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here we go again...

Discussion in 'Single Player Forum' started by Tarr, Jun 18, 2005.

  1. Tarr

    Tarr IncGamers Member

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    here we go again...

    Yep. I'm complaining again.

    Pretty much the same old story too. I played the paladin some more today, and I decided I was sick of the pit. So, I tried the Glacial Trail, had to flee, no chance. Tried WSK, likewise, no chance, not worth my time to try. Tried River of Flame, and quaffed a few belts full of Big Grape Juices to make about half a million exp moving halfway through the place (I wanted to try running Hephaesto.) Went back to the pit, blew through it with ease.

    I'm sick of the pit.

    I'm sick of my paladin sucking, while my ubermunchkin sorc (negative resists, base en/dex/barely enough str for eq) has a merry old time killing anything.

    I'm sick of playing the ubermunchkin sorc, I don't mind MFing with her because a complaint I've had with the game since day one is the sorc is about a thousand times superior to any other class for MFing (I know I'm going to get disputes over this, but don't bother. The fishy is slower, period and the hammerdin can't teleport or go to places with narrow passages as well.)

    I'm sick of trying to do anything differently than what is the accepted norm, only to realize that the character is pretty much a waste in most of hell difficulty because I dared to do something different in a Blizzard game.

    Rant over. Flame on.
     
  2. Nightfish

    Nightfish IncGamers Member

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    Your point is...?

    If you wanted input on your char you should give less information. It's too easy if we only have to guess between all the possible paladin builds. ;)

    Oh yeah, I dispute that the sorc is the best char for running the WS K. She takes the cake when it comes to meph but not when it comes to baal.
     
  3. cryist

    cryist IncGamers Member

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    Couldn't agree more there and don't forget a sorc is good for Countess runs..
     
  4. Slartibartfast

    Slartibartfast IncGamers Member

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    Why not?... my sorc is still my fastest / most mf-carrying char to run baal with, and in safety only second to my fishymancer
     
  5. slappy sam

    slappy sam IncGamers Member

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    A well equipped sorc with a well equipped merc is probably the fastest almost everywhere...

    I suppose that your paladin is melee if your having a difficult time?
     
  6. water_moon

    water_moon IncGamers Member

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    Try the catacombs, I find they're not to bad w/ my melee barbs. Yuo could always try a barb, yeah, he's melee, but he can item find the corpses for extra goodies.
     
  7. farting bob

    farting bob Banned

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    You really cant get enough barbs can you WM? I hope Goltar doesnt feel too threatened, he's not quite got the battle-hardened barbarian physique has he? Anyway, IMO barbs arent the best MFers. Sure, they can hork bodies, but they are slower and can can less MF than the standard MFing builds.
     
  8. Thirty-Thirty

    Thirty-Thirty IncGamers Member

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    Tarr, you don't seem to be enjoying the characters that you're playing. That's going to be a problem, no matter where you go. The only reason my sorceress is Level 90 is because I enjoy her the most of all my characters. Playing with her, that is. On the PC.

    As for having difficulty with nonstandard builds, something's up. You definitely can get unusual builds through Hell. Just ask Nightfish, or FartingBob, or Uzziah, or Corax. I guess a Golemancer is a bit extreme, but there are plenty of unsung possibilities.
     
  9. Tarr

    Tarr IncGamers Member

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    There are a few reasons I don't enjoy the builds. Primarily because it seems like I have to build either a fishymancer, a hammerdin, or a blizzard sorc if I ever want to reach level 99, or even come close. It seems like, with my paladin (yes, melee, primarily zealot, but maxxed conviction and vengance on switch for PIs and multiplayer) that there are things that shouldn't really hurt me too badly, but own me bad. Urdars hitting me for half my life, even though I have 35% PDR. Skeleton mages' bolts doing huge chunks of my orb despite my 40ish ln resist. I know it could be higher, but I'd think that would be at least enough to soak up more than four or five shots. My necro is a nonstandard summoner and I do enjoy playing him, though I haven't tried him in hell yet, he's basically the same build as my bnet necro was, and if anything, he should prove more effective with the slightly different skill point distribution. And my sorc, who I find most things in the game to be ridiculously easy with, on top of having 400 mf, isn't even one of the top sorc builds in 1.10 anymore. I'm sure nonstandard characters can finish hell, I've done it. It's just feeling more and more like pseudo-rpgs like Diablo 2 can't appeal to me anymore since I don't want to play the same exact character everyone else is and that's required for the highest end difficulty.
     
  10. krzyhobo

    krzyhobo IncGamers Member

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    I know what you are getting at but, frankly, it just isn't true. The only two pure 1.10 characters played by SPF members that have made it to level 99
    (that I remember off-hand) are not only not on your list of builds, but are totally different character classes. It's fairly easy to find an item with charges of teleport (the poor man's enigma) which can make a fishymancer or elemental druid capable of keeping up with virtually any sorceress for Baal runs.

    You even admit non-standard builds can finish the game but deny that they fill the requirements for "the highest end difficulty." I fail to see the distinction here.

    It is not my place to tell you how to play but maybe you're too worried about achieving particular goals. I, for one, have essentially given up grailing alltogether and play exclusively untwinked, vanilla hardcore. It's completely rejuvinated my interest in the game as I don't feel like I'm restricted at all. Every character has strengths and weaknesses and it's great fun discovering them. Relax - you're supposed to be having fun.
     
  11. FodderCannoned

    FodderCannoned IncGamers Member

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    I finally got my zealot to be my mfer, and you need a REALLY big hurty stick to kill quickly, and he still isn't as fast as my hammerdin or blizz sorc, but I enjoy playing him more, and he does baal reasonably fast at p8, minions at p6. Just takes time to get the gear for a zealot. And you do have to be more patient with melee characters, good luck and don't get frustrated. Also do MP with melee characters, they can get more exp there because the runs are faster if you want to level.
     
  12. DeathMaster

    DeathMaster IncGamers Member

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    I think I understand what Tarr feels. He can play none standard build fine, but feels they are really bad at runs and MF.

    I guess it is trade off if you play something none standard. They are meant for fun, and may lack of power to do runs.

    Couple of days ago, I patted my pally (holy shock/freeze zealot), and I wouldn't play a melee pally ever again. he is not fun, too much relay on killing power, and too fraigle. The only reason I finished him because he was so close (only ancinets and baal) to Pat. I only have to level him two more levels (to 87), and he is done for good.

    I don't even know what hell I'm saying. I guess in a nutshell, only a few cheesy build could do runs with ease, everything else aint "designed" for runs. So if something aint fun, just stop playing it (or finish it, and never touch it again).
     
  13. Tarr

    Tarr IncGamers Member

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    I can finish the game at players 1. I can't level at players 1. That's the distinction I'm getting at.
     
  14. essojay

    essojay IncGamers Member

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    There's got to be some place you can do at high players settings, even if that's just pindle. You could just run that area like crazy.

    If that doesn't suit you, there's always MP too.
     
  15. Sir Lister of Smeg

    Sir Lister of Smeg IncGamers Member

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    I've been running the Maggot Lair with Meteorb, but I'm thinking that it might not be too bad a location for an avenger either, as opposed to most places you do not get swarmed by monsters on all sides, and there are no normal fire and cold immunes, meaning that vengeance is useful. There are physical immunes however (black locusts), and I don't know whether it's breakable by conviction. There are places were zeal would be a more effective skill to use, but that just adds to suitability to your build.
    On a sidenote, there are no undead, so you can leech from every monster. I'll probably try this with my avenger who has zeal as a second skill as well. He did get through there, I just don't remember whether he ran into problems there. My sorceress has gained loads of experience there, when places like the Pit and Worldstone Keep were way too dangerous, although she could do the former at players 2, the Maggot Lair is safe to do at players 8, and I reckon the same holds for an avenger/zealot.
     
  16. LprMan

    LprMan IncGamers Member

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    If you want to get to high lvls, there is 3 options imho

    1. build some cookiecutter character
    2. get better gear so you can survive and kill on high players setting with other builds
    3. tcp/ip

    You might want to try the MP option

    It is sad but true :(
     
  17. DurfBarian

    DurfBarian IncGamers Member

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    No you didn't. You tried to make an MF character who could kill in prize-rich areas of the game. That's hardly a novel approach.
     
  18. HBeachBabe

    HBeachBabe IncGamers Member

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    Hell runs at P8 is an unrealistic expectation of all but 5 or 6 builds and those are referred to as "overpowered" for a reason. There is a reason odd builds are odd builds - because they are harder.

    Keep in mind the original design of the game: to get a character through Hell to kill Baal. MF runs and XP runs aren't really part of the design of the game, merely someting the players have done. The 1.10 patch in particular is not designed for leveling

    We've already establish that any well-built build can defeat Baal (the Wirt's leg weilding assassin Guardian) but not every build can do MF runs or kill fast at P8 solo nor should thy be able to, otherwise where would the challenge be? Best bet is to play your "odd" builds through to Baal and make Mat/pat status and then move on. Or be prepared for very slow levelingdue to lower player setting or slower killing speed.

    Not sure what you really expect us or Blizzard to do though.
     
  19. Thirty-Thirty

    Thirty-Thirty IncGamers Member

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    Couldn't agree more.

    There's shouldn't be a need for high level character. If a given character can Pat/Mat at 82, then, by implication, it can beat any area in the game, or at least those that need to be finished. I don't think there's much need to be past level 84, anyway. Some builds still have points to spend, but they can still be played anywhere.
     
  20. Tarr

    Tarr IncGamers Member

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    No, I didn't. I had always planned on using the sorc for MF and trying to level the paladin to 99. The paladin has no mf eq except a Gheed's fortune and a 1 max/20 ar/7mf small charm. I blame you for me not making that more clear.
     

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