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Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

Discussion in 'Classic' started by EagleEntek, Apr 28, 2008.

  1. EagleEntek

    EagleEntek IncGamers Member

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    Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    Got him to lvl 65: stats as follows:

    17 frenzy
    15 bo
    10 doubleswing
    8 natural resistances
    10 mastery
    cant remember rest off top of my head...

    has about 1100 life, 800 odd damage either weapon according to stats screen, and about 765 defense.

    IN nightmare and hell acts, am noticing hes taking ALOT of damage from monsters - had been using stun warcry to stop monsters attacking but now getting ripped apart by archers etc. Not quite sure why - had no problems with zealer paladin (2 hand sword) at these levels with alot lower life and defense figures.

    Still tired from late night and cant see what the prob is with him - any thoughts? Considering a rebuild - any ideas on good frenzy barb? Ive got 2 very fast 120 dmg battlehammers and wanted to give it a go ya see :laugh:
     
  2. grShaman

    grShaman IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    Well, since the problem is about the damage you receive, we should consider 3 things: Health, Defense and Resistances.

    Your Hit Points seem to be ok, so I doubt that's the problem.
    ...You know. Check your resistances and get a good Ornate.
     
  3. goomba

    goomba IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    1100 life after BO? if that's the case, that's horrific.

    for what it's worth, there's a reason there aren't a lot of frenzy barbs at higher levels.
     
  4. WarlockCC

    WarlockCC Diablo Classic Moderator

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    My mace frenzy (40 ias battle hammers) has 1366 life before BO.
    My older, somewhat less successful sword frenzy barb has 916 and for reasons I can't remember, 210 str.
    My axe frenzy barb doesn't have frenzy synergized, because he's mainly a double thrower.
     
  5. HegemonKhan

    HegemonKhan IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    first question i have is, what is doing damage to u? phys. or elem. damage? if your getting killed by elem. damage, obviously u need more (dont ahve enough) resists to keep u alive. resists can be gotten from gear or nat res barb skill. if u r dying from phys. damage than u need more def, life, or life leech. 800 defense is useless. the way defense works is u go all out and have such a high def that it actually makes monsters miss at a high percent or u have no def. there's really not a middle between the two.

    the frenzy skill and barb builds using it:

    the difficulty of frenzy barb builds:

    *warning: frenzy barbs FEAR monsters that they cant life leech from!!!! BEWARE UNDEAD OR WHATEVER MONSTERS THAT U CANT LIFE LEECH FROM!**

    FRENZY IS AN OFFENSIVE SKILL AND BUILD. u use two weapons so no shield, u already down in defense from not being able to use shield. its synergies uses up sk pts so u dont have much availible for defensive skills like Iron skin, shout, bo. maybe u can find a skill placement that allows u to ahve good def but that takes skill if it can be done. since u r already at a disavantage in the def department u might as well use frenzy to its fullest and hope your offensive will be able to serve as your def.

    a powerful offensive is your ultimate defense:

    frenzy is not about defense. its about offensive. speed of walk/running and super fast hits doing good damage, leaching back easily all the damage your getting hit with. as long as you r swinging (frenzy-slashing monsters) u swing forever, leeching back life lost way faster than it can kill u.

    the key to frenzy is using your fast movement (walk/run) to quickly get in the face of monsters and hit them so hard n so fast along with life leech that while doing so u r invincible due to the speed of your attacks and the life leech from the damage u do.

    also, if u cant do this there is the really awesome synergy skill taunt. it is incredibly powerful. but this slows down your killing speed as u have to taunt monsters FIRST, compared to jsut rushing at them at frenzy full speed and slashing away.

    about taunt skill:

    it turns the most deadly monsters (EXCEPT obv mage lords in cs) into phys. melee damage wimps. having problems with ranged phys or elem monsters? taunt them and no more deadly ranged phys or elem attacks from them. having problems with vemon lords? taunt them and no more inferno skill fire breath against u. taunt is super powerful...it jsut doesnt go though with the speed of frenzy...but if u cant frenzy mosnters...than theres taunt...and soon as u got monsters taunted...THAN u frenzy them *grins*

    how to make offensive frenzy buildwork:

    0a. how frenzy weapon speed works: frenzy attack speed is determined by ONLY the main weapon's speed. main weapon: the weapon u put on first, it should be in YOUR BARB's RIGHT HAND (most people r right handed making that their weapon hand and the weaker left hand uses a shield and bliz based its game on this to be realistic)

    0b. u really must/should have both weapons be the same range however. if u can't, than at least have the main weapon (the weapon u strike first with) be the SHORTER (and FASTER) range of weapon so that the next longer range weapon will hit monster. if u had the longer range weapon hit first than the 2nd shorter range weapon will be out of range and not hit monster(s).....

    1. CBF (cannot be frozen) is a must!
    2. the fastest, highest damage, longest range weapons u can get. i'm not sure though if having a faster weapon is better or if having a longer range (1h naga=best range at 3 but slower speed). the naga (or if there's other range 3 1h weapons) at range 3 is really important for hitting as many monsters as u can for that vital life leeching.
    3. ways to make monsters' (attacks) slower. like with cold damage on weapons or gear (if u can).
    4. a balance between life and damage (life leech) (more damage=more life leech)(more damage=soon'er dead monsters=dead monsters cant kill u). both life and damage+life leech is what u have to keep u alive as def probably isnt an option.
    5. 30% fast walk/run boots + increased speed skill (if u can spare skill points)
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    3 types of frenzy builds as i can tell:

    1. offensive frenzy builds (get at least 1 pt into berserk and use berserk for its bonuses, since we already not using def, its def penalty doesnt matter and the incr. damage from berserk will give a boost to frenzy):
    1A. pure phys damage build. max or nearly max str and go all out damage n life leech with no pts into vit for life. max frenzy, double swing, taunt, weapon mast, than rest into inc speed or nat res, NO BO.
    1B. CB/OW damage build. min str req for gear/weapons. u use CB/OW on weapons/gear for damage and frenzy's fast attack speed allowing u to not wast pts into taunt and double swing since u dont need their frenzy damage synergy and allowing u to put all or nearly all into vit for life. max frenzy (for its bonuses), bo (for huge life), weapon mast (mainly for AR, and also the extra damage if u need) or NO weapon mast (if u dont need the AR, damage), than nat res or inc speed. after u have frenzy "up'ed" use double swing for its fast attack speed. u probably dont need frenzy's bigger damage since we r using CB/OW for damage so double swing's faster attack is better than frenzy after u got your attack speed boosted to max from frenzy.

    **if u meet phys immune monsters, or wanna use elem. damage instead of doing phys damage, than simply equip socket weapons with elem damage gems in them.**

    2. defensive builds (do NOT use berserk though 1 pts into for its synergy bonus if u want is okay)(using berserk defeats our purpose of defense):
    2a. get enough damage to kill (from skills) than the rest of skill pts into defensive skills for defense. min str for weapons and high defense gear (ornate=170 str) and to kill than rest into vita. max frenzy, than if need more damage to kill add pts into other offesive skills (like weapon mast, taunt, double swing), than max defensive skills shout n iron skin, than remaining sk pts into bo and/or nat res, than maybe 1 pt into inc speed or berserk. get as high a defense as u can from gear n skills while still being able to kill (remember, your defense will be less due to not being able to use a shield due to frenzy's 2 weapon usage).

    ****warning about using warcry for stun: without FCR, war cry is awfully slow to cast, which is not good if u are relying on its stun to keep u alive.****

    3. skill builds (warcry=for its stun): u use warcry and its stun as an alternative for defense. once monsters r stunned, u r completely safe from monsters. the problem is getting off the warcry and stunning them but warcry DOES work on all mosnters (except bosses). u will also have to max war cry for its increased stun length. however, 20 pts into war cry is better than 80 pts into defensive skills (shout, iron skin, BO, nat res). rest of stuff can be used for an offensive frenzy build. only difference is that u might wanna/need to get some FCR on gear as well for warcry.
     
  6. grShaman

    grShaman IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    The guy above me, well, he seems to be a nice guy. I would never write something that long, for someone I don't even know. Greetings :p
     
  7. HegemonKhan

    HegemonKhan IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    i know, i'm too nice and too helpful, and being too nice does seem to be a real concept/issue, though i dont think so:p i never turn down a chance to help someone on diabo 2 or real life. just the person i became as i grew up based on personal experiences in real life. i'm not a normal selfish n arrogant american like most of my american peers. i'm humble and helpful which is unusual with most americans that i know

    i like to type..a lot, if u hadn't noticed yet:D

    also the few frenzy guides i've seen don't really go into too much depth or explanation of frenzy and frenzy builds. frenzy isnt very popular or powerful on classic, so most of the guides are LOD guides and they mainly only talk about elite LOD gear with very little about the frenzy skill and the frenzy build itself.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2008
  8. WarlockCC

    WarlockCC Diablo Classic Moderator

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    You made a healer and you're helpful around the forum, seems like good traits to me. :)
    My highest char is a healer, because I just like playing those.



     
  9. HegemonKhan

    HegemonKhan IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    thank u, i still love diablo 2, and wanted to finally contribute and increase some discussion and dialogue and more build discussions. i do know diablo 2 is pretty ancient now, especially classic d2...but i still love it despite its age, with many things still to discover and undeerstand and try within d2.

    i have made a healer, but the holy bolt paladin i was talking about was not a healer...holy bolt "sniper" for picking off the obl lords in hell cs, people ahve to really try it. think about this: a ranged ~10k (10,000) damage holy bolt (single target and undead only, though) only costing 3 mana per cast...10k damage for only 3 mana cost...its really fun to kill seis or the obl lords that every hates due to curses in 1-3 hits..if hammerdins dont get in the way:p
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    a quick off-subject rant on hammerdins:

    holy bolt doesnt compare to blessed hammers...NOTHING does..hamemrdins need to be seriously, even fatally, nerfed...(like having the hammers only hit undead or concentration does NOT boast hamemr damge *grins*)(no offense to hamerdins out there, but when there's 100 hammerdins for any other build some one makes..it gets a lil boring-anoying. its a great build for new players. a skill that hits EVERY monster (except 1 though its completely out of the way and insignificant.) is great for new players. BUT for us veterans, we like having to deal with skills that do NOT work on every mosnter and adapt to this challenge.)
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------
    but i have made both a healer/medic (defensive holy bolt and prayer user) and a holy bolt sniper (offensice holy bolt user and NO prayer).

    the healers, suport, defensive, weird, weak builds are a nice change from the powerhouse cookie cutter offensive builds. nice to try different stuff and see and play in a different way giving the game a whole new life:D

    yes, DAMAGE IS KING (as this popular and true saying goes), but going against this policy brings out a whole new game and challenge and is quite fun:D
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2008
  10. deichsela

    deichsela IncGamers Member

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    terminerms

    a.k.a. "Priest"



     
  11. EagleEntek

    EagleEntek IncGamers Member

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    Re: Frenzy barb - what am i doing wrong?

    ^^ fully agree with paladin nerfing tbh - cept the bolts thing that rocks bells :D

    oh - rebuilt the barb - seems to work alot better now even though i appear to be using the same gear and stats - although i did max frenzy first and the mastery so maybe its because im hitting more and killing faster....

    And who doesnt love to get so involved in Dia that they wanna help people? Im sure theres loads of people out there in the community that just want to help out and not duel all the time (sarcasm) lol you guys are a rare breed indeedy :thumbsup:
     

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