the immunity in those cases though.
There's a fixed order in which the game sets immunities, innate immunities are always kept however. But I'm afraid I can't remember the order atm.
Something else to note is that if a monster would have 3 immunities or more, only the first two in the order are kept as immunity and the other boni that would've caused the other resistances to go over 100% are discarded.

Psychic Watch: That's a weird one. Hell Witches are normally only immune to Cold, with just 25% physical resist. If they really were PI, something got corrupted, otherwise it's just a display bug.



 

Drystan

Diabloii.Net Member
Psychic Watch said:
F/C/L Enchanted: +75% resist to that element
Magic Resistant: +40% F/C/L resist
Mana Burn: +20% Magic resist
Spectral Hit: No effect on resists
Stone Skin: +50% Physical resist
Here is the Arreat Summit which states monster bonuses.
Spectral Hit:

Fire Resist: +20%
Lightning Resistance: +20%
Cold Resistance: +20%
Chance to Hit: x2
...
Spectral Hit does have an influence on resistances.
 

Toppo

Diabloii.Net Member
Psychic Watch: That's a weird one. Hell Witches are normally only immune to Cold, with just 25% physical resist. If they really were PI, something got corrupted, otherwise it's just a display bug.
Or a mod :wink3:



 

xGDx

Diabloii.Net Member
I am recently returned to Diablo2 'cause I always had the itch to try a Paladin Ranger build. With the advent of synergies a while back, I have finally come around to trying my build again.

It revolves around using both the lightning aura and the cold aura at max, with some points in the resists for synergy purposes, and about half spent up on the fire aura with some spending on the resists as well.

So I can dish out physical, cold, lightning, and fire without any issue, and since all I use are those auras and I never switch off my bow, I use mana for absolutely nothing so mana burn means nothing to my Ranger.

I am up to Meph in Hell and so far so good. Mainly its only really fast creatures or creatures that are very hard to hit that give me trouble as I cannot keep them off me.

Now if only I could re-spend my skills to take out some mistakenly spent points I would be set...but alas, probably just need to level a new Ranger once I am sure exactly what I want the build to be.

Anywho, a bit different take on how to deal with multiple resistences in the later stages of the game.
 

Psychic Watch

Diabloii.Net Member
@RTB: As Toppo said, it's the mod adding an extra random immunity to every monster. Most monster packs are quite diverse as a result.

F/C/L Enchanted: +75% resist to that element
Magic Resistant: +40% F/C/L resist
Mana Burn: +20% Magic resist
Spectral Hit: No effect on resists
Stone Skin: +50% Physical resist
That's what I get for trusting Arreat Summit. :duh: Is that updated info from a particular .txt file, or is it hard-coded?


@xGDx: Ranged, elemental, no-mana attacks would be a big help - any thoughts on what you'd use for crowd control in a rebuild? Mobs can reach insane proportions in the mod.
 

xGDx

Diabloii.Net Member
Crowd control for my Ranger comes in many forms since there is no one good way to do it.

At a basic level you have the fastest rate of attack I can muster plus knock back, slowly moving the mouse in arcs across the mob to knock em back.

Secondly I have a defiance act2 merc that pretends their a Valkarie, which helps somewhat.

I craft pretty heavily, so eventually I hope to end up with knockback gloves with +20IAS and charges of multi-shot for short burst crowd control. Got the knockback IAS already, but will take a bit to get that to combine with some nice charges of multi-shot.

I also craft the hitpower Amulets that add a percent chance for monster to flee. Might look into other ways to get that off items.

Finally I use items with charges of Attract when things get really dicey. Throw attract on a few towards the back and/or side of the mob which can often buy me enough time to slim down the mobs.

There is definetly no one great way to crowd control with my build, but with an assortment of tricks I do alright. Now if only conversion worked off a bow. :wink2:
 
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