Frost Zealot vs Regular Zealot (PvM)

[Garbad_the_Weak]

Frost Zealot vs Regular Zealot (PvM)

Everyone please comment:

I have decided to try my hand at the paladin and am going for a zealot. My dilemma however is i can't decide whether to go for the conventional Zealot or a frost one.

My main worry is that if i go for frosty that he won't be able to handle the whole game as i play solo and tend not to group at all. PvM all the way. The more conventional Zealot with Fanat should be the more straight forward choice as from what i have gathered should do awesome Physical damage and PI's ain't a worry and probably handle bosses better than frosty, is that right? Or am i wrong as frosty does Cold damage too so overall damage between the 2 builds ain't that big of a difference. On that basis i would swing to the frosty :scratch:

In my opinion, the regular zealot is a better choice overall.

My biggest problem I have with frost zealots is attack speed. Although its possible to reach excellent speed without fanatacism, its hard without top of the line gear. I find realistically my pvmers have a hard time getting over 50% ias without serious gear compromises (or tons of godly gear) which isn't fast enough zeal speed for my tastes. Without fanat, 50% Ias is like 11/6 frames on your most common weapons, compared to 8/5 with fanat.

PIs aren't a huge issue for me in hell. The most annoying ones by far are the ghosts in act 2, but I usually run around them anyway. I put 1 into vengance and thats enough for me. I tend to play start to finish with one or two friends working together tho, so our builds are usually complimentary.

Another issue is saftey. IMO, the damage from holy freeze is not a huge factor, its the slow that helps keep you alive. Frost zealots will get overwhelmed less often, which may matter in HC. I think a traditional zealot will have a big speed and damage advantage though. If this is a huge issue though, I would rather trade my might merc for a holy freeze merc.

I guess it primarily comes down to your weapon choice. If you have access to several level appropriate and fast hitting weapons, frost zealot is probably more fun (less traditional). If you don't, regular zealots are one of the best "starting" chars in terms of fighting anything well without uber godly gear. A few pgems and a lem or something should be enough gear to beat hell.

Garbad

P.S. As a example of some nice cheap gear that works well, here is my last zealots setup on ladder:

passion scourge
mosers with 2 pdiamonds
duriels shell
Ik gloves/belt
golbin toe boots
rockstopper
angelic ammy/ring
manald

I got the whole lot for less gems than I found getting to hell (other than the goblin and the scourge, which I made myself). Reasonable level reqs as well, so you can start using them right away.

Garbad

 

[Ozzer]

I guess you are talking bout frost zealot as if it was one with maxed sacrifice. Is there a really noticeable difference if i don't spend a single point on it? I'm making a pure tank frost zealot (which means i would max defiance as synergy instead of sacrifice) but i'm not really sure it worth it since i would already have maxed Holy Shield and we have the awesome holy freeze aura (not sure if sacrifice would be better for life leech and therefore better tank). I wouldbe forced to get Crushing blow gear and maybe it would sacrifice some defense. Who knows, maybe i could prefer to be able to solo a bit more easily and this could help (tho i wouldn't be sure if using Defiance or might mercenary, same for both builds)

I'm thinking about it all this time but i can't really decide. I'm still at time since i haven't spent points on defiance or sacrifice. Any recomendations or just stick with pure defense? Hard decision but needs to be made :spy:
This is definitively the char i love most and i don't wanna mess it =P

 

[Har-Megiddo]

My frost zealot is doing about 5.6k dmg right now, and I expect to be doing well over 6k when I put Chains of Honour on + 4 more offensive gcs (and perhaps 7k when I finish maxing zeal and sacrifice). Right now, I use this (btw, I hit 5 frames):

14% Nightwings w/ 3/5 cold, planning on trading for a 15 w/ 5/5 eventually
25% maras
280% Heavens Light with 24ed/15% ias jewel in socket one, 25ed/15% ias in socket two
Duress Dusk Shroud
Um'd HoZ
Lava Gouts (I'm saving up magic Vampirebone gloves to craft for 20% ias, life leech, 10% crushing blow gloves w/ life)
5% BK
20 Dex 200 ar Raven
Arachnid Mesh
Gores
18/11/10 Anni
6 Offensive GCs

Defense is less of a zealot, attack rating isn't bad, but I have to pump dex to the detriment of life, which is about 1200 by lvl 84.

Dmg is and will be superior to a zealot with fanat, speed is 5 frames, where a zealot with have 4 most likely, defense and ar is lower, but the frostie has the big benefit of slowing targets.

 

[Kyo]

..Dmg is and will be superior to a zealot with fanat, speed is 5 frames, where a zealot with have 4 most likely, defense and ar is lower, but the frostie has the big benefit of slowing targets.

i could be misreading this but your basically saying total damage output for your frost zealot will be higher than that of a conventional zealot with the exact same gear?

 

[xts3]

All you need is a lightsabre or some +20 IAS over the normal "very fast weapon speed" to make zeal fast enough... I traded a pair of wartravellers for one and haven't regretted it. Although I have atma's scarab (unique lv60 amulet) that casts level 2 amplify damage it strips physical immunes of their immunity, so if I ever encounter dual immunes I just have to wack them until the curse goes off and let me tell you amp damage owns bosses and ghosts pretty hardcore esp with a nice melee merc decent equipment once the curse goes off. You don't need more then 20% IAS over 'very fast' weapon speed as a frost zealot. Unless the lightsabre has a higher weapon speed then "very fast" as its base weapon speed... I doubt it though since it's just a phaseblade. The Atlantean and heavens light are decent weaps as well although they'll need some shael / IAS jewel support.

 

[Har-Megiddo]

i could be misreading this but your basically saying total damage output for your frost zealot will be higher than that of a conventional zealot with the exact same gear?

im saying if the respective class uses the most elite set up they can come up with for pvm, the frostie's dmg will be higher

btw, i traded for another offensive gc and my dmg jumped another 200 pts, so 7k may be in sight

 

[Har-Megiddo]

All you need is a lightsabre or some +20 IAS over the normal "very fast weapon speed" to make zeal fast enough... I traded a pair of wartravellers for one and haven't regretted it. Although I have atma's scarab (unique lv60 amulet) that casts level 2 amplify damage it strips physical immunes of their immunity, so if I ever encounter dual immunes I just have to wack them until the curse goes off and let me tell you amp damage owns bosses and ghosts pretty hardcore esp with a nice melee merc decent equipment once the curse goes off. You don't need more then 20% IAS over 'very fast' weapon speed as a frost zealot. Unless the lightsabre has a higher weapon speed then "very fast" as its base weapon speed... I doubt it though since it's just a phaseblade. The Atlantean and heavens light are decent weaps as well although they'll need some shael / IAS jewel support.

heavens light needs 65% ias for 5 frames, which is easy with 2 sockets

 

[Har-Megiddo]

quick update: i added 3 more offensive aura gcs to have a total of 10 in my inventory and i do 6666 dmg.

only way up now is chains of honour, replace um in hoz with 5/5 cold and changing 17/5 nightwing for 20/5, then lvling up to 95, where dmg increasing skills are all maxed.

if anyone does more dmg with 4 or 5 frame attack, please say so here

 

[Kyo]

im saying if the respective class uses the most elite set up they can come up with for pvm, the frostie's dmg will be higher

btw, i traded for another offensive gc and my dmg jumped another 200 pts, so 7k may be in sight

Your saying higher damage, are we talking marginal or we taking a good chunk more. Sorry just want to have a good scope on this. Remember cold resist comes into a factor in hell. I dunno if the same going to apply to Physical resistance

Thx

Kyo

 

[Har-Megiddo]

Your saying higher damage, are we talking marginal or we taking a good chunk more. Sorry just want to have a good scope on this. Remember cold resist comes into a factor in hell. I dunno if the same going to apply to Physical resistance

Thx

Kyo

I'd like for zealots to say their dmg and set up - this way we can tell what can do the most.

 

[Kyo]

I'd like for zealots to say their dmg and set up - this way we can tell what can do the most.

erm sorry i am not following what your saying? Your sentance structure is hard for me to understand *apologies*

Been doing rough calculations. I am not a expert in the mechinics of the game so my numbers could be way off but at least it gives me a rough idea. Please note i am only concentrated on damage so i am excluding bonuses from godly equip etc.

For sake of arguement say the paladin does 100 damage with both builds pretty much complete

Conventional Zealot
===============

100dmg + 336% (20slvl Zeal) = 436 + (20slvl Fanta 373% * 436 = 1627) = 2062 (approx) Pure Physical dmg

Here we dun need to worry about AR and with added bonus to weapons speed from fanat. Your probably going to have max Holy Shield as well so max block and so many pluses here.

Frost Zealot
=========

100dmg + 336% (Zeal) = 436 + (added 1000 cold dmg (approx) = 1436 dmg + 200 cold dmg from HF Aura field = 1636 Total Cold/physical damage.

Damage is a little less but still fairely high as it combination of cold and physical. No maxed Holy shield (as i chose all offensive Frosty) and AR issue as well so going to have to rely on merc or equip. Pluses are obviously all mobs slowed 54% as well as the HF aura actively giving off 200 cold aura dmg. Not sure if that per second or just a once off damage once the aura is on.

I am fairely sure i have probably miscalculated because i am unfamiliar in the way the game mechanics are calculated but like i said it at least gives me some figures to play with so before anyone totally annilates me with the right calculation of just how wrong i am, in short - *i know" so go easy on me pls

Kyo

 

[Har-Megiddo]

As + skills increase on a frostie, their damage goes up at a higher rate tho.

 

[Kyo]

As + skills increase on a frostie, their damage goes up at a higher rate tho.

That maybe but we are talking about the core builds here nothing about tweaking it godly gear to slvl 30+. On the basis of builds and syngery alone with max skills.

i take it my calculations are somewhat in the right direction due to the lack of response. (i'd be shocked if i am right). Please if anyne can put out how itshould be calculated i be much appreicated.

 

[donvitotm]

have a lvl 90 zealot.

has
Maxed sacrifice, zeal, Fanaticism, holy shield.

My gear.
Veil of Steel Spired Helm.
Guardian Angel Templar Coat
Herald Of Zakarum
Sandstorm Trek boots.
Thundergod's Vigor belt.
The Mahim-Oak Curio ammy
raven frost ring

Schaefer's Hammer

stats aproxamate
235 str
179 dex
335 vit

With this grear i do 1400-4180 dam..

Becouse of the wep the zeal does not hit as fast as a light saber or a b star but it give 1700 more dam per hit so i like it. I still have fast weps on the switch..

so if this were a frosty I would be hitting harder ?

 

[Milamber]

Well here is my own Fanatical Zealot - damage is in the 200-4500 range...not including and DS

Voltan
clvl: 84 Fanatical Zealot

Skills
Sacrifice: 20
Zeal: 20
Holy Shield: 19
Fanatacism: 20

Items
Crown of Ages - Um x 2
Highlord's Wrath
Stormlash
Guardian Angel - Um
Exile
Dracul's - shortly to be LoH
Thundergod's Vigor
Gore Rider
Ravenfrost x 2

 

[Har-Megiddo]

I dismantled my frostie for mf gear to eventually rebuild for player vs player - but highest I got was 6.8k dmg - and that was without fully maxing zeal, sacrifice, and not using a 5/5 cold hoz and chains of honour.

 

[Kyo]

Someone will probably correct me if i am wrong. But i always assumed in hell all resist to fire/cold/light/poison mobs have a higher tolerance thus higher resistance. Therefore if your focusing your cold skills in this case your no doubt going to need something lower resist to make your dmg more power.

However the way i see it is that it doesn't apply this for physical resistance as that where the scaled up HP for mobs comes into play. So your probably find that conventional zealots are going to have a bit more "hmph" in their zeal.

Building one now and put it to the test. Thanks for those who put in their input.

Kyo

 

[Garbad_the_Weak]

That would be awful tedious and expensive. I think cold zealots are a fun idea, but a cold merc + regular zealot does everything at least as well and more, in particular if you are poor.

Garbad

 

[Har-Megiddo]

I myself am working on coming up with a PvP varient that can passive kill lower life characters (sorc in particular) while also melee duel along with barbs, sins, druid, and fanatical zealots.

 

[xts3]

I think no one should neglect that the cold zealot with a point in vengeance and even without +skill equipment can do a higher amount of damage (more then an 'untwinked' fanaticism zealot and it only costs only a single point in vengence. Since vengeance gets synergy from resist cold and savlation (which you took anyway for the syngery with holy freeze) you can use both holyfreeze and vengeance *at the same time* for killer damage.

I'm really thinking that Holy freeze avenger would be a very viable build because holyfreeze and vengeance both share syngergies with resist cold and salvation. Comments anyone? Also in hell as long as you have a merc at the same level as you (I use a barb /w normal equip) my frosty does fine by himself against cold immunes. Also if you can trade for an atma's scarab or carry a kris of level 5 lifetap (you can buy them in shops in nm and hell) you're home free. Pretty much any melee'er paladin build is homefree with a lifetap kris on switch or if you're rich an exile or draculs, but IMHO being in control of who and what gets lifetap is equally as valuable as it is on these other items.