Hot-button issues!

DPH

Diabloii.Net Member
Hot-button issues!

Source

A lot of state amendments were voted on, not just candidates.

The winners:
abortion :grin:
gay marriage (kind of)
stem-cell research :grin:

The losers:
marijuana :cry: guess the people aren't ready yet
affirmative action :grin:
 

Gertlex

Banned
Source

A lot of state amendments were voted on, not just candidates.

The winners:
abortion :grin:
gay marriage (kind of)
stem-cell research :grin:

The losers:
marijuana :cry: guess the people aren't ready yet
affirmative action :grin:
U of Michigan students voted 75.69% for affirmative action. I was one of those. I for one don't have any problems with affirmative action and I don't care too much about the specific effect it has on admissions here.



 

Star Dust

Diabloii.Net Member
And I voted for stem cell research. I actually heard much more opposition to the amendment than support, so I didn't think it would pass. Glad it did.
 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
Am I the only person on earth who's pro-abortion but opposed to stem cell research?

I wouldn't get too excited about the abortion one - that law was ridiculous, put forward by extremists who overestimated their chances. It made no exceptions for health or rape, remember. Even Bush came out against it. And it STILL got 44% in favour! Appalling.

And as for gay marriage, the only one that voted against the ban rather than for was one in which heterosexuals had been convinced that the law would also affect their health benefits. I think it's pretty messed up that an issue of human rights would be put to a popular vote in the first place.
 

EliManning

Diabloii.Net Member
I wouldn't call gay marriage a winner. Only Arizona shot down a ban and they already have a law banning it anyway. And the stem cell victory comes with a cloning ban bundled in. We've made some progress but I think we're still losing some important state-level human rights battles.
 
Gay is just wrong... It's unnatural. A man is paired with a woman. Adam with Eve, Bush with Laura, Bill with Hillary (+ more). Even the Bible speaks out against homosexuality. As an avid Christian I say gay is WRONG.
 

Merick

Diabloii.Net Member
Gay is just wrong... It's unnatural. A man is paired with a woman. Adam with Eve, Bush with Laura, Bill with Hillary (+ more). Even the Bible speaks out against homosexuality. As an avid Christian I say gay is WRONG.
So animals never engage in homosexual activites? Or humans should only act in "natural" ways and stop this agriculture business?



 
So animals never engage in homosexual activites? Or humans should only act in "natural" ways and stop this agriculture business?
I'm a christian...

Animals are animals. They have no soul. God commanded humans to live in a certain way and thats the way I live. I can't say I have room for your opinion because... I'm a christian. If I went against my own religion...



 

Merick

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm a christian...

Animals are animals. They have no soul. God commanded humans to live in a certain way and thats the way I live. I can't say I have room for your opinion because... I'm a christian. If I went against my own religion...
If that is your view because of your religion, that's fine, just don't try to drag "natural" into it.
Edit- I could also say that Naruto encourages occult behavior.



 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
Never get sick of this.

Gay is just wrong... It's unnatural.
Not true, it has been recorded right across the animal kingdom.

A man is paired with a woman. Adam with Eve, Bush with Laura, Bill with Hillary (+ more).
I could assemble a list of real and fictional homosexual couples too.

Even the Bible speaks out against homosexuality. As an avid Christian I say gay is WRONG.
Do you take the Bible's word for everything? Example: if my child is disobedient and I kill him/her, would you say that's okay?

If not, then you need more justification for thinking something is right or wrong than "because the Bible says so".



 
So animals never engage in homosexual activites? Or humans should only act in "natural" ways and stop this agriculture business?
First of all there is only one animal on earth that is fully 'gay', some sort of lizard that basically clones itself, but has to have another lizard stimulate it.

Second, Adam was told by God he had domain and to take care of the Earth. Adam was told it was ok to farm/hunt.



 
Never get sick of this.



Not true, it has been recorded right across the animal kingdom.



I could assemble a list of real and fictional homosexual couples too.



Do you take the Bible's word for everything? Example: if my child is disobedient and I kill him/her, would you say that's okay?

If not, then you need more justification for thinking something is right or wrong than "because the Bible says so".
The bible is a guide to how to live... not all of it is to be taken literal. But there is no other way to translate "GAY IS WRONG."



 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
I'm a christian...

Animals are animals. They have no soul. God commanded humans to live in a certain way and thats the way I live.
Ah, then you don't mean "natural" at all. After all, God is commanding us to act in a way we wouldn't otherwise - ie, an unnatural way.

I can't say I have room for your opinion because... I'm a christian. If I went against my own religion...
I bet I could find plenty of things your religion tells you to do that you don't, or tells you not to do that you do. Almost everyone chooses which parts of their religion they obey and which they conveniently ignore, and they're all responsible therefore for the ones they do choose to obey.

Hell, even if you follow it to the letter (which would probably make you a monster if not a criminal) you're still responsible for choosing the religion in the first place. You can't say "it's wrong because my religion says so" because the question then becomes "how do you justify your choice of religion?".



 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
The bible is a guide to how to live... not all of it is to be taken literal. But there is no other way to translate "GAY IS WRONG."
You'd be very surprised.

1) There is intense debate over whether Paul is referring to homosexuality or temple prostitution in the passage you're thinking of (as far as I know, there is only that one in the New Testament), because of uncertainties about the translation and the relative cultural climate of the time. I'll also point out to you that Jesus never once mentioned homosexuality, only Paul who is human and therefore fallible.

2) How can you take this:

Deuteronomy 21:18-21 said:
18: If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:
19: Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;
20: And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.
21: And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.
non-literally?



 

Dondrei

Diabloii.Net Member
Why are you opposed to stem cell research?

Btw, good luck with the theist.
I don't think we're ready for it (hell, I don't think we will be in the forseeable future). There are just way too many possibilities for abuse, it is the greatest power humanity has yet discovered (except maybe nuclear power), and the temptation to cure illnesses and things just seems like a dreadful temptation to me.



 
Ah, then you don't mean "natural" at all. After all, God is commanding us to act in a way we wouldn't otherwise - ie, an unnatural way.



I bet I could find plenty of things your religion tells you to do that you don't, or tells you not to do that you do. Almost everyone chooses which parts of their religion they obey and which they conveniently ignore, and they're all responsible therefore for the ones they do choose to obey.

Hell, even if you follow it to the letter (which would probably make you a monster if not a criminal) you're still responsible for choosing the religion in the first place. You can't say "it's wrong because my religion says so" because the question then becomes "how do you justify your choice of religion?".
100's of christian hymns proclaim of how we are sinners and how we are not worthy. I might not follow it rule by rule... but it definently crosses my mind like no other person. I read stories of great christian men (Jim Elliot, Nate Saint, Pete Flemming, C.S. Lewis) and wonder... I always want to prove my worth... in the real world, in diablo, in wherever. Then I see that I might just want to prove my worth to God. 100's of christian hymns proclaim of how we are sinners and how we are not worthy

The Old Testament has punishment FAR more severe than the New Testament. The God of the old testament has been proclaimed as as many things including homophobic, machochistic, and one of the most cruel cretures in all of literature. But that is the same God in the new testament. The new testament gives us more revelation... more light on the gospel. We are able to understand it better. The Old speaks in riddles while the new speaks in a more direct manner.



 

RevenantsKnight

Diabloii.Net Member
Gay is just wrong... It's unnatural. A man is paired with a woman. Adam with Eve, Bush with Laura, Bill with Hillary (+ more). Even the Bible speaks out against homosexuality. As an avid Christian I say gay is WRONG.
And as another who would call himself a Christian, I believe that, under Jesus's teachings, a sin should not blind you to the point where you cannot love the sinner.

Do you really think that proclaiming "gay is WRONG" on an internet forum is a way of loving homosexuals? Personally, I would think that you would do better to sit down and talk to someone face to face so you can exchange viewpoints in a respectful manner, as opposed to stirring the proverbial pot with words that you should know would be provocative.



 
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