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Help needed! Skelly Mages with 25 Skeletal Mastery Break like Glass in Normal Games!

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by core1000, Feb 6, 2004.

  1. core1000

    core1000 IncGamers Member

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    Help needed! Skelly Mages with 25 Skeletal Mastery Break like Glass in Normal Games!

    Help needed! Skelly Mages with 25 Skeletal Mastery Break like Glass in Normal Games!

    Note: Forgive me for my newbieness for this thread. This is based purely on my gaming experience in Normal Diff Games

    1) Is it me or are Skeletal Mages fragile? If they die so fast in Normal Games, wouldn't they be like paper in Hell Diff Games?

    2) Am I right to say that Skeletal Warriors are 100 times better than Skeletal Mages in terms of durability, as meatshields and damage dealers?
    I like my Skeletal Warriors but no the Mages.

    3) How can Skeletal Mages act as good Meatshields in Hell Diff Worldstone Keep when I'm teleporting around with 0% FCR?

    4) I heard that Skeletal Mages have the stats below:

    Raise Skeletal Mage
    cast on the corpse of a slain monster,
    this raises a skeleton mage that
    fights for you

    Current Skill Level: 30
    Life: 301 (Normal)
    Life: 328 (Nightmare)
    Life: 363 (Hell)
    Defense: 600
    12 skeleton magi
    Mana Cost: 37

    Are these stats correct? Doesn't Skeletal Mages' life scale up with the same Percentage like Skeletal Warriors?

    5) If Skeletal Mages do crap dmg and they aren't good meatshields, what's the use of having them?

    6) Mad Mantis, are you able to share with me your experience about how to use Skelly Mages as good meatshields and damage dealers?
    Skelly Mages AI is as bad as Revives, they run into the Frontline of Warfare and die almost immediately. They never retreat.
     
  2. Necrochild313

    Necrochild313 IncGamers Member

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    IMO skelly mages are best kept at 1 point with +skills for their effects (cold for slow, poison for PMH (if it still works)). I unsummon all fire/lightning mages upon casting.

    Do you have mage and mastery maxed? I know that the displayed life is dramatically bugged with warrior (the real life is MUCHMUCH more) it may be so with the mage. In norm they'll bite the dust if they get surrounded, I'd say mages are like stupid sorcs, if they get caught up in a monster pack that they can't kill immediately you can expect a swift death.
     
  3. gvandale

    gvandale IncGamers Member

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    Core1000:
    Necrochild pretty much stated it as easily as possible. Today (ie: 1.10) everyone is using warriors due to their high dmg and high life. Mages are a secondary (ie: backup) set of forces. I do not think in their current state, that they are viable alone which is why most people use them as 1 pointers for their warriors.

    I've never had good experiences with them, and if it wasn't for the poison/cold ones, they'd be useless in my book.

    g

    :howdy:
     
  4. Mad Mantis

    Mad Mantis D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator

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    There is a small trick in using Mages. The trick is to stop comparing them to Skellies! They work differently. They are Snipers, not Marines. You don't let a battalion of Snipers charge the enemy, right? Hell no! You use Marines. If you try to use your Mages the same way as your Skellies you'll fail.

    You can use Mages in two ways. Alone or in combo with other summons. Alone they are more easily used. This is because you can use things as Bone Walls and Bone Prisons to keep monster from harming you Mages. The curses can also be successfully employed. You can use the curse to either increase their damage or to keep them from Harm. I'm thinking DV and Attract here. Just make sure nothing can reach your Mages and they'll do fine.

    If you want to use the Skellies in Combo with your Mages things get more complicated. This is where you'll sometimes need to sacrifice a Mage or two. You'll need to strike a balance between keeping your Mages safe and making sure your Skellies are doing maximum damage. So try to not use Bone Wall this bloack a lot of Skellies. Use Prison because you can target single enemies. Be more careful when using curses such as DV and LR. Your Skellies will want Amp so do not be afraid to override DV or LR with Amp. This might cost you a Mage but they can be resummoned.
     
  5. GIR

    GIR Banned

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    Personally I put 3 points into Mages, then let +skills do the rest.
     
  6. core1000

    core1000 IncGamers Member

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    Hmm, maybe I should Opt for a Middle build, 1 point in Mage + Revives, then some curses, the rest in Poison, then teleport all the way to BAAL.
     
  7. zaphette

    zaphette IncGamers Member

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    I agree with MM. Mages are very powerful and useful, but you have to know how to use them.

    I actually feel that the fire and lightning mages are the most powerful, and don't like cold very much (b/c of the shattering).

    If my guys get too mixed up, I TP out and right back in (don't have anything with teleport on it). This usually lets them sort it out. If I get too spread out and take fire from too many sides, I reatreat and reset.

    Once you understand that mages find a firing position and don't move from it, you can predict their behavior and learn to work with them.

    When everything is working together, with skellis in front and mages in back, you have and unstopable monster killing machine.
     
  8. core1000

    core1000 IncGamers Member

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    BUT then again Level 30 Poison Nova without synergies kills faster than Skeletal Mages.
     
  9. zaphette

    zaphette IncGamers Member

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    I'm not so sure...

    A level 30 PN with no synergy is only in the 600ish damage.

    Level 30 RM gives you like 13 mages each doing well over 100 damage (how much depends on which element).

    Of couse this assumes max SM which is a synergy...but the poster stated that SM was already maxed.
     
  10. GenXCub

    GenXCub IncGamers Member

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    Level 30 skellies ALONE (i.e. 1 in SM +10 skills)= 12 mages that can do either 73 poison each (876 dmg, too bad it's over 260 seconds), or 55-58 cold dmg (660-696), or 93-97 fire (1116-1164), or 25-151 lightning (300-1812)

    Now, lets make that level 30 Skeleton Mastery and level 30 Mages
    that's 12 mages that can do the following damage (the 12 mage total is in parentheses)
    217 psn over 450 seconds (2604), 146-149 cold (1752-1788), 256-260 fire (3072-3120), 44-405 lightning (528-4860).

    Not sure of the value of level 30 PN.
     
  11. core1000

    core1000 IncGamers Member

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    Poison Nova is Area of Effect Spell. Hits 75% of whatever that is on screen. Skelly Mages can only hit a few targets.
    So which is better now?
     
  12. core1000

    core1000 IncGamers Member

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    Unless you have as many Skeletal Mages as the enemies on screen,
    Else, Poison Nova still wins.
     
  13. zaphette

    zaphette IncGamers Member

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    I think a bit of empirical testing is in order.

    I have a poison necro at 65ish with out many points in synergys yet, and an 87 summoner with mages. If I only raise the mages and check out which one does better.

    I'm betting that I do better with the mages. But then all things aren't quite equal either.
     
  14. GenXCub

    GenXCub IncGamers Member

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    Poison nova can't absorb other monsters attacks, uses more mana, IS A LEVEL 30 SKILL...

    There are uses for each, but I'm of the opinion that Skeletal Mages are better for a summoner than poison nova with no synergies
     
  15. HarbingersOfSkulls

    HarbingersOfSkulls IncGamers Member

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    You take PN with no synergies, and give me 12 Mages with Mastery....and I'll show you a very happy pure summoner.

    PN with nothing to back it up, is just a waste of points.

    HoS
     
  16. Kyo

    Kyo IncGamers Member

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    Why does these comparison's keep croping up. ? It almost as daft as asking if superman and spiderman had a fight who would win.

    C'mon they are both entirely different skills that happen to use the same elemental attribute. Comparing stats is also silly as one is a direct offensive spell whereas the other is a minion.

    Poison Nova is good, Mages (for some) is good and each have their own pros and cons.

    p.s oh give me summoner anytime :p
     
  17. Mad Mantis

    Mad Mantis D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator

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    Spider-man would win. No doubt about it. Spider-man has Kryptonite. Besides Superman is just a sissy from outer space. He doesn't even have a green card.



    I am totally supporting this statement.
     
  18. Necrochild313

    Necrochild313 IncGamers Member

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    Lol MM.

    They'd both be pwned by SAM though

    I personally prefer Poison Nova or Corpse Explosion as a secondary, (if you play your cards right you can get 35 synergy points in on nova) but mages are a viable option too, just not my thing.
     
  19. Kyo

    Kyo IncGamers Member

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    LOL u LIE!, Superman would win because he wears his underpants upfront if that dun scare ol spidey, then his super bad breath would finish him off.

    He dun need a green card when he got a gold card :D

    Therefore MAX underpants, then bad breath synergy with a +3 gold card
    HAHA

    Seriously imo after maxing the standard skelemancer setup, max mages and then max CE does turn u into a SUPERHERO!
     
  20. Necrochild313

    Necrochild313 IncGamers Member

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    SAM would still pwn you

    Go go poison nova!
     

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