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Grand Charm, Grand Trade

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by Cerebron, Mar 3, 2004.

  1. Cerebron

    Cerebron IncGamers Member

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    Grand Charm, Grand Trade

    Finally! I found a Poisonmancer/Bonemancer who was as desperate as I was. We traded. I gave him 3 P&B charms and he gave me 4 Summoning Charms. Now I have +13 to my summoning tree, woo hoo! And I don't have any Soj or Annihilus. Is that good? Or that's so good! The 4 charms boost my skeletons from 12 to 14, and mages from 6 to 7. I can revive 20 monsters now, too. Unbelieveable. Some GC wholesale today.

    P.S. To the forum adminstrator: if you want to delete this thread, go ahead. I'm just so hyper now. :surprise:
     
  2. spencert

    spencert IncGamers Member

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    Sorry.... but i just have to burst your bubble. P&B GC is worth many times summoning GC. :scratch:
     
  3. Ifrit18

    Ifrit18 Banned

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    P/B = 2 summoning Gc on Uswest ladder
     
  4. Cerebron

    Cerebron IncGamers Member

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    Well, you know what, I know how much the charms worth so well, and I don't really care. I kinda hate people giving those strictly quantized values to all items. It more depends on what you need. Once I sold a Trang armor to a girl for 300k gold, how 's that? The reason was I needed to revive my merc and repair my Marrowwalks. P&B charms are useless to me, I'm a zookeeper. Yeah, you are saying I should find those guys who would give me 6 summon GC's. Let me tell ya I'm really tired of trading and now I have what I want finally.

    Also, let me tell ya how I get these charms from all the way to the beginning. I had some crappy uniques like one week ago. You drop those items on the ground in a Hell game, people won't even pick them up. I created Normal and Nightmare games and named them "BringNecroCharm." Some good trades and I got the P&B charms.

    You might say I was mean to the Nightmare and Normal people, but it's all voluntary. And most traders weren't 100% newbies, either. Those are their second characters and they knew the charms' values, too.
     
  5. Peacrusher

    Peacrusher IncGamers Member

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    Cerebron I'm not sure how to take you sometimes.... sometimes your make perfect sense othertimes you sound like a newbie... (no offense)

    Granted I would love to have the summoning charms for my summoner as well, but I'm surprised that you didn't have sufficient + skills before you had those charms.

    Currently I have +14 to summons tree with just gear. no soj/annis either. Granted some of my gear is elite but none of it is unattainable. In fact most I've found with my summoner.

    I feel your pain in trading. Thinks I consider valuable many people try to cheap out on the deal. I've only been lucky enough to find 1 skill charm so far on ladder. pally combat charm with no other mods... Maybe i can get a summoning charm or two for it... if not it'll go to my hammerdin....
     
  6. TheKbob

    TheKbob IncGamers Member

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    I havent lvled my skelemancer on ladder much but I just got an awesome deal in which I traded his homun (kinda poo %) + some Marrows (only +1, oooooo) for a Herald of Zakurum. That's a return of 5Xs its worth. It's already P diamond too, so it's going on my holy freeze zealot. Azurewrath and Herald of zak :drool: I really want a crescent moon phase, but I need Nightwing and Leviathan and Dracs still.

    On reg USeast I have summoning of vita for my reg summoner and summoning of max damage for my Commando.


    ~Kbob
     
  7. polarman

    polarman Banned

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    marrows and homun aint worth 5x heard imo
     
  8. Cerebron

    Cerebron IncGamers Member

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    You can call me a newb. Perfectly fine with that. I know some people in this forum have been playing D2 since the beta version in last century.

    As for trading, it can be pretty difficult to find the exact buyer. The battle.net trading system isn't that user-friendly. I don't like to use trading forums either because I can't make a time with the traders. My school schedule is super unpredictable. So everytime I see someone with the right stuff, I'll just trade. I really don't care about how much my stuff worths that much. That's why sometimes I can get really good stuff for offering garbage. Once I got a trang belt for offering 5 pTopazs, something like that. It's pretty good deal. I just want to point out that the economics in this game isn't purely price, market, and mathematics.
     
  9. jmprockstar

    jmprockstar IncGamers Member

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    Okay, after two attempts to post a reply, I'm about to go crazy (both time I forgot to open a link in a new window, thus deleting everything I said before :rant: )

    First, I would want people to read a post I made while ago about the state of the DII economy:

    http://www.rpgforums.net/showthread.php?t=137673

    This post, in summary, argues that DII has a barter economy, one based entirely on trading (with exception for eBay shoppers, who use American currency to buy items--I have nothing to say to those people, since their incapacity for reason is manifest). The basis for trading is use value and not market value. There is no market value because there is no reliable currency, no absolute value against which one can measure the value of an individual item. Without a reliable currency, one trades on the basis of one's need and needs of the others. The former is usually prior to the latter because the satisfaction of the needs of others does little to help one's own needs (thus, leading to exploition of noobs). Use value dominantes because the only way to have fun in this game is to win, and one cannot win with useless items. Scan the guides, and you will see that items are ranked by their use value.

    Without a market economy, statements like "p/b charms are 3x the value of summoning" and "HoZ is worth 5x the value of Items A and B" are meaningless. They are based on personal experiences in trading for others or for oneself. One may have encountered how others needs to use a specific item more often then others, and its scarcity leads to better trades for other items. However, the scarcity is based on a high use value (and, thus, an unwillingness to trade), and offers to acquire a desired and scarce item usually contain other useful items. This is the sign of a mature and health barter economy.

    Therefore, the only kind of bad trade is one where an individual trades a MORE useful item for a LESS useful item. Had Cerebron traded a Homunc and Leo for a summoning charm, then he clearly would have made a bad trade, since the sole use of a summoning charm is to increase skills, which both Homunc and Leo do, along with a host of other benefits. However, he traded items that were personally useless to him for items that were personally useful for him. It doesn't matter what someone else could have gotten for them; it doesn't even matter if he could have gotten a better trade had he waited a week. Cerebron's needs was as immediate as his capacity to satisfy it. Since he satisfied it, he made a good trade.

    Mistaking the DII for a market economy leads to a specific kinds of player: the rich noob. We have seen some posts from suspected rich noobs, recently, both of which earned deserved criticism.

    There was this guy, who obviously read some PvP and MF builds and thought that he could combine the most 1337 and make the ultimate character. What he actually got was what one poster said was a waste of the time (or money, in my opinion), since the use the guy would get out of those items all one character would never match the expense (time or money) to acquire them.

    The vice most despised in rich noobs is ignorance to the value of humbler exceptional and normal uniques (even set items! or, <gasp> rares!!!). We have just seen such a demonstration in this post. The "No one" here is really just this guy, since I am pretty sure anyone having read this forum for three days will have seen someone praise Blackbog's or communicate their excitement in finding one.

    I want to OT this topic into a new thread because all of this is obvious to me but not to others. I want to know why that is.

    :scratch:
     
  10. TheKbob

    TheKbob IncGamers Member

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    Not what I meant. I meant that herald is worth any where from 3Xs to 5Xs the value of the items I traded for it, as in I got an awesome deal...

    It's Herald not hard...

    ~Kbob
     
  11. Peacrusher

    Peacrusher IncGamers Member

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    Nicely put....

    And Cerebron... I'm not CALLING you a newbie, its just sometimes your messages come off as sounding naive'.... As I said.. No Offense...

    Keep playing... and enjoy your trades... next summoning charm is mine though :D
     
  12. chubbypuppy

    chubbypuppy IncGamers Member

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    I like summoning...

    If I had a P/B charm, I would trade it for a summoning charm, just because I like playing summoners and not PBers. Whatever makes you happy :D

    Wow +14. All of your skeletons are huge like Transformers? ;)
     
  13. TPMdm

    TPMdm IncGamers Member

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    You know what? Every time I trade I get "screwed", I get way less value for my junk a seasoned trader would consider healthy.

    Know what else? I don't care. I trade stuff I don't need for stuff I want. I don't like bartering and bickering over prices. I hate the trade channel and try to spend as little time there as I have to. I say good job Cerebron.
     
  14. Peacrusher

    Peacrusher IncGamers Member

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    I'll assume this is referring to me... but if not here's how I get +14 to summoning with out charms

    +2 Shako - Baal Drop
    +2 Maras - Eldritch Drop
    +2 Trang's - Given to me by NC (later I've found 2)
    +3 Golemlord head - Random monster drop
    Arm of Leoric for rest +2 Necro skills and +3 Raise skellies (right?)

    Now if I could find a couple of soj or bul kathos that would be sweet
    then add in some summons charms and I'll be GODLY.... but for now I'm happy
    Got a gull and homoc on weapon switch for full mf (around 400)
     
  15. Cerebron

    Cerebron IncGamers Member

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    Don't worry, buddy.

    Also, I start to believe that D2 is a really "deep" game. There are a lot to learn. For most other games, you play for half an hour and you are no longer a newb. My friend starts playing Unreal Tournament 2004 now. For that game you just take a gun and shoot at whatever moves. For D2, I can make a student-teaching class in my college called "Introduction to Diablo 2: Lord of Destruction." This class is 4 credits and requires Calculus in 3D and Differential Equations as prerequisites. :scratch:

    Jmprockstar, nice reply. Thank you.
     
  16. memememe173

    memememe173 IncGamers Member

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    now if 2summon=1PB does that mean 2curse=1 summon?
     
  17. Cerebron

    Cerebron IncGamers Member

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    2 summon = 1 PB
    2 curse = 1 summon
    2 PB = 1 curse

    lol
     
  18. patheticloser

    patheticloser IncGamers Member

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    I agree with Jmprockstar.

    You will also notice that in a real economy with a real currency the value of the currecy is not stable. The instability in the realitive prices of goods is abosrbed by the currency. Without a currency to store value the supply and demand (embodied by two people in one game at the same time) is nothing like the real world.

    But then I might just be a patheticloser noob.
     
  19. Lithan

    Lithan IncGamers Member

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    My first char on bnet was a WW druid. I was fortunate enough to find 2 P&B charms. One had +life on it (19 I think). I traded the +life for a Jalals mask (with really really low ed (and the guy wanted me to add)) and the other one for a fleshrender, again with really low ed. These guys knew what the charms were worth and they ripped a newbie in a nightmare game off. And I'll tell you I am pissed off as hell about it.

    I've made some really bad trades in my day, (Ist for marrowalks anyone). Now I'm a ****ing ****. Anyone tells me that the value of so and so item has gone down, I tell them to **** off. I'm sick of every bastard on bnet trying to rip me off.

    I'm glad you are happy with your trade, but don't try and justify ripping newbies off by saying that some of them knew the value of the charms. If they were in fact second characters, they could have gotten the items for themselves by picking them up in a hell game and kept their high valued charms for trades later.
     
  20. Cerebron

    Cerebron IncGamers Member

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    Don't know what to say. Some actions are good strategies but should not be promoted. The action I took should be classified as this type. I also know some one who keep clicking on Baal when the poor Baal is going to die. He also has a totally empty inventory so after Baal dies he picks up the drops in milliseconds. I believe a Book of D2 Ethics should be written, if it's going to do us any good at all.
     

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